A gift for vets (and nurses). What do you think?

RE: A gift for vets (and nurses). What do you think?

Arlo Guthrie — Tue, 25 Mar 2025 18:53:51 GMT

[quote userid="25265" url="~/f/non-clinical-questions/31155/a-gift-for-vets-and-nurses-what-do-you-think/246887#246887"]It might also fall afoul of laws against running lotteries without a license. Please speak to someone with legal knowledge before you crack on with this Arlo.[/quote]

Ben Walker - thanks for that. Hmm - I suppose it would only work if I divorce the possiblity of getting a voucher from buying an advert, the simplest way of doing which would be just to say that I will be dishing out profits from VS to members, rather than just advertisers. But yes and (Judith Joyce), I will look in more depth.

[quote userid="11493" url="~/f/non-clinical-questions/31155/a-gift-for-vets-and-nurses-what-do-you-think/246889#246889"]Maybe we can help each other. Want a link to your site while I develop mine? [/quote]

For sure Francisco Gomez - maybe I can write a news story about your new offering?

RE: A gift for vets (and nurses). What do you think?

Judith Joyce — Sun, 23 Mar 2025 09:38:50 GMT

Agree totally with Ben. Gov.uk and Gambling Commission have lots of info but it's a minefield. Didn't mean to accuse you of bribery and gambling but you can't say the legalese isn't plain speaking!

RE: A gift for vets (and nurses). What do you think?

Francisco Gomez — Sun, 23 Mar 2025 08:37:22 GMT

Maybe we can help each other. Want a link to your site while I develop mine?

RE: A gift for vets (and nurses). What do you think?

Ben Walker — Sat, 22 Mar 2025 21:07:59 GMT

The prize winnings would be incurred in the course of their employment so are likely taxable even if it’s random.

It might also fall afoul of laws against running lotteries without a license. Please speak to someone with legal knowledge before you crack on with this Arlo.

RE: A gift for vets (and nurses). What do you think?

Judith Joyce — Sat, 22 Mar 2025 07:01:02 GMT

[quote userid="2100" url="~/f/non-clinical-questions/31155/a-gift-for-vets-and-nurses-what-do-you-think/246868#246868"]giving something back at random,[/quote]

That might do it. Don't quote me on this but I think it used to be that if there was an element of chance - names in a hat etc, it changes the tax position - not sure about the declaring on folks anti-bribery policies though

RE: A gift for vets (and nurses). What do you think?

Michael Woodhouse — Fri, 21 Mar 2025 22:53:44 GMT

[quote userid="2100" url="~/f/non-clinical-questions/31155/a-gift-for-vets-and-nurses-what-do-you-think/246864#246864"]Thing is, I find it very hard to believe that they are getting anything like ratecard price for advertising on vet record: https://recruiter.vetrecordjobs.com/ (Vet Times is a bit more cagey: https://recruiters.vettimes.com/pricing). But if VR is getting ratecard, that's about half a million quid a year in revenue. I[/quote]

The last time I used them, there was no negotiation, only a small (10 or 15%) BVA member reduction.

As more of the specific FB groups emerged that coincided with our use of the platform. Shared to things like Vetwings, FAVS (farm oriented vet students), local independent practice job group.

When we recruited 2 vets from the FB ads, and just a series of broken English applications from the VR, we decided to risk FB only and had more than enough applicants. Weeded out almost all the broken English foreign vets, too.

RE: A gift for vets (and nurses). What do you think?

Judith Joyce — Fri, 21 Mar 2025 22:11:09 GMT

It doesn't sound like bribery to me either, a nice gesture. That doesn't seem to be the way of the world though - its mad.

RE: A gift for vets (and nurses). What do you think?

Ben Walker — Fri, 21 Mar 2025 21:17:00 GMT

[quote userid="2100" url="~/f/non-clinical-questions/31155/a-gift-for-vets-and-nurses-what-do-you-think/246868#246868"]bribery sounds a bit strong[/quote]

Yeah, what you’re suggesting doesn’t sound like bribery to me either. However, a quick search on gov.uk uncovered the following:

https://www.gov.uk/expenses-and-benefits-third-party-awards

The tax looks like it might be a pain.

RE: A gift for vets (and nurses). What do you think?

Arlo Guthrie — Fri, 21 Mar 2025 15:26:04 GMT

[quote userid="13891" url="~/f/non-clinical-questions/31155/a-gift-for-vets-and-nurses-what-do-you-think/246867#246867"]It is a lovely thought Arlo, but could it fall foul of someone's antibribery policy? If an employee forgets to declare it and another disgruntled employee sprags on them or similar.[/quote]

Gosh - bribery sounds a bit strong! All I'm doing is saying that I'll be giving something back at random, so it's not like you could accuse someone of being bribed. Also, I think the amount is relevant - perhaps it might become problematic if the sums become too large.

RE: A gift for vets (and nurses). What do you think?

Judith Joyce — Fri, 21 Mar 2025 12:49:44 GMT

It is a lovely thought Arlo, but could it fall foul of someone's antibribery policy? If an employee forgets to declare it and another disgruntled employee sprags on them or similar.

