When your employer states in your contract they will organise VDS cover.

RE: When your employer states in your contract they will organise VDS cover.

Sarah Keir — Mon, 19 Oct 2020 12:59:53 GMT

Call the VDS and speak to them - they can do this, for a fee.

I agree that it is part of the trust we have with an employer to sort out the legalities they need to before we start work. However, having been in the same situation as you but only finding out after 4 months when I needed some advice from the VDS and the practice managers response when I asked that he set it up immediately (his response was of course he set it up, he needed to de-scale the kettle as that was more important than checking something he had already done), I don't take anyone's word for it and check with the VDS directly.

RE: When your employer states in your contract they will organise VDS cover.

Richard Stephenson — Sun, 18 Oct 2020 19:59:41 GMT

[quote userid="11590" url="~/001/nonclinical/f/life-in-practice-discussions/29421/when-your-employer-states-in-your-contract-they-will-organise-vds-cover/226000#226000"]This is not a good feeling at all. I understand mistakes are made and I’m sure it was a genuine mistake but I’m still a bit freaked out. I want to see if cover can be back dated but I’m not sure. [/quote]

Elizabeth - whilst checking this is your responsibility as an MRCVS - I'm SURE that both the RCVS and VDS would be very sympathetic to your position if the worst happened and you faced a claim. So DON'T WORRY - These administrative 'cock ups' happen and it is clear that you had taken reasonable precautions to get VDS cover and indeed had been told that this would be provided. I have encountered this happening in large practices as updating VDS cover requires manual processes it can be overlooked. In my experience the VDS would retrospectively activate cover (as long as the practice has been a good VDS member and always puts its vets on cover and this was a simple oversight). No need to lose sleep - it will be fine!!! Incidentally I think the wording of your contract would in itself be a very strong defence for you should an allegation be made (which in itself is extremely unlikely).

RE: When your employer states in your contract they will organise VDS cover.

Evelyn Barbour-Hill — Sun, 18 Oct 2020 14:58:35 GMT

Things are looking up, when young veterinary surgeons even think about checking these things.

In one early job (and this was, I'd like to say, the only employer i had who ever did this sort of thing – some of you might be able to guess who it was) i was ordered to drive a succession of beat-up unreliable vehicles that were not even taxed. Being young and naive I went along with it – there was also an element of joining the game of the charming rogue, as it were. And, without doubt, a certain element too of being scared of the chap. Whether I had VDS cover at that practice I truly have no idea..

At my very first practice when I made a certain cock-up, the boss settled it with money when the nasty letter arrived. I wondered at the time why he didn't call VDS.

RE: When your employer states in your contract they will organise VDS cover.

Bibs — Sun, 18 Oct 2020 14:11:42 GMT

Maybe you’re right. Another lesson learned.

RE: When your employer states in your contract they will organise VDS cover.

Clive Ansell — Sun, 18 Oct 2020 14:07:54 GMT

[quote userid="3169" url="~/001/nonclinical/f/life-in-practice-discussions/29421/when-your-employer-states-in-your-contract-they-will-organise-vds-cover/226005#226005"]We genuinely have an old 110 Landrover County Station Wagon that's V reg - the spare car.[/quote]

The old V reg -1979?

RE: When your employer states in your contract they will organise VDS cover.

Clive Ansell — Sun, 18 Oct 2020 14:06:14 GMT

[quote userid="11590" url="~/001/nonclinical/f/life-in-practice-discussions/29421/when-your-employer-states-in-your-contract-they-will-organise-vds-cover/226000#226000"]It’s a big company that was very particular about getting copies of my passport and RCVS certificate etc. at the beginning of my employment and appears to have offices with people who’s job it is to organise such things.[/quote]

The bigger they are, the more offices there are, and the more managers there are; the less I would be inclined to rely on, or trust them at all. Not that it would be deliberate, but they seem to get so big and cumbersome that they are just incompetent, and left hand doesn't know what the right is doing.

The other thing they seem very good at is playing the blame game, not taking responsibility, and passing the buck.

From experience of a few of the corporates, Medivet are by far the worst.

RE: When your employer states in your contract they will organise VDS cover.

Michael Woodhouse — Sun, 18 Oct 2020 14:04:57 GMT

[quote userid="5012" url="~/001/nonclinical/f/life-in-practice-discussions/29421/when-your-employer-states-in-your-contract-they-will-organise-vds-cover/226003#226003"]Not many practice vehicles are >21 years old [/quote]

We genuinely have an old 110 Landrover County Station Wagon that's V reg - the spare car.

RE: When your employer states in your contract they will organise VDS cover.

Clive Ansell — Sun, 18 Oct 2020 14:00:06 GMT

[quote userid="3169" url="~/001/nonclinical/f/life-in-practice-discussions/29421/when-your-employer-states-in-your-contract-they-will-organise-vds-cover/225999#225999"](Anyone can drive any practice vehicle over 21 - including you, Clive.)[/quote]

Not many practice vehicles are >21 years old

seriously - not in this case, it was for employee named drivers only. This is something I have come across a few times now.

I used to work in the transport industry in my pre-vet life, so I'm pretty clued up to this. Do bosses always check driving licences, and at least recheck them annually too, as well as check legality of employee's vehicles that they use for work, VED, insurance, MOT test?

I remember a case in the 80's where we had an older guy who had been driving 40 tonne juggernauts on continental runs for years, who didn't have a valid licence. Only came to light when he was involved in a minor accident. Scary.

RE: When your employer states in your contract they will organise VDS cover.

Michael Woodhouse — Sun, 18 Oct 2020 13:55:25 GMT

They did for us, but only a few days. I bet this happens all the time, so don't worry. VDS are not the type to leave you high and dry.

