Commuting

Re: Commuting

Clive Ansell — Wed, 09 Dec 2009 20:06:16 GMT

When I last worked for them It was indeed one vet in for the long haul of 15 hours. Often you would get to go to bed, but not always in a busy clinic.

As far as I can tell, according to the regulations it is an average of 8 hours per night shift, calculated over a 17 week reference period, which can be extended to 26 weeks in certain occupations for example where "a job needs round-the-clock staffing (for example, hospital work)" .

Also, "If your night work involves special hazards or heavy physical or mental strain, you can't be made to work more than eight hours in any 24-hour period" Whether working 15 hours without a break, plus travelling to and from home, in a busy emergency clinic constitutes a "special hazard" or "mental strain" is a matter of interpretation I guess ??

Re: Commuting

Julian Earl — Wed, 09 Dec 2009 17:53:26 GMT

[quote user="Clive Ansell"]

I am not sure but I think night workers are legally limited to 8 hour shifts, plus workers should have 11 hours off in every 24 under the European time directive. 15 hours is a long haul though.

[/quote]

So how do Vets Now vets work then? Do they have several vets on duty each night? Obviously it depends on the size of the clinic, but I thought they just had one per night and they just worked three or four nights per week?

Re: Commuting

listhestar — Wed, 09 Dec 2009 17:19:47 GMT

[quote user="Clive Ansell"]

I think you probably need 2 years of good experience under your belt before becoming a locum, although it depends on you, and the positions taken. A locum in a multi vet practice with good support is easier than a sole charge position where the owner is out of the country.

[/quote]

Very true. Well its all given me food for thought. I don't like talking 'shop' with my friends but nice to know 50hrs is unreasonable (thanks for the input from the bosses on that one- different side of story but same answer!).

Will look into changing areas then (damn the recession!) or maybe locuming (thanks Clive). Maybe I'm having a (very) early midlife crisis!

Cheers everyone

Lisa

Re: Commuting

Clive Ansell — Mon, 07 Dec 2009 15:39:17 GMT

[quote user="sarah mason"]

I found that commuting after nightshift or being on call was too tiring and too dangerous. Plus it is a waste of time if there is any way to avoid it

[/quote]

One of the reasons I no longer do night work is that it used to concern me driving home on the motorway after working a 15 hour shift in a usually busy emergency clinic, I could feel myself almost falling asleep at the wheel. Just a matter of time before someone has an accident really.

I am not sure but I think night workers are legally limited to 8 hour shifts, plus workers should have 11 hours off in every 24 under the European time directive. 15 hours is a long haul though.

Re: Commuting

Clive Ansell — Mon, 07 Dec 2009 15:30:07 GMT

[quote user="listhestar"]

[quote user="Clive Ansell"]I think the culture in the UK of long hours, no breaks, being expected to be a martyr etc is counter productive[/quote]

Me think you are right- had more time off sick this year than ever before (and proper sick not 'sickies'). Body telling me it can't be done.

Good website btw- I had never thought of doing that but good advertising relatively cheaply as well. Something I hadn't seen done before.

On another note Clive- what do you think the min no of years after graduation is needed for locum work?

Cheers

Lisa

[/quote]

Lisa. Listen to you body, maybe its time for some chill out down time? I became a locum when I was made redundant in 2001 and with hindsight should have done it earlier. Being a wage slave was no fun; hard work, long hours, no breaks, on call - then at the end of the month you are taxed into oblivion.

I admit my website is basic and amateurish, but it is useful. I have had direct contacts from it through Google searches that has resulted in work, so a good tool. costs about £20 a year for the domain name and webspace, plus my time. I will revamp it when I get time, I want it to look more professional.

Re: Commuting

George Cooper — Mon, 07 Dec 2009 14:58:31 GMT

Responding to the original topic, i have for about 5 years commuted varyingly between 1 hour and 1.5 hours from home deep in mid-Wales either to Cardiff and its environs, or to some conurbation in the Valleys, or up much further into the middle of Wales. Fortunately the drive is over the glorious Brecon Beacons, so is not a hassle. For the past 3 and a bit years I've worked part-time just under an hour away, again over the hills. However, we don't start till gone 10 in the morning, and surgery ends at 6 or 6.30. The nub of this commute is that where I live was driven by external factors not up for adjusting.

The second thread to emerge from this series is that of your Work/Life Balance. This is something that, despite first appearances, we can actually take ownership of and control it to the benefit of almost everything in our lives. It requires objectivity, and clarity about your aims and your own deep thoughts and values. Then you can start to make it work for you. Being able to say "no" nicely is a great start.

This, actually, could be a great new thread!! Our profession has much to learn, and has the power within itself. I do hate it when i read of the exploitation that goes on in the name of so-called "hard work". You just never know what is around the bend, and i believe we need to make every day count (according to our personal beliefs).

