Shall we strike her off?

Re: Shall we strike her off?

Niall Taylor — Wed, 23 Mar 2011 07:33:04 GMT

[quote user="An On MRCVS"] Can you imagine what has she been doing at work ?(she works with social services)[/quote]

Absolutely, it would be awful if someone let slip to her employers what she'd been up to.

Niall

Re: Shall we strike her off?

Niall Taylor — Wed, 23 Mar 2011 07:31:17 GMT

[quote user="An On MRCVS"]

I just feel let down by the police!!!

I am sure that if she had impersonated a Doctor to obtain prescription drugs illigally at least she would have had al formal caution( not to mention that she commited fraud taking advantage-and money- of a charity that supports animals in need)

[/quote]

This is an appaling situation and the woman is treating you and her animal very poorly but the police really aren't going to be bothered about someone obtaining a tube of eye ointment by deception and I have to say I'm happy with that. They and the rest of the legal system really have more important things to be doing with their time. They've had a word with this person, hopefully that should suffice.

Impersonating a doctor is a far more serious crime which I'm sure would have been dealt with much more assertively by the law.

Niall

Re: Shall we strike her off?

An On MRCVS — Tue, 22 Mar 2011 16:26:29 GMT

[quote user="Hannah Wynne Richards"]Firstly, why did the woman change to you? [/quote]

Her story, I remember, was that she lived now-she moved- closer to us (actually within walking distance) and we were more convenient. So not suspicious at all.

[quote user="Hannah Wynne Richards"]why didn't the previous practice forward the history ?[/quote]

I don´t know. But we did request it, althoug it was our fault not to chase it up. I supose we had enough info from the Blue Cross to carry on the treatment. We did phenobarb levels and a general profile and continued dispensing epiphen. The eye problem, as I recall, wasn´t given much importance by the previous vets: "It should be ok" or "nothing to worry about" or something along thouse lines was the owners version of the previous vets coments on the eye condition, so I assuemed then that the eye problem have evolved significantly since last visit to previous vets a few months before. The dog was then 18 months old or so.

[quote user="Hannah Wynne Richards"]Thirdly, the bit of an insurence form which says who to pay is usually in the sedtion which the owner is supposed to fill in, so was it not a mistake, but deliberate fraud which resulted in the cheque going to the owner ?[/quote]

I don´t know exactly how that happened as the form was deal with by the referral practice.I suppose they ment they didn´t double check that point when they filled their bit in the form

I have had a word with the other senior staff today and we have decided to strike her off, but we need to make sure we only send clinical notes to the new practice-see VDS advise- if they request records. I feel sorry for them but I feel uncomfortable with a client I don´t trust at all. Hopefully the "talk" with the policeman will be enough to deter her fome doing anything similar

[quote user="Bob Russell"]Write to Blue Cross (somebody senior, in confidence) describing precisely what has been happening, sticking strictly to facts with no opinions. [/quote]

I think I am going to do thatÑ I will write to someone senior in the Blue Cross and explain we have to strike her off, but we are concerned about the dog. They will have to keep an eye on future claims and "take care" of the next practice.

I just feel let down by the police!!!

Can you imagine what has she been doing at work ?(she works with social services)

Re: Shall we strike her off?

Hannah Wynne Richards — Tue, 22 Mar 2011 15:33:30 GMT

3 questions spring to mind

Firstly, why did the woman change to you? Did her previous practice do something wrong, did she hear you were very good, or has she already been given her marching orders once ? The rest of the story makes the third highly probable !

Secondly, why didn't the previous practice forward the history ? Do they have something medical to hide, were they simply a little inefficient and forgetful, or is there something like "bad payer " or "forged scrip " on the record ?

Thirdly, the bit of an insurence form which says who to pay is usually in the sedtion which the owner is supposed to fill in, so was it not a mistake, but deliberate fraud which resulted in the cheque going to the owner ?

Sorry, more questions than answers-pity the police do not take their duties more seriously

Wynne

Re: Shall we strike her off?

Bob Russell — Tue, 22 Mar 2011 13:54:17 GMT

[quote user="Evelyn Barbour-Hill"]

Here's a suggestion. Shoot it down if you wish.

Blue Cross obviously have a continuing concern for the dog: that is why they are paying for treatment. Write to Blue Cross (somebody senior, in confidence) describing precisely what has been happening, sticking strictly to facts with no opinions. Tell them you feel unable to keep providing services to this person, but that you are worried that the woman will not obtain service elsewhere. Then I imagine they will take steps to somehow obtain a good future for the dog, but it will not be your problem.

[/quote]

Seems a good way of dealing with it. The issue is not financial but welfare so nobody can be unfairly criticised for taking this action. Falsification of documentation for prescriptions especially controlled drugs is a criminal offence so I would talk to the VMD especially if the on-line pharmacy(s) is not taking proper steps to ensure prescriptions are genuine. It may put their (as yet not issued) licences at risk!

Re: Shall we strike her off?

Evelyn Barbour-Hill — Mon, 21 Mar 2011 23:25:42 GMT

Here's a suggestion. Shoot it down if you wish.

Re: Shall we strike her off?

Laurence Webb — Mon, 21 Mar 2011 23:11:43 GMT

There's obviously a breakdown in trust between you and the client (ie you don't trust her!) so you've got good enough grounds to recommend she seeks the services of another practice in the future.

Would you choose to take her on as a client again? If not then I wouldn't feel obliged to keep her either!

I'd speak to the VDS for advice about sending clinical notes that could prevent her getting veterinary services elsewhere - there was something in their last newsletter about histories that contain financial details. One option may be to print out the history and black out comments that relate to non-medical subjects. Don't know if a covering note to that effect would be permissible as I'd also feel bad about offloading a client who is willing to lie and commit fraud.

If the Blue Cross are paying for treatment they may still be the legal owners of the dog so may be able to seize it back, but I don't know on what basis they rehome/foster animals. If not, I doubt they're going to be willing to keep forking out for spurious bills made up by the owner as an ongoing cash cow.

Sad though it may be for the dog, I think she's shot herself in the foot with this.

Re: Shall we strike her off?

Mark Hedberg — Mon, 21 Mar 2011 23:10:54 GMT

I'm not sure which is more insulting - the fact she tried to (badly) forge a prescription, or the credit she gives your intelligence! :D

Re: Shall we strike her off?

Evelyn Barbour-Hill — Mon, 21 Mar 2011 23:09:14 GMT

[quote user="An On MRCVS"]

but is it better to keep her as client and make sure the dog has the necessary treatment? At least we know now thar we have to be carefull with her, bue she may take advantage of a new practice?

[/quote]

It depends how heroic and self-sacrificing you want to be. Are you a business or a charity? I wouldn't agonise, I'd sack her, because I couldn't be doing with the worry. But what I would do is not very relevant. Only you can decide.

[quote user="An On MRCVS"]If the Blue Cross is paying for the treatment, whose property the dog is in a legal sense? Can they take him away from her?[/quote]

I don't know. It would depend entirely on what contract was made when she obtained the dog. It's not really your concern. However if I were you I would make the Blue Cross fully aware of everything that's gone on.

[quote user="An On MRCVS"]Shall the RCVS be contacted again now we know that the police hasn't even given her a formal caution ?[/quote]

I'm not quite sure what exactly it has to do with Belgravia House. What's your concern here?

I wonder why the police took no further action. Was it because the attempt at fraud was so crude and pathetic that they thought she just needed a good talking-to? Perhaps she is already well known to the police.