RE: When your employer states in your contract they will organise VDS cover.

Bibs — Sun, 18 Oct 2020 13:52:34 GMT

I started a new job and signed a contract that states, “during your employment the company will provide professional indemnity insurance appropriate to your role”. It’s a big company that was very particular about getting copies of my passport and RCVS certificate etc. at the beginning of my employment and appears to have offices with people who’s job it is to organise such things. Several weeks down the line I went on Facebook and saw a comment about it being up to us to check we are covered by the VDS. It had never occurred to me that my employer would not have sorted this out but to settle any doubts I called the VDS in my day off to check. It turns out no indemnity insurance had been set up at all. Now it has been started but there has been a gap where I have not been covered. I am not aware of any pending RCVS complaints or claims but what if one comes a along based on something that I did a week ago? This is not a good feeling at all. I understand mistakes are made and I’m sure it was a genuine mistake but I’m still a bit freaked out. I want to see if cover can be back dated but I’m not sure.

RE: When your employer states in your contract they will organise VDS cover.

Michael Woodhouse — Sun, 18 Oct 2020 13:38:08 GMT

[quote userid="9239" url="~/001/nonclinical/f/life-in-practice-discussions/29421/when-your-employer-states-in-your-contract-they-will-organise-vds-cover/225993#225993"]If your employer made a mistake just let it go[/quote]

I think it was the 3rd day for our new assistant (who's not called Elizabeth!!) when I suddenly realised I'd not notified VDS. I emailed them and said she started on the Monday and could I please have cover from then, they were fine with that.

Ultimately I'd see this as practice's responsibility, with some of that dropped back on you as a professional. You will get mailings directly to you as a covered individual. They also write to you when the cover is ended.

Specifically what happened?

(Anyone can drive any practice vehicle over 21 - including you, Clive.)

RE: When your employer states in your contract they will organise VDS cover.

Clive Ansell — Sun, 18 Oct 2020 08:53:27 GMT

I don't think that would be or is the case.

If you employer said that they were providing you with VDS cover, and it is in your contract, then you should be covered. If not, the mistake is theirs and not yours. Also, it is incumbent on them as employers to make sure you, and all employees, have adequate cover in place. Maybe just a genuine oversight that can be quickly rectified.

Probably sensible to always check these things though, but in all honesty who does?

I had an issue last year while doing a locum. I was scheduled to carry out a home visit in a practice ambulance. When I asked about being insured to drive it, I was told it was OK, but nobody had a clue really, not even the endless stream of managers and directors at head office. Turns out I was not covered, so a good job I asked and didn't drive the vehicle. (Hint - if you're ever unlucky enough to work for Medivet check everything out in detail)

RE: When your employer states in your contract they will organise VDS cover.

Dinu Catilina — Sun, 18 Oct 2020 08:20:45 GMT

Sorry, maybe we weren't too compassionate in this and you are obviously upset, and you have all the right to be. If the worst happened I am confident that the DC will take in to account everything and if you have proof that you thought you were covered then you should be fine. There was a DC case a few years back when a lady was removed from the registered from not having indemnity insurance( and some other failings) even though she was warned prior by the RCVS to take one. The important info is warned prior.

If your employer made a mistake just let it go. If it's not a mistake and you suspect something just go someplace else, you don't want to work there.

RE: When your employer states in your contract they will organise VDS cover.

Bibs — Sun, 18 Oct 2020 07:39:32 GMT

Yes, the thing is I did check but there is a gap between me starting and checking that I’m worried about. I was looking for general opinion from other vets about how reasonable it is to expect every vet to check this on day one. I’m trying to work out how bad this could be if the worst happens and if I have a leg to stand on. So far general opinion on here is that it’s all on me but hopefully it’s not as simple as that.

RE: When your employer states in your contract they will organise VDS cover.

Richard Stephenson — Sat, 17 Oct 2020 23:12:07 GMT

I'm sure you are right on all points - I'm just pointing out that even the best organised and brilliant employers can make mistakes or forget to do something - so on something as vital as your VDS insurance (which you must have to meet Code of Conduct requirements) I think a double check yourself is a very good idea.

RE: When your employer states in your contract they will organise VDS cover.

Bibs — Sat, 17 Oct 2020 19:42:15 GMT

The thing is that when you sign a contract that states someone else is going to organise something like this you trust them and you hope signing an actual contract gives you some bit of protection. I understand it’s my responsibility but I thought I had carried out that responsibility by checking this was in the contract. I also did check for myself that they had done it but after I have started working for them, not before and not at 9am on day one. I don’t think it should just be a case of it’s all on me if something happens. Otherwise what is the point of a contract. The BVA legal advice line came in useful anyway.

RE: When your employer states in your contract they will organise VDS cover.

Richard Stephenson — Sat, 17 Oct 2020 19:18:44 GMT

It is so important I think you should check this yourself - ultimately it is your responsibility. Even the very best employer can forget to do things occasionally

RE: When your employer states in your contract they will organise VDS cover.

Beats — Sat, 17 Oct 2020 14:25:04 GMT

I would add checking car insurance (and road-worthiness) on practice vehicle to that - or, preferably, have your own wheels and business use included on your personal policy.

Depends how competent you think your employer is...

RE: When your employer states in your contract they will organise VDS cover.

Bibs — Sat, 17 Oct 2020 11:42:15 GMT

Well I suggest everyone should check then.

RE: When your employer states in your contract they will organise VDS cover.

Dinu Catilina — Sat, 17 Oct 2020 11:39:25 GMT

I never checked and never had a problem but if something does happen it's still on you to be covered.