George

Re: Commuting

Lucy Crosby — Sun, 06 Dec 2009 22:16:53 GMT

Hi Lisa,

I'm currently commuting 1hr to work until I find a house to buy nearer to my practice. I've been doing it for 4mo now and generally it's been ok. I work from 9-7pm, but don't usually leave work until 7.30/8pm. Getting home so late isn;t great but fortunately my husband cooks, otherwise I would never have time to eat! I only work 3 days a week usually, but wouldn't want to commute that distance if I were working full-time.

Good luck with whatever you decide.

Re: Commuting

Gillian Mostyn — Sun, 06 Dec 2009 17:40:43 GMT

[quote user="Hanna Bennett"]

[quote user="listhestar"]

To be fair bosses work just as hard themselves which then gives the whole practice a work to the bone culture!![/quote]

sounds like the practice needs more staff!

[/quote]

That is what I was thinking - the bosses need to reduce their income a little bit but gain a life! lol

Re: Commuting

Hanna Bennett — Sun, 06 Dec 2009 16:13:35 GMT

[quote user="listhestar"]

To be fair bosses work just as hard themselves which then gives the whole practice a work to the bone culture!!

[/quote]

sounds like the practice needs more staff!

Re: Commuting

listhestar — Sun, 06 Dec 2009 14:53:12 GMT

[quote user="Clive Ansell"]I think the culture in the UK of long hours, no breaks, being expected to be a martyr etc is counter productive[/quote]

Me think you are right- had more time off sick this year than ever before (and proper sick not 'sickies'). Body telling me it can't be done.

Good website btw- I had never thought of doing that but good advertising realatively cheaply as well. Something I hadn't seen done before.

On another note Clive- what do you think the min no of years after graduation is needed for locum work?

Cheers

Lisa

Re: Commuting

listhestar — Sun, 06 Dec 2009 14:48:11 GMT

[quote user="Hanna Bennett"]

Gillian, you and i are just too soft i guess! Obviously the trick is to work your employees into the ground, not ourselves! Going wrong there somewhere...

[/quote]

To be fair bosses work just as hard themselves which then gives the whole practice a work to the bone culture!!

Lisa

Re: Commuting

listhestar — Sun, 06 Dec 2009 14:46:31 GMT

[quote user="sarah mason"]My hours were 9-7, but to get to work for 9am I had to leave by 7.40 and sit in stand-still traffic. I found leaving at 7.15 got me there for 8am, and anything in between was hit and miss (ok in school holidays though[/quote]

I think that would be my worry as well Sarah. Moving to halfway ground looks likely to tire me and hubby. If only I had a helcopter- problem solved.....

But thanks for the advice- its what I'm worried about re hubby- he's getting tired and only a matter of time before an accident me fears.

Cheers

Lisa

Re: Commuting

sarah mason — Sun, 06 Dec 2009 14:29:52 GMT

My first job was a 30 minute drive which was fine, but the hours were awful so I moved to a job 50 minutes drive away which I thought would be ok. What you have to take into account though is the traffic. My hours were 9-7, but to get to work for 9am I had to leave by 7.40 and sit in stand-still traffic. I found leaving at 7.15 got me there for 8am, and anything in between was hit and miss (ok in school holidays though). All it meant was an extra hours work per day because there was nothing else to do (gym etc) nearby.

During the summer I was locuming a 35-45 minute drive away which was fine, no traffic for most of it. Have recently taken up an internship in the same area but have given up and will be moving in 2 weeks to a house near the uni. I found that commuting after nightshift or being on call was too tiring and too dangerous. Plus it is a waste of time if there is any way to avoid it

Re: Commuting

Clive Ansell — Sun, 06 Dec 2009 13:16:39 GMT

[quote user="listhestar"]

[quote user="Hanna Bennett"]However I have to ask - a 50 hour week with no on call[/quote]

8.30am to 7.30pm the norm with occasional 8pm finishes and missed lunch break as well at times. Our receptionist, the other day when I said I needed to get home to see hubbie (8pm at night) said ' your a vet thats what too expect'. Says it all really huh!

Lisa

[/quote]

Gosh, that is far too many hours to be doing on a regular basis if a 5 day week.

Don't forget the european time directive, and working time regulations state a maximum working week of 48 hours for employees. There is the option in the UK to opt out of this if you agree and sign to that effect. You also have the right to "opt in" again and not to work more than 48 hours if you choose not to. In addition you are legally entitled to take breaks during the working day, which your employer must allow and provide for. Europe want the opt out clause abolished, which would mean an employee would not be able to exceed 48 hours.

I think the culture in the UK of long hours, no breaks, being expected to be a martyr etc is counter productive. Since becoming a locum and having more time off, I am healthier, happier and enjoy my work far more. In my first job I quickly came to not enjoy and even resent the 60 hour weeks and additional 1 in 3 on call. France has a 35 hour working week, yet their production per person hour worked is higher than ours in the UK.

Re: Commuting

Hanna Bennett — Sun, 06 Dec 2009 11:06:13 GMT

Gillian, you and i are just too soft i guess! Obviously the trick is to work your employees into the ground, not ourselves! Going wrong there somewhere...

