VetSurgeon Strapline

RE: VetSurgeon Strapline

Rob Davis — Thu, 05 Mar 2020 19:58:56 GMT

[quote userid="2457" url="~/001/nonclinical/f/site-support-discussions/28899/vetsurgeon-strapline/220015"]From what I can tell from my teenage children, facebook is now just old fashioned and few of the younger generation use it at all. If you can hang around long enough, Arlo Guthrie I think facebook will go the way of myspace when the next platform comes along...[/quote]

This. My children (17-21) barely use facebook at all (the younger two aren't even on it any more). They are much more into instagram, snapchat etc...

RE: VetSurgeon Strapline

Bob Russell — Tue, 03 Mar 2020 15:44:03 GMT

Not awe inspiring but says what it needs to.

RE: VetSurgeon Strapline

Gillian Mostyn — Tue, 03 Mar 2020 14:54:36 GMT

I'm sure you'll survive!

RE: VetSurgeon Strapline

Arlo Guthrie — Tue, 03 Mar 2020 14:51:03 GMT

Yes, I hear that too, I'm just not sure how long I've got. What with the coronavirus and all, might be till the end of the week .

RE: VetSurgeon Strapline

Gillian Mostyn — Tue, 03 Mar 2020 14:45:34 GMT

From what I can tell from my teenage children, facebook is now just old fashioned and few of the younger generation use it at all. If you can hang around long enough, Arlo Guthrie I think facebook will go the way of myspace when the next platform comes along...

Speaking personally, I rarely use facebook for vet related discussion unless I know the OP. Too many trolls.

RE: VetSurgeon Strapline

Bob Russell — Tue, 03 Mar 2020 12:21:46 GMT

I don't disagree with you at all and it is clear that FB is everywhere. Perhaps try to contact those that have moved to FB and see if there is anything you can do to encourage them back. FB would not think twice about poaching!

My head nurse was suggesting an app just this morning!!!

RE: VetSurgeon Strapline

Arlo Guthrie — Tue, 03 Mar 2020 11:58:08 GMT

[quote userid="6550" url="~/001/nonclinical/f/site-support-discussions/28899/vetsurgeon-strapline/220003"]I do wonder if it still comes back to a perception that some on here are fierce.[/quote]

I used to think that. But actually, two things ...

A long time ago, I suspended J G Wray's account, for persistently winding people up the wrong way. I thought that would make the forums a friendlier environment and more people would start to engage.

Sure enough, I think the forums have mellowed considerably over the last year. Sure there are still combative posts, but as a percentage of the total number of posts, they are quite small. Most are helpful.

But has that led to a massive increase in the number of people joining in? Nope, that is not my perception anyway. I'm not sure its made a blind bit of difference. If anything, I wonder if it has slowed things down a tad as people no longer have so many car crashes to come and watch.

[quote userid="6550" url="~/001/nonclinical/f/site-support-discussions/28899/vetsurgeon-strapline/220003"]Perhaps a 'be gentle' thread with very strict be nice rules. We can all make sure it is self-moderated and moved to a tangent if it is getting heated!![/quote]

I certainly agree with that, but again, I don't think it is the be all and end all.

I think the issue is quite simply down to the ubiquitousness of Facebook, and that once subscribed to a group over there, it is so 'in yer face'.

So, I think the two biggest things I can do are:

A) Strengthen the reasons for using vetsurgeon - primarily that as a GP you will get a better quality of response here than on FB, for multiple reasons.

B) I am introducing a sharing option in the forums, so that those of you who use both platforms can share a discussion post TITLE (just the title, not the whole thing) over on Facebook and by email.

c) Possibly then having a web app which adds notifications to your mobile phone.

[quote userid="6550" url="~/001/nonclinical/f/site-support-discussions/28899/vetsurgeon-strapline/220003"]I loath FB with a vengeance and consider it poses some real dangers to users. [/quote]

I'm very divided about it. I think it has a nice specific use for sharing stuff amongst immediate family and friends. Beyond that, I dislike it and I do agree that it poses very real societal threats.

RE: VetSurgeon Strapline

Bob Russell — Tue, 03 Mar 2020 09:49:08 GMT

I have headed over to Facebook once or twice but cannot for the life of me see what the benefit is over Vetsurgeon. I have to admit it is easy to get involved in some of the threads because they are often so 'simple' for the experienced clinician. I do wonder if it still comes back to a perception that some on here are fierce.

Perhaps a 'be gentle' thread with very strict be nice rules. We can all make sure it is self-moderated and moved to a tangent if it is getting heated!! There are a lot of inexperienced vets out there. An example where I did get involved was a budgie with mites! Nice and simple if you have seen it. The person posting was really grateful. At that point I realised I was being sucked into FB so I left.

I loath FB with a vengeance and consider it poses some real dangers to users.

RE: VetSurgeon Strapline

Arlo Guthrie — Sun, 01 Mar 2020 10:13:41 GMT

[quote userid="4181" url="~/001/nonclinical/f/site-support-discussions/28899/vetsurgeon-strapline/219937"]Do people come for the advice from referral practitioners, or the support from a group of (mostly) GP vet peers who are in pretty much the same position, seeing the same issues - be they clinical or non-clinical?[/quote]

But Rob Loxley the point, surely is not what people do now, but

What people want to be able to do in the future
What will keep VetSurgeon relevant and useful in the Facebook age.

As far as question one goes, a system which disseminated questions amongst experts was the second most popular choice in my survey of members last year, after a CPD diary (which is on my todo list, but a much bigger investment).

And as for 2. The problem I face is that if someone asks for advice or support from peers on facebook, they are going to get a lot more answers there. Now I would argue they are poorer provenanced answers, poorly curated, not easy to refer back to, and you cannot claim time spent contributing towards your CPD (well you can, but who is going to sit there and keep a log of how much time they spend on Facebook on CPD qualifying activities?). But I don't seem to make much headway with that argument. People seem to prefer the dopamine hit of a 100 likes on Facebook, not to mention the string of #metoo comments which usually follow.

So, the way I see it, I can continue to do the same old thing and watch as more people drift to Facebook, and I really do believe the forums here will just die out.

Or I can try and innovate and develop new features that offer differentiation from facebook, and, perhaps more importantly, are what members have asked for!

I'm aiming for the latter!

RE: VetSurgeon Strapline

Rob Loxley — Sun, 01 Mar 2020 10:00:05 GMT

[quote userid="2100" url="~/001/nonclinical/f/site-support-discussions/28899/vetsurgeon-strapline/219932"]What I MAY have to do, though, is give the clinical side greater prominence[/quote]

Do people come for the advice from referral practitioners, or the support from a group of (mostly) GP vet peers who are in pretty much the same position, seeing the same issues - be they clinical or non-clinical?

RE: VetSurgeon Strapline

Arlo Guthrie — Sat, 29 Feb 2020 19:39:39 GMT

[quote userid="3169" url="~/001/nonclinical/f/site-support-discussions/28899/vetsurgeon-strapline/219904"]

Vetsurgeon.org - THE place to mass debate on the internet.

Funny is the key :D

[/quote]

I agree, but not sure I'm quite brave enough to go with that strