Has the worm turned?

RE: Has the worm turned?

Alistair Graham-Evans — Mon, 15 Feb 2021 05:09:03 GMT

Fortunately we get very few bad reviews but I feel it necessary to respond politely in such a way that it clarifies the unfounded basis of the review. After that we don’t engage.

The last one stated that we refused to see a sick dog and ranted that we are only in in for the money etc etc

In fact they were a client of a nearby corporate who had apparently refused to see their vomiting dog until the next month, still a few days away! The dog had started vomiting on the Friday night and they phoned at 5pm on the Saturday when our 2 vets on call were treating extreme emergencies ( one dog dying of respiratory failure) for our existing clients. They were told that their dog did need an exam and their regular vet had an obligation to see them. If they were unsuccessful in getting attention they could contact us again but it would be an OOH fee or a normal fee the next day ( Sunday). The nurse who answered the phone was sympathetic and tried to help over the phone. Our Facebook reply did not name their vet but pointed out the facts of the case and hoped they managed to be seen and explained the triage process. No further comments appeared.

We word any replies in such a way that sensible people can infer what we are dealing with!

Another recent one claimed that the cat was sent home with a band of skin missing from it’s leg. In fact there was a small patch of blood on the fur under a dressing as the cat had gone wild while removing the drip. We insisted on seeing it and after explaining everything (again) the owner (a nurse! ) apologised and removed the post and that of a friend who commented as well.

RE: Has the worm turned?

Beats — Sun, 14 Feb 2021 08:50:42 GMT

[quote userid="2100" url="~/001/nonclinical/f/life-in-practice-discussions/29667/has-the-worm-turned/228463#228463"]Also, the point is that the complainer in this case called the lawyer a scammer, which was both a lie and demonstrably hurt the lawyer's business.[/quote]

Are you sure?

I have neither read the review, nor followed any media coverage.

Calling a vet a scammer in a review would not sound like a "lie" to me. Perhaps metaphor. Perhaps hyperbole. It could also be a lie, but simply being read as a piece of legal text with OED definitions may not accurately reflect the thoughts of the author.

Tying a single review to reduced profits should be incredibly difficult. Correlation may be evident, but accepting proof of causation somewhat more problematic and likely a matter of opinion rather than fact? (Spurious Correlations (tylervigen.com)

RE: Has the worm turned?

Sarah Keir — Sat, 13 Feb 2021 17:20:28 GMT

[quote userid="5012" url="~/001/nonclinical/f/life-in-practice-discussions/29667/has-the-worm-turned/228546#228546"]Terra GTX - Trekking and Hiking Boots - Scarpa [/quote]

That's the hiking boot I have too. Scarpa suits my foot shape and is one the whole piece leather boots still made - no seams to disintegrate and no 'water-soluble waterproofing'.

I look at reviews a lot and balance what they are saying. Particularly for hotels or airbnb. I almost totally ignore Amazon reviews for Chinese made items sold from a pretend British company as they are almost always fake.

RE: Has the worm turned?

Stephen Courtney — Sat, 13 Feb 2021 09:34:59 GMT

There is a huge market in selling / buying fake reviews - check out the Which? website

I am very careful now, and to be honest try very hard to avoid buying things that aren't made in a country I respect

RE: Has the worm turned?

Clive Ansell — Fri, 12 Feb 2021 21:59:10 GMT

[quote userid="6897" url="~/001/nonclinical/f/life-in-practice-discussions/29667/has-the-worm-turned/228540#228540"]I was looking for walking boots on Amazon the other day and reviews for the same product ranged from 'Brilliant' to 'Completely useless'. Makes one wonder how they are talking about the same thing.[/quote]

Boots are difficult to get right, and a very personal fit to an individual. I spent years trying out different brands of walking and mountaineering boots, at considerable cost. I now only ever buy Scarpa, they seem to fit really well and are great boots, although they come with a premium price tag.

If you after a good quality lightweight, comfortable, walking boot check these out

Terra GTX - Trekking and Hiking Boots - Scarpa

RE: Has the worm turned?

Clive Ansell — Fri, 12 Feb 2021 21:45:19 GMT

[quote userid="2490" url="~/001/nonclinical/f/life-in-practice-discussions/29667/has-the-worm-turned/228537#228537"]if I see a couple a of bad reviews but the rest are good then I discount the odd bad experience but if they are in a majority then I steer clear.[/quote]

I think most readers are able to put the occasional bad review into context, particularly if the recipient of that review has left a good response to it.

