Life was better in the old days

Re: Life was better in the old days

Laurence Webb — Sat, 05 Dec 2009 21:02:34 GMT

[quote user="Martin Jones"]

What happens if you don't get on with the boss NOW, Wynne? Do you throw things at the mirror?

[/quote]

Why not write an article for the Daily Mirror instead

The same as Clive, I qualified in 1996 from Bristol so, whilst things have changed a lot since I qualified it's nothing compared to the changes that have happened in the last 50 years.

If you'll indulge me in a little nostalgia though, I have fond memories of seeing practice whilst still at school with my parent's vet who was a lovely kind man. His life wasn't rushed and he genuinely seemed to enjoy his working life which was a mixture of a few small animal consults in his 2 room practice (small waiting room and larger 'room for everything' from consults to operations) then a few farm visits before a leisurely lunch and a couple more consults in the afternoon.

One of my strongest memories is of going to do the annual pit pony inspection - this was in the late 80's and I was shocked to learn that there were still such things. For one thing Maggie had closed most of the mines and secondly I thought ponies hadn't been used for decades. He told me that when he started it took 1 month to go around all of the local mines for the annual inspection, but by that time there was only Ellington Colliery that was still open. Aparently they were used to move coal close the the coal face, although they were largely there for sentimental reasons.

The inspection was quite an experience. It was the only time I've been down a working mine. We dropped down the shaft then into a train that took us miles out under the North Sea. After 15 minutes we got out, going through dark coaldust covered tunnels until we suddenly rounded a corner, went through a large metal door and I found myself standing in a perfectly normal looking stable with 15 ponies happily munching away on their hay.

Re: Life was better in the old days

Hannah Wynne Richards — Sat, 05 Dec 2009 11:41:44 GMT

Occasionally tempting when I feel like kicking myself for doing something PARTICULARLY silly, but too superstitious to risk 7 years bad luck !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Wynne

Re: Life was better in the old days

Niall Taylor — Sat, 05 Dec 2009 09:22:54 GMT

[quote user="Martin Jones"]

I was wondering if we could perhaps bask in the glow of nostalgia for a bit, as an antidote.

I have a theory that life was better for a vet thirty or forty years ago

[/quote]

I'll never forget that fust day at t'pit...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I2AcJSkUw6M

Ice forming on the Boyle's bottle as the ether evaporated on cold mornings in an unheated operating theatre which had a cracked sink in the corner for scrubbing up - sterile technique meant getting someone else to turn the taps off for you!

A 1 in 2 rota, weekends and nights which meant 1 in 1 when someone was on holiday. Spending my first month in practice in a caravan in the boss's garden but then being provided with a fantastic practice house afterwards. Lovely Cornish small scale farms, home made pasties, a massive bowl of clotted cream covered with a teacloth in a farmhouse kitchen. Being invited in for a can of lager on new year's morning after a successful calving for a young farmer trying to build up his herd.

No regrets.

Niall

Re: Life was better in the old days

Martin Jones — Fri, 04 Dec 2009 18:29:15 GMT

What happens if you don't get on with the boss NOW, Wynne? Do you throw things at the mirror?

Re: Life was better in the old days

Hannah Wynne Richards — Fri, 04 Dec 2009 17:51:30 GMT

I missed the era of the working Shires, and it's such a pity that so many heavy breeds are at risk of dying out. Everyone seems to want Warmbloods, and there's no doubt they excel at dressage, but why not the old Cleveland/ID/Shire crossed with TB for showjumping My own riding horse is a Sec D (as though no-one could have guessed that for themselves )

We were using feline panleucopaenia vaccine in the initial Parvo outbreak in 1979 (final year as student ) The rationale was that it was another Parvo virus, so better than nothing until the 1st canine vac came out

The downside of smaller practices was that although it was really lovely when you got on with the boss (and his wife ), and I gained a lot from Peter Shep, if you were unlucky enough not to get on with the boss, there was no-one to dilute the antipathy

Wynne

Re: Life was better in the old days

Tim Cheyne — Fri, 04 Dec 2009 13:08:29 GMT

Then, Wynne, you were/are one of the rare exceptions, and most likely one that exemplifies my last comment. The Shires were magnificent animals, strong, b*minded at times, but incredibly gentle and quiet tempered. I did much of my formal animal management on them, in London strangely enough, where there were more heavy horses (even in the fifties) than most people realised.

No, I don't remember that but I do recall that it was a long time before CVH and later Parvo were properly identified as distinct entities and not as examples of aberrant CD.

Tim.

Re: Life was better in the old days

Hannah Wynne Richards — Fri, 04 Dec 2009 10:44:51 GMT

Tim In that era I was a little girl with a very beloved pony At least a) I wasn't fat b) the resident "horse expert " wasn't a mother who had read a few magazines, but a father who had grown up with Shire plough horses (and had some cups won with horses at ploughing matches )

On the vaccination theme-remember giving cat vaccine to try to prevent Parvo?