Re: Commuting

listhestar — Sun, 06 Dec 2009 10:25:29 GMT

[quote user="Gillian Mostyn"]

[quote user="listhestar"]8.30am to 7.30pm the norm with occasional 8pm finishes[/quote]

You are working too many hours!!!

[/quote]

I know I am working on it!

Lisa

Re: Commuting

Gillian Mostyn — Sat, 05 Dec 2009 20:39:07 GMT

[quote user="listhestar"]8.30am to 7.30pm the norm with occasional 8pm finishes[/quote]

You are working too many hours!!!

Re: Commuting

listhestar — Fri, 04 Dec 2009 22:06:53 GMT

[quote user="Hanna Bennett"]However I have to ask - a 50 hour week with no on call[/quote]

I think you may have a point Hanna- moving would be better (I don't like change though even when job not ideal at times!)

Thanks everyone- you have really helped. NIce to have such a knowledgeable and helpful bunch online.

Lisa

Re: Commuting

Hanna Bennett — Fri, 04 Dec 2009 20:46:55 GMT

I'm not such a long commuter, but do live further away than i have before - can do it in 20 mins OOH but usually takes 30 mins in the morning. Find the drive home helps me switch off from work and i arrive home in a more settled frame of mind.

However I have to ask - a 50 hour week with no on call? How is that possible? And surely a new job closer to hubbie's work is more logical

Re: Commuting

Clive Ansell — Fri, 04 Dec 2009 20:04:16 GMT

Lisa,

I have been a locum since 2001 and really enjoy it, it suits me and my lifestyle well. The biggest advantage for me is that I can take extended time off when I want to pursue my mountaineering interest, for example in 2008 I spent 6 weeks in Bolivia which would be almost impossible as an employee on the statutory minimum holiday allowance (That many seem only to get) .

I used to work more from home than I do now, the reason being that I stopped doing emergency work, and 2 of my regular practices sold out - one to a local small corporate group and another to a low cost clinic, both penny pinchers and not willing to pay as well as trying to work you in to the ground with excessive workloads, no breaks etc. I could probably find all my work around home if I looked for it. About 75% is at the moment with 4 good (good = decent owner, sensible workloads, good clients, no OOH) regular practices. I don't mind travelling and being away from home though.

I suppose one of the downsides is no security of employment, although I have always found enough work, and things like sick pay, holiday pay, pension. bupa which of course I don't get unless I pay for myself. Family commitments and children might make it more difficult too I guess.

Because I have regular practices I can follow up cases, and get to know the clients and their pets, so it is professionally satisfying too.

Re: Commuting

listhestar — Fri, 04 Dec 2009 19:50:16 GMT

[quote user="Cat Henstridge"]If you do decide to locum and want to stay close to home, do stick to your guns with the agencies[/quote]

Thanks I will bear that in mind. That would be the area I would be looking at.

Cheers

Lisa

Re: Commuting

Cat Henstridge — Fri, 04 Dec 2009 19:43:31 GMT

Hi Lisa,

I have been a locum for a year now and have managed to do the vast majority of my work within commuting distance of home. Some jobs have required me to travel an hour or just a bit more but most have been within 30-40 minutes. I live in Bridgnorth in Shropshire, which isn't exactly a metropolis but is within commuting distance of several towns, Birmingham and Wolverhampton, so I am quite lucky in that respect.

If you do decide to locum and want to stay close to home, do stick to your guns with the agencies. They will offer you jobs all over the place but once they realise you will only take local jobs they will suddenly be able to come up with stuff!

Cat

Re: Commuting

listhestar — Fri, 04 Dec 2009 19:21:43 GMT

Thanks Clive. On another note how do you find locuming. Do you think you would find enough work if you decided to work from home all the time?

Just wondered- just have a general ponder on what to do etc.

Cheers

Lisa

Re: Commuting

Clive Ansell — Fri, 04 Dec 2009 19:18:17 GMT

I'm a locum so my commuting distances vary. Most of my regular work is within a 20 minute drive from home, which is great. On Monday I am off to Kent for 2 weeks, 180 Miles and just under 3 hours, it sounds a lot, but once there I live at the practice in a flat and will park the car up and not use it, use my bike to get around.

Sometimes use the train too, particularly for work in London or the other side of Birmingham from me. Traffic and parking can be a nightmare, and I do get the odd bout of road rage when the numbskulls pither and dither, don't signal, use the wrong lane and get in the way

I used to do a regular locum in Helensburgh, Scotland. the cheapest and quickest way was to fly to that one. 40 mins from Birmingham.

Re: Commuting

listhestar — Fri, 04 Dec 2009 19:00:02 GMT

[quote user="Rudolph"]elting out tunes in the car helps to relieve some tension [/quote]

hadn't thought of that. ;)

[quote user="Rudolph"]I suppose a lot depends on whether you get road rage or not!![/quote]

I am a little prone but thanks for the info. Don't want to move and then both end up exhausted!

Lisa