I think if the law firm in question had done this, the outcome would have been better.

[quote userid="2490" url="~/001/nonclinical/f/life-in-practice-discussions/29667/has-the-worm-turned/228537#228537"]I have some cynical distrust of 100% good reviews[/quote]

Me too.

I have recently purchased an OBD (on board diagnostic) device, from Amazon, to troubleshoot a problem with my car. Knowing almost nothing about them, I read reviews, did what research I could, and bought something with one of the highest 5/5 of good reviews and towards the top of the price range. The thing was junk, cheap Chinese tat sold at a premium with clever marketing, didn't work as it was supposed too, customer service from the US/Chinese manufacturer was even worse (There isn't any). Can't help wondering how it gets a 99.7% 5 star rating !? maybe there should be a lawsuit against fake positive reviews?

RE: Has the worm turned?

bob lehner — Fri, 12 Feb 2021 17:32:19 GMT

I'm frequently amazed at the disparity of views that appear on review sites. I was looking for walking boots on Amazon the other day and reviews for the same product ranged from 'Brilliant' to 'Completely useless'. Makes one wonder how they are talking about the same thing. As others have said I suppose you can only judge on the overall balance.

RE: Has the worm turned?

Clare Tapsfield-Wright — Fri, 12 Feb 2021 15:43:06 GMT

I read reviews and have found them useful , if I see a couple a of bad reviews but the rest are good then I discount the odd bad experience but if they are in a majority then I steer clear. I have some cynical distrust of 100% good reviews unless it’s my own book on Amazon when I think it’s completely justified

RE: Has the worm turned?

Clive Ansell — Fri, 12 Feb 2021 08:23:33 GMT

[quote userid="11493" url="~/001/nonclinical/f/life-in-practice-discussions/29667/has-the-worm-turned/228523#228523"]I don't write negative reviews. I think its a waste of time for me and for the company. [/quote]

If everyone thought like that, then a poor product or company would receive 100% positive reviews, which may mislead other customers. would they not?

[quote userid="11493" url="~/001/nonclinical/f/life-in-practice-discussions/29667/has-the-worm-turned/228523#228523"] It shows laziness and cowardice.[/quote]

I don't think it does, it is a proactive thing to do and may help other people.

[quote userid="11493" url="~/001/nonclinical/f/life-in-practice-discussions/29667/has-the-worm-turned/228523#228523"]If I have an issue with a company, I just don't go there again. If I have a big issue, I talk to them first. Public critic is always the last option.[/quote]

Yes, I do that too. I would always try too and prefer too resolve things amicably, which is usually successful.

RE: Has the worm turned?

Francisco Gomez — Thu, 11 Feb 2021 21:30:46 GMT

[quote userid="2100" url="~/001/nonclinical/f/life-in-practice-discussions/29667/has-the-worm-turned/228513#228513"]Of course you should proceed[/quote]

I don't write negative reviews. I think its a waste of time for me and for the company. It shows laziness and cowardice. If I have an issue with a company, I just don't go there again. If I have a big issue, I talk to them first. Public critic is always the last option.

I write positive ones when I feel like it.

RE: Has the worm turned?

Arlo Guthrie — Thu, 11 Feb 2021 15:40:27 GMT

[quote userid="5012" url="~/001/nonclinical/f/life-in-practice-discussions/29667/has-the-worm-turned/228509#228509"]I think it has the potential to become a dangerous precedent; that a large wealthy company or individual can ride roughshod and use the heavy handed approach of using a legal cosh to try and suppress free speech and expression. [/quote]

But by contrast, you think it's fair for a one-man band with a huge following to wrongly falsely impune a company just because it is large and wealthy?

Of course it isn't. And that is all I think anyone is saying. Reasonable, factual, fair complaint is exactly that. The lawyers in this case did not sue in response to a reasonable, factual and fair complaint, but to a post calling them scammers on a popular review website. That is demonstrably false, and if they want to sue, I think good luck to them.

[quote userid="5012" url="~/001/nonclinical/f/life-in-practice-discussions/29667/has-the-worm-turned/228509#228509"]I am in the process of writing a negative review this afternoon. Should I think again, or not proceed, for the fear of being sued? [/quote]

Of course you should proceed. But you are an intelligent, educated man who will write a reasonable, factual and fair review. That's not at issue here.

RE: Has the worm turned?