Wynne

Re: Life was better in the old days

Tim Cheyne — Fri, 04 Dec 2009 10:04:09 GMT

Before I graduated (1958; yes, I really am one of the old ones!) I saw practice with the local vet, first as a schoolboy, then full-time lay assistant for two years, followed by some of my EMS as a student. Medicines for dogs were mostly 'little yellow pills', 'mauve tablets' and Chelidon. Anaesthesia was thiopentone, sodium pentabarbitone, occasionally ether, and ops were done on the consulting room table after the clinic (twice daily) closed. The arrival of the first x-ray machine in a rather heavy suitcase was quite an event; precautions? - well, yes, sort of.

For CD there was the 'Field' method, 5 ml of a sort of soup followed by a dose of live virus; re-vaccination was unnecessary as there was sufficient CD in the community to provide natural boosters.

Horses were treated externally with biniodide of mercury (red blister), for cough with Mist Diamorphine Co (yes, really, Winchester Quarts of it on the surgery shelf), internally with Altan or balls of Aloes barb, parenterally with Carbachol. Castrations for ponies of 'Travellers"(aka second-hand car dealers, etc) were done in batches of 3-4 at a time in an open field, procaine local, plus a shot of tetanus antitoxin afterwards, before beers all round at the nearest pub. Toxoid was not easily available and did not catch on readily even when it did become available.

Cows were treated then, much as now, with various formulations of Epsom salts and sodium propionate, also intra-uterine Lugols iodine. Antibiotics slowly became available, first as foul smelling intramammary penicillin stearate in arachis oil (good for wound dressing as well), then crystalline penicillin G, streptomycin injection and chloromycetin.

By the end of that period horse practice meant attending to overfed ponies owned by equally fat little girls with dominant mothers who subscribed to a weekly horse journal and knew it all; best avoided as far as possible.

Were vets better off then?....financially no, pay was poor, fees were incredibly low, but then overheads were fairly low as well.

Were they more respected then?....on the whole I think, yes, although there were still some big houses where the local doctor entered through the front door and the vet knocked at the tradesman's entrance.

Were they happy?....looking back myopically through rosy lenses, yes, I think most were, even the supposed fifty per cent of farm vets suffering various degrees of chronic brucellosis. Why?.....pressure seemed less re work schedules, costs, targets, regulations, and there was time to talk to clients especially on the farms, to have breakfast there, perhaps even a bath, after a difficult but successful calving, or a chat and a drink in his study with Sir Whatsisname. Also (ducks for cover) most entered the profession because they had a real empathy with animals and their owners, partly through experience or rearing on farms, and were not so inclined to see it as a good thing to be or a good business. I wonder whether that is so today?

Tim.

Re: Life was better in the old days

Hannah Wynne Richards — Fri, 04 Dec 2009 09:53:23 GMT

PS to above Smaller practices meant we had far more on call, but it could also mean practices were friendlier. The above practice, Peter Shepherds was run from his home. It was the 1st practice where I had clin path on site, but also Shirley (his wife ) was brilliant in ensuring that at busy times, the assistants were at least fed That sort of practice where the owner and both assistants would discuss cases over the kitchen table (on a regular basis ) may exist in the Highlands and Islands, but has largely died out

Wynne

Re: Life was better in the old days

Clive Ansell — Fri, 04 Dec 2009 09:52:00 GMT

[quote user="Martin Jones"]

Clive, you make me feel old. I qualified before you, and it wasn't exactly the dark ages (although anybody remember chelix tablets?). I was really referring to the 60s/70s, when the REALLY old people were in practiceMartin

[/quote]

Yes I know, but things have changed even in the 13 years I have been in practice. I do feel really old some days though.

1996 (Liverpool)

Re: Life was better in the old days

Hannah Wynne Richards — Fri, 04 Dec 2009 09:23:04 GMT

Driving from Llandrindod to the top of the Elan Valley, and back to the surgery, to be told that I had left the farm 5 minutes b4 they phoned to say there was another call one farm further up the road (why couldn't it have been 1 down, then they could have flagged me down ????)

Wynne

Re: Life was better in the old days

Julian Earl — Thu, 03 Dec 2009 21:07:21 GMT

Chelix tablets? Anyone remember Newlix tablets? I've no idea what they did but remember them on the shelf when I worked at the local vet's as a kid. And Genebile for liver problems?

Anyway, like most things in life the matter has plusses and minuses.

No mobile phones meant that the curse of walking back in the door at home after a long call-out only to be greeted by the receptionist ringing you with another call was a real pain in the backsidel; no local specialists so animals were either euthanased or else you just "had a go"; analgesia not used, or at least hardly ever e.g. the dog with the inflamed and swollen mammary tumour removal wound would be given antibiotics, but no NSAIDs - of which there was only bute of course. Lots of useless, sorry unproven, medications, like anthiomaline, for example.

On the bright side, I believe that our status was higher "back then" but we were still accused of being expensive. There were lower expectations, and cases (and therefore veterinary life) were simpler in the sense that auto-immune diseases were never a differential, spinal cases got better (or not) with just rest and steroids, and plating a leg was the height of technology.

Of course, I only know all this because my Dad told me, as I'm only 23, honest.

