Should I always have to work Saturdays?

RE: Should I always have to work Saturdays?

Vet2Vet — Sat, 22 Apr 2023 09:31:44 GMT

Yes , I think that’s what’s missing . We do swaps but why swap when you never need to miss a four day weekend ? Will propose this as a new system

RE: Should I always have to work Saturdays?

Clive Ansell — Sat, 22 Apr 2023 07:54:53 GMT

Depends what is stated in your employment contract, if you have one.

In my first job, my only ever employed position, we worked 1 in 3 saturday mornings. If on holiday we swapped. If we had a locum to cover holidays (Usually didn't), they would often work the Saturday AM. We all finished up working the same number. Worked well with no issues at all.

Similar with OOH rota. if on holiday we swapped our nights or weekends on call. Nights, weekends, bank holidays, Christmas, easter were all on separate rota's, and workload was shared equally. Always worked very well. I often offered to work Christmas and boxing day; my 2 colleagues had young families and wanted to be with them, while I prefered to have New Year and Easter free. Again worked very well.

RE: Should I always have to work Saturdays?

Gillian Mostyn — Thu, 20 Apr 2023 14:58:15 GMT

[quote userid="3169" url="~/001/nonclinical/f/life-in-practice-discussions/30633/should-i-always-have-to-work-saturdays/241388#241388"]Not if full time - you just get the same 28 days[/quote]

But if they get a day off in the week after working a weekend then if they took the weekend and subsequent week off, then they're still only taking the same number of days off regardless of whether they should have worked the weekend or not. Or, putting it another way, if they chose to still work the weekend would they save a day's holiday that they could carry forwards?

RE: Should I always have to work Saturdays?

Michael Woodhouse — Thu, 20 Apr 2023 14:50:45 GMT

[quote userid="2457" url="~/001/nonclinical/f/life-in-practice-discussions/30633/should-i-always-have-to-work-saturdays/241387#241387"]Do they get a weekday off in lieu of working the weekend?[/quote]

Yes the Monday off after working the weekend

[quote userid="2457" url="~/001/nonclinical/f/life-in-practice-discussions/30633/should-i-always-have-to-work-saturdays/241387#241387"]in which case their holiday allowance of 5 weeks off would include more days to cover weekend working.[/quote]

Not if full time - you just get the same 28 days.

RE: Should I always have to work Saturdays?

Gillian Mostyn — Thu, 20 Apr 2023 14:47:45 GMT

[quote userid="3169" url="~/001/nonclinical/f/life-in-practice-discussions/30633/should-i-always-have-to-work-saturdays/241384#241384"]I guess I would entertain someone using a days holiday for a weekend day, BUT then they get fewer weeks off per year (assuming you work 5 week days and have 28 days holiday - 5.6 weeks normally but only 4.6 weeks off including the Saturday as an extra day)[/quote]

Do they get a weekday off in lieu of working the weekend?

If not, then they're actually working a standard 6 or 7 day week, in which case their holiday allowance of 5 weeks off would include more days to cover weekend working.

And if they do get a day off, then they're still taking the same number of days off that week.

As I've said, the problem is that traditionally vets holidays are allocated in weeks, and weekends are often not included in the contract as a normal working day, but some kind of 'plus ....'. Therefore vets on a 1:4 rota still end up working 13 weekend days every year when they should probably get a weekend off as part of their holiday allowance. (And be paid overtime for covering someone else).

RE: Should I always have to work Saturdays?

Michael Woodhouse — Thu, 20 Apr 2023 14:21:26 GMT

[quote userid="7542" url="~/001/nonclinical/f/life-in-practice-discussions/30633/should-i-always-have-to-work-saturdays"]Hi , is it a situation where Saturdays must always be swapped or worked ? it is not stated in contract . Is it unreasonable to take a week off and want the Saturday off too even if you cannot arrange your own swap ? [/quote]

We would always swap weekends. Why is that so difficult? If you think you should get the Saturday off if you book the week before, are you willing to work extra ones to cover colleagues in the same situation? If so, a swap leave you much more in control.