You're in a catch 22 I guess because ads have dropped off and free ones are popular as I'm guessing you can't shout about the benefits of advertising on vetsurgeon (unless your ads are better targeted and result in greater recruitment and retention? That would be a winner.) So shouting about something is definitely better than nothing, and shouting about money and being nice is worth a trial.

RE: A gift for vets (and nurses). What do you think?

Arlo Guthrie — Fri, 21 Mar 2025 09:00:03 GMT

[quote userid="3169" url="~/f/non-clinical-questions/31155/a-gift-for-vets-and-nurses-what-do-you-think/246858#246858"]It used to be all in the vet record, that's where we all found jobs when I qualified.[/quote][quote userid="3169" url="~/f/non-clinical-questions/31155/a-gift-for-vets-and-nurses-what-do-you-think/246858#246858"]I think this is something that has moved to Facebook. [/quote]

Interestingly, there are a LOT of jobs still posted on Vet Record (https://www.vetrecordjobs.com/) and Vet Times (https://jobs.vettimes.com/), despite Facebook.

Thing is, I find it very hard to believe that they are getting anything like ratecard price for advertising on vet record: https://recruiter.vetrecordjobs.com/ (Vet Times is a bit more cagey: https://recruiters.vettimes.com/pricing). But if VR is getting ratecard, that's about half a million quid a year in revenue. If my scheme gains traction, well, there would be room to dish out 100K, perhaps more.

I think the thing to remember is that although Facebook seems like the whole world is on it, the reality is that there is a significant part of the audience that is not (or not very regularly), and advertising is usually about promoting across multiple platforms (who knows, even if you get lots of applications on FB, the really good applicant might not be using it).

At the price I charge, which is hardly enough for a round in the pub, I want everyone to think ... "OK, we'll do it in the free places, and we'll do it on vetsurgeon because it's cheap, which makes it a good bet, and because it gives back to the profession, which is nice!"

RE: A gift for vets (and nurses). What do you think?

Michael Woodhouse — Thu, 20 Mar 2025 23:06:50 GMT

[quote userid="2100" url="~/f/non-clinical-questions/31155/a-gift-for-vets-and-nurses-what-do-you-think/246857#246857"]the number of jobs posted has decreased recently, and I think part of the reason for that is that I haven't been very good at reminding people how cheap it is to advertise here.[/quote]

It used to be all in the vet record, that's where we all found jobs when I qualified. I have advertised with you, in the past, but I think this is something that has moved to Facebook. That's free. We've found the last 4 vets that way, over the years I've spent thousands of pounds with the vet record......

RE: A gift for vets (and nurses). What do you think?

Arlo Guthrie — Thu, 20 Mar 2025 17:59:34 GMT

Thanks for your thoughts, Ben - as always much appreciated. Seriously.

My thinking is that:

[quote userid="25265" url="~/f/non-clinical-questions/31155/a-gift-for-vets-and-nurses-what-do-you-think/246855#246855"]It's a lovely thought, [/quote]

Yes, that's the point, or half of it anyway.

The other half, which is equally important, is that it gives an ongoing story to tell. How much is in the pot this month and who is going to get it?

That's really important, because the number of jobs posted has decreased recently, and I think part of the reason for that is that I haven't been very good at reminding people how cheap it is to advertise here.

So I would be hoping that that combination of it being lovely (which may not motivate everyone, but hopefully some), together with a bit of fun - I mean if the job boards got back to where they once were, that would be a fund of £3000 per site. And given the high odds of getting it, compared to say the lottery ...

IF it gets traction, it may also allow me to increase the cost of the advert, and in turn the size of the pot.

[quote userid="25265" url="~/f/non-clinical-questions/31155/a-gift-for-vets-and-nurses-what-do-you-think/246855#246855"]and might be awkward for an employer to choose who posts[/quote]

Oh yes, hadn't thought of that, thank you. Hmm. In which case, I think perhaps I leave that unsaid (ie explain that the fund will be divided amongst vets and nurses who post - and leave it to the advertiser to decide - if they are not a vet/nurse - whether they want to get someone else to post it).

[quote userid="25265" url="~/f/non-clinical-questions/31155/a-gift-for-vets-and-nurses-what-do-you-think/246855#246855"]Maybe give it a try for a year and see what happens.[/quote]

That's my thinking. Give it go. Make lots of noise. See where it takes me.

RE: A gift for vets (and nurses). What do you think?

Ben Walker — Thu, 20 Mar 2025 15:55:14 GMT

It's a lovely thought, Arlo, but I wouldn't bother. We've only recruited for a vet once, so my experience isn't nothing but it is limited. However, the thought of money back really wouldn't have made an impact. Your costs are already cheap enough that an employer wouldn't see it as a serious expense. I'm not sure a lottery for an employee would cinch it (and might be awkward for an employer to choose who posts).

But, what do I know? We're a really niche practice and used a recruiter (who landed us an exceptional employee, which I am forever grateful for). Maybe give it a try for a year and see what happens.