Clive Ansell — Thu, 11 Feb 2021 14:43:37 GMT

[quote userid="2100" url="~/001/nonclinical/f/life-in-practice-discussions/29667/has-the-worm-turned/228505#228505"]

Clive Ansell said:
Is anyone in our profession likely to take this sort of heavy handed action?

I don't think anyone is actually suggesting that. Just that it is a nice precedent, and could be used to remind people, or rather hint to them, that people who post libellous, factually incorrect vitriol can wind up with a very big legal bill.

[/quote]

I think it has the potential to become a dangerous precedent; that a large wealthy company or individual can ride roughshod and use the heavy handed approach of using a legal cosh to try and suppress free speech and expression.

The cost and timeframe of bringing such a legal action, would not be viable or sensible for most of us.

Why the need anyway, when a well thought out targeted response would likely be far more effective.

I am in the process of writing a negative review this afternoon. Should I think again, or not proceed, for the fear of being sued?

RE: Has the worm turned?

Arlo Guthrie — Thu, 11 Feb 2021 10:51:08 GMT

[quote userid="5012" url="~/001/nonclinical/f/life-in-practice-discussions/29667/has-the-worm-turned/228504#228504"]Is anyone in our profession likely to take this sort of heavy handed action?[/quote]

[quote userid="5012" url="~/001/nonclinical/f/life-in-practice-discussions/29667/has-the-worm-turned/228504#228504"]Wouldn't the best course of action be to just reply to a bad review with a well thought out, concise, accurate and single response. [/quote]

Yes. Absolutely.

RE: Has the worm turned?

Clive Ansell — Thu, 11 Feb 2021 10:38:25 GMT

Is anyone in our profession likely to take this sort of heavy handed action? As Glen as said, it would cost an awful lot of money to bring such an action, with no guarantee of the desired result.

What would be the time frame of getting such an action to court, given that there is a huge backlog within the court system at the moment, and once that negative review is written the work/its damage is already.

Wouldn't the best course of action be to just reply to a bad review with a well thought out, concise, accurate and single response.

RE: Has the worm turned?

Glen McIntosh — Thu, 11 Feb 2021 02:49:00 GMT

I love the precedent, but I fear that if the law firm making the libel claim had been doing the work in behalf of one of their clients, rather than for themselves, the bill for the work (high court litigation etc) would have far exceeded the 25000 payout they were awarded from the defendant.

The cost/benefit might be justified for a decent sized corporate entity, but might not be for most small to medium sized vet practices..

RE: Has the worm turned?

Chris Milligan — Thu, 11 Feb 2021 00:24:23 GMT

[quote userid="2100" url="~/001/nonclinical/f/life-in-practice-discussions/29667/has-the-worm-turned/228456#228456"]By contrast, if I see a company responding to a complaint politely but robustly, I will ignore the negative review. [/quote]

yes but nothing looks more disingenuous than the template corporate response of "we can't seem to find you in our system" or "we're sorry you weren't 100% satisfied with your experience at Hogwarts clinic, contact Lord Voldemort at...so we can understand your concerns" - that puts me off dealing with a company; the Google review equivalent of an automated phone menu telling you your call is important

RE: Has the worm turned?

Bob Russell — Wed, 10 Feb 2021 10:09:53 GMT

You may stick to facts and as a well educated person you are likely to provide a fair and balanced review (hopefully). Some of these reviews are from ignorant, nasty and vindictive individuals and they need to be aware that where they are straying from the truth, consequences may result.

RE: Has the worm turned?

Clive Ansell — Tue, 09 Feb 2021 21:00:09 GMT

[quote userid="2100" url="~/001/nonclinical/f/life-in-practice-discussions/29667/has-the-worm-turned/228463#228463"]Clive, why do you think we have an absolute unfettered right to free speech? We never have and we never will.[/quote]

I was brought to believe that we do, and if something is true and honest and needs to said - say it. That said, we are all responsible for what we say and need to be able to justify it, of course.

I suppose the term "Free" speech is difficult to quantify, and therefore a poor choice of language on my part. It is either free or it isn't, can't be partly or relatively free. Could be a whole debate on its own.

[quote userid="2100" url="~/001/nonclinical/f/life-in-practice-discussions/29667/has-the-worm-turned/228463#228463"]Publishers used to be (and still are) very careful what they publish, because of a fear of being sued[/quote]

If I write anything, reviews in this case, I stick to the facts as they are, or as I see them. I have a right to do so, but accept it is open to scrutiny and challenge.