I guess I would entertain someone using a days holiday for a weekend day, BUT then they get fewer weeks off per year (assuming you work 5 week days and have 28 days holiday - 5.6 weeks normally but only 4.6 weeks off including the Saturday as an extra day)

We also have the policy that if you take a full week off I will cover your night, but if you take fewer days off you swap it. Otherwise you could get out of a lot of OOH work by clever use of holiday (If I am away staff get extra nights to do - it averages out over time).

RE: Asking for a Saturday off if employed ?

Aine Seavers — Wed, 19 Apr 2023 00:51:43 GMT

That isnt fair. What we did was take all the bank holiday weekends out of the roster onto their own roster. Then folks put down preferences not to work. If a tie then drew names. The loser got first choice next time. That way the staff who worked Christmas didnt work the New year and if you worked Easter then you didnt work the next public holiday etc. With staff of different religions/ethnicity, it made it easier to cover the breaks as some didnt mind working Christmas25th but wanted the Orthodox Jan 6-7th break off or the Chinese NY more important than Jan 1 etc

RE: Asking for a Saturday off if employed ?

Joyce Whitehead — Tue, 18 Apr 2023 16:06:50 GMT

Yes I see your point entirely. Our rota was 1 in 4 until this year so this used to arise a lot, the same person on Easter/Christmas etc. So for those special occasions we tend to split them or swap about, more for Christmas and New Year tbh but the same person never does the whole Easter weekend, they will have at least one bank holiday day off. I think you need to express this ASAP so it can be sorted for next year.

RE: Asking for a Saturday off if employed ?

ian bates — Tue, 18 Apr 2023 13:53:22 GMT

That sounds entirely reasonable - and your employer should be open to that conversation. I wouldn't want to cover Easter every year either - it's one of the busiest weekends for OOH and one of the nicest to be off duty!

RE: Asking for a Saturday off if employed ?

Vet2Vet — Tue, 18 Apr 2023 12:59:01 GMT

Yes I see. However , I’ve realised that my rota means I do every single Easter ( seven in a row at last count ) just the way it falls . I just don’t want to do it every single year . The bank holidays just fall as they do . Having completed Easter now doing the Mayday one straight after . ( which is fine ) just don’t want to do next Easter if that makes sense .

RE: Asking for a Saturday off if employed ?

Joyce Whitehead — Tue, 18 Apr 2023 12:40:38 GMT

We do our own OOH so vets and nurses cover a weekend every 5 weeks so a slightly different situation. But it is expected that no one takes their holiday over a weekend on call without arranging a swap. And it is up to that vet/nurse to arrange the swap. Very few years don’t involve a few swaps for weddings etc, but actually rarely for holidays as they can arrange their holidays to avoid it. And as we have a set 5 weeks rota you can see what you are working for the next year (or more).

RE: Asking for a Saturday off if employed ?

Gillian Mostyn — Tue, 18 Apr 2023 10:03:01 GMT

I think the problem is that, traditionally, we've been told we work, say, 4 days plus 'Saturdays on a rota', meaning normal working days somehow don't include the Saturday. If you get 5 weeks off, that would just mean 5 weeks of Mon-Fri. Swapping has always been done simply to ensure fairness - that everyone works the same number of weekends in the end regardless of how they book (fiddle their holidays). I guess it would be possible that if Saturdays weren't swapped then someone would have to fill in, and there could be issues if people kept booking certain weeks deliberately to reduce their weekend duties.

In my experience, many practices now have 40 hour weeks which will include weekend working - if they work a weekend day, they get a day off in the week. Therefore a week's holiday would use the same amount of hours regardless of weekend working. Holidays are worked out in hours, rather than days - the actual day taken becomes irrelevant. People therefore swap simply to reduce the amount of hours they need to use up.

Unless Saturday hours are part of your normal contracted hours, then I guess its difficult to allocate them as holiday. However, in theory, you are as entitled to Saturdays off as you are to any other day - but you'd need to change how the contract and holiday entitlement are worded.

RE: Asking for a Saturday off if employed ?

Rob Loxley — Tue, 18 Apr 2023 07:05:28 GMT

I'd suggest working out annual holiday in hours (rather than weeks) as it makes Saturday working much clearer. If you work 40hrs a week including Saturday (or 1-in-so many Saturdays) and take a week off but still have to work the same number of Saturdays (ie sawpping round), then your week off is not 40hrs of holiday used. To make our saturdays work we usually swap them round rather than taking it off as leave. Hope that helps