acp

Re: acp

James Laidlaw — Fri, 05 Aug 2011 22:55:10 GMT

We just use calmivet at 0.1 mL per 10 Kg (as a premed with vetergesic). So most cats get around 0.03 to 0.06 mL depending on fatness index. Not rocket science to draw up that much. It is only licensed for IM use though... Has worked fine SQ for those that weren't aware of this. Anecdotally obviously.

Re: acp

Claire Fisher — Fri, 05 Aug 2011 22:47:01 GMT

[quote user="plantagenet"]

What would you use to dilute the higher concentrations with?

I have always found acp+vet excellent but do use other premeds for brachycephalics and sight hounds.

I think the safest anaesthetics are often what you are used to, so I don't really want to change.

[/quote]

We dilute 1 part calmivet with 1.5 parts sterile water to make 2mg/ml.

Re: acp

plantagenet — Fri, 05 Aug 2011 22:07:16 GMT

What would you use to dilute the higher concentrations with?

I have always found acp+vet excellent but do use other premeds for brachycephalics and sight hounds.

I think the safest anaesthetics are often what you are used to, so I don't really want to change.

Re: acp

Mark Hedberg — Fri, 05 Aug 2011 14:37:07 GMT

What, did you ring him and say his cat had been turned into a road pizza?

Re: acp

Alex Gough — Fri, 05 Aug 2011 14:33:35 GMT

[quote user="Anthony Todd"]

Used to flatten, literally, the occasional boxer which was a bit disconcerting I must admit.......

[/quote]

Literally? Reminds me of some years ago when an RTA cat came in DOA, and we found the owner from the microchip. Asked him to come and collect the cat, and he brought a pizza box to pick it up in!

Alex

Re: acp

Mark Hedberg — Fri, 05 Aug 2011 14:27:45 GMT

I once did 23 ops in a day at a neutering clinic in the Middle east - Xylazine and ketamine all the way. Worked fine. So no, I don't mind using xylazine either. :)

Re: acp

Clive Ansell — Fri, 05 Aug 2011 13:08:58 GMT

Actually yes, I have used Xylazine in the past and found to be an effective premed in cats. I suppose Dexmedetomidine and Medetomidine are the newer alpha2 agonists on the block, as are supposed to be more receptor specific etc.

Re: acp

Martin Atkinson — Fri, 05 Aug 2011 12:41:43 GMT

How about xylazine? Cheap, effective sub cut on its own as a premed or mixed with Torbs for some analgesia and makes cats vomit the breakfast their owner (allegedly) didn't give them! Some people don't like it but I've never had a safety issue and it is reversible with atipamezole.

Re: acp

Anthony Todd — Fri, 05 Aug 2011 08:47:19 GMT

I always found acp just fine for blocked cats, on its own with local locally.

Used to flatten, literally, the occasional boxer which was a bit disconcerting I must admit.......

And a permanent prolapse of the Queen's stallion's penis was widely rumoured.

Re: acp

Alasdair Mathieson — Thu, 04 Aug 2011 22:34:30 GMT

[quote user="Mark Hedberg"]

Taunting murphy, eh? :p

This could be a great time to discover the magic that is medetomidine+butorphanol. The premed dose is great in both cats and dogs, very smooth induction, less propofol use, excellent analgesia, and no, I don't sell the stuff.

I've never been an enormous fan of acp+ bup; I find the calming and sedation unreliable (in depth and duration.)

Calmivet (5mg/kg) is another one I don't like - even compensating for the higher dose, it seems to club them over the head overmuch when it does actually sedate.

[/quote]

Couldn't agree more, we don't miss acp at all.

Re: acp

Amanda Nicholls — Thu, 04 Aug 2011 21:25:54 GMT

[quote user="Clive Ansell"]

I have always thought ACP to be overrated as a pre med, certainly in cats it seems to be pretty much a waste of time.

[/quote]

I agree, I thought I would miss ACP but I have had much better GA inductions without it. I use much the same drugs as you Clive and add low doses of ketamine for most cats.

Re: acp

Clive Ansell — Thu, 04 Aug 2011 21:19:30 GMT

I have always thought ACP to be overrated as a pre med, certainly in cats it seems to be pretty much a waste of time. acp/vetergesic seems to be the latest "gold standard" (I hate that phrase) at the moment. I like medetomidine as a pre med, in combination with either butorphanol, buphrenorphine, or morphine - depending up on the case - in healthy animals with no signs of cardiovascular compromise. In older or sick patients I prefer Diazepam or Midazolam with an opiate.

one can always dilute calmivet to give a 2mg/ml solution I suppose. Prior to the old acp becoming unavailable some practices used to dilute horse acp (10mg/ml) 5:1 anyway.

Re: acp

Mark Hedberg — Thu, 04 Aug 2011 20:56:17 GMT

Taunting murphy, eh? :p

I've never been an enormous fan of acp+ bup; I find the calming and sedation unreliable (in depth and duration.)

Calmivet (5mg/kg) is another one I don't like - even compensating for the higher dose, it seems to club them over the head overmuch when it does actually sedate.

Re: acp

Helen Wallace — Thu, 04 Aug 2011 20:42:48 GMT

No as far as I know. We're using the calmivet but its a real pain drawing up those tiny doses.