[quote userid="2100" url="~/001/nonclinical/f/life-in-practice-discussions/29667/has-the-worm-turned/228463#228463"]The lawyer has always had the right to sue for libel. That’s not new.[/quote]

As we all do. Rightly so.

He should either not say that, retract it, or be prepared to support it with evidence.

Any road up - looking at other reviews for this law firm it would seem they have scored somewhat of an own goal.

RE: Has the worm turned?

Arlo Guthrie — Tue, 09 Feb 2021 19:54:46 GMT

Clive Ansell Clive, why do you think we have an absolute unfettered right to free speech? We never have and we never will.

The lawyer has always had the right to sue for libel. That’s not new.

What is new is the bigger audience we all have.

Publishers used to be (and still are) very careful what they publish, because of a fear of being sued, something they would be a target for by virtue of their large audience.

But now we ALL of us individually have those large audiences that used to belong just to publishers, and we all need to shoulder the same responsibility for what we publish as publishers do.

Also, the point is that the complainer in this case called the lawyer a scammer, which was both a lie and demonstrably hurt the lawyer's business. We're not talking about someone making a reasoned and fair complaint here.

RE: Has the worm turned?

Clive Ansell — Tue, 09 Feb 2021 18:04:23 GMT

What a scary precedent to set.

And, there was me thinking we lived in a democracy with an absolute unfettered right to free speech.

It is very rare, but I will leave a negative review if it is warranted, and should be able to do so without a fear of being sued, as long as it is honest, accurate and not malicious.

RE: Has the worm turned?

Gillian Mostyn — Tue, 09 Feb 2021 15:11:02 GMT

[quote userid="9239" url="~/001/nonclinical/f/life-in-practice-discussions/29667/has-the-worm-turned/228455#228455"]Better to ignore it in my opinion.[/quote]

I think some reviews are best ignored - the ones that are blatantly stupid that anyone can see are vexatious. However, sometimes a polite response by the business can be all that is needed. I love things like:

I'm sorry you feel like that but...

- we cannot discuss your financial matters online, please could you contact us to discuss this further. (They owe us money)

- we have a zero tolerance policy for certain behaviors. (You was acting like an arsehole)

- we aren't actually open at 3.30am when you say you couldn't get an immediate answer to your email query (we have a life)

- it is difficult for us to ascertain if your food was served cold after you've eaten it all. (Nice try mate)

etc etc.

In most cases I wouldn't ignore a review - I would reply asking that they contact us to find a resolution. It shows that the business cares about its reputation and client satisfaction - which is what most customers are looking for.

RE: Has the worm turned?

Arlo Guthrie — Tue, 09 Feb 2021 15:07:31 GMT

[quote userid="6550" url="~/001/nonclinical/f/life-in-practice-discussions/29667/has-the-worm-turned/228458#228458"]Nice to have a link to send them to the BBC website to concentrate their minds though.[/quote]

Indeed! And actually, I sympathise with the lawyer and think they have set an important precedent there.

RE: Has the worm turned?

Bob Russell — Tue, 09 Feb 2021 15:04:45 GMT

I agree that a polite and robust response is worthwhile. Unfortunately for some they just keep on coming!

Thankfully the last person that kicked up (breeder) suddenly appreciated that she had received really good service from us! The post/review just went away (before we had a chance to respond).

Nice to have a link to send them to the BBC website to concentrate their minds though.

RE: Has the worm turned?

Arlo Guthrie — Tue, 09 Feb 2021 14:15:17 GMT

[quote userid="9239" url="~/001/nonclinical/f/life-in-practice-discussions/29667/has-the-worm-turned/228455#228455"]Better to ignore it in my opinion.[/quote]

I've been completely put off doing business with a company or buying its products on many occasions because of poor reviews. There's always an alternative just a click away these days.

By contrast, if I see a company responding to a complaint politely but robustly, I will ignore the negative review.

Just sayin'

RE: Has the worm turned?

Dinu Catilina — Tue, 09 Feb 2021 14:12:04 GMT

[quote userid="2100" url="~/001/nonclinical/f/life-in-practice-discussions/29667/has-the-worm-turned/228454#228454"]I think the answer is ALWAYS to reply to negative feedback in an almost OTT polite fashion acknowledging the complaint, but refuting it in such a way that you come out of it looking better than the complainant. [/quote]

Better to ignore it in my opinion.