Re: Life was better in the old days

Utlendigur — Thu, 03 Dec 2009 20:04:02 GMT

Qualified 1991. Similarly, initial job 1 in 3 (1 in 2 if someone off - no locums!), open surgeries, Sunday surgeries, no back-up OOH unless you were really stuck when you just had to phone every member of staff and hope someone was in, no mobile phone so you were stuck in the practice on call, no in-house lab so the metabolic emergency that always arrived Fri eve was either iv fluid responsive or dead....etc. Pluses - less pressure due to lower expectations, having to rely more on brainpower than lab tests

Minuses now - definitely all the red tape and hoops that have to be jumped through (cascade, off licence consent etc), clients clutching sheafs of stuff off the internet, the 24/7 culture which means many more early hours calls, TV Vet programms that convince owners that we can perform the impossible (for nothing). Pluses - being able to get basic lab results within a few minutes, being able to diagnose and treat a lot more cases well, better analgesia and anaesthetics, better rota

Re the comment on fewer drugs available - we seem to be backsliding on that, with many useful drugs disappearing/unavailable eg myotonine, konakion

Re: Life was better in the old days

Hannah Wynne Richards — Thu, 03 Dec 2009 17:10:33 GMT

Class of 1980

Wynne

Re: Life was better in the old days

Martin Jones — Thu, 03 Dec 2009 13:55:29 GMT

Who doesn't yearn to be James Herriot? Who doesn't breathe a sigh of relief when somebody turns up with a very sick old cat, asking only for it to be euthanased and not entertaining any notions of miracle cure?

And yes, I take Wynne's point about poor working conditions. At least it was a reason to become a partner.

Martin

Re: Life was better in the old days

Clive Ansell — Thu, 03 Dec 2009 12:00:49 GMT

I think it is certainly different, I qualified in 1996 and it is better in some ways and not so good in others perhaps.

Working conditions have improved, my first job was a 1 in 3 on call rota plus 1 in 3 weekends including Sunday surgeries. That was on the back of a 50 or so hour working week. The single biggest improvement was the opening of an OOH centre and farming out the on call work. Salaries are still low to comparative professions such as law, dentistry, medicine, but I feel things are improving though.

Client expectations have risen, they now seem to demand and question things far more and want more for their money. When there were "no treatments for cancer" and atopic dermatitis was treated with prednisolone or prednisolone, it was certainly easier.

I work in many different practices, and have noticed an increased tendency to refer cases that are not that complicated, particularly by younger colleagues. I'm not sure if this is fear of litigation, client pressure of lack of confidence. I recently noticed a case of a cat with mid shaft fracture of femur being referred, which could easily have been repaired in house.

Also noticed an increase in nonsense OOH telephone calls on the few occasions I do on call. Things like sneezing cats at 2 am and "my dog has diarrhoea" at midnight. Either that or I am becoming more intolerant and showing signs of early Meldrewism.

Re: Life was better in the old days

Hannah Wynne Richards — Thu, 03 Dec 2009 11:37:20 GMT

I probably qualify as one of the "golden oldies "(my preferred term ), so here's my personal opinion. A bit like the curates egg-good in parts

Good bits Most jobs were still mixed, and I liked the variety. Also the public were definitely more respectful Dairy farming was far more profitable, so herds were smaller, and the individual cow worth more, so we still had the chance to do single cow as opposed to herd medicine There was far less legislative hassle, no cascade for example

Bad bits Jobs were far harder to find. In 1984, I heard of 200 applicants for 1 job, and both Cambridge and Glasgow veterinary schools were nearly closed to solve the overproduction problem, so definitely an employers market when I was an employee. Many jobs were advertised under box numbers, so you could not suss out a practice b4 applying Although (in theory ) sex discrimination was illegal, many jobs advertised in the VR still specified male assistant required, or married assistant -that meant married man, and the wife was expected to do phone answering FOC

Equipment levels were far more basic Often no choice but TIVA as no anaesthetic machine. Sometimes expected to use Immobilon-actually a major welfare issue as only neurleptanalgesia, not true anaesthesia, and you took your life in your hands !!! Another anaesthetic horror story of mine was a practice where the "anaesthetic machine " for cats was an old elastoplast bandage container-holes drilled in bottom, a wad of cotton wool placed in, and ETHER pured on-that practice used IV pentobarbitone for dogs, they slept till the next day !!!!!

Xray machines were another rare luxury, and my 1st in house lab facility was in 1984. As for nursing support, there were no VNs The old RANA qualification meant nothing, legally they were no different to any other lay people. That was pointed out to us in our veterinary jurisprudence lectures. It was only later that the VS Act was amended so that they were renamed VNs and legally allowed to perform certain procedures

There was far less equine work, as the working horse had long ago disappeared, and there were far fewer leisure horses

There were far fewer drugs available. I probably only regularly use 10% of the drugs I learnt about in pharmacology-the rest are all new (and much better )

Pet insurence was still in it's infancy, so far more potentially curable animals were euthanased. I think Matthew would have been very happy, but on balance life is far better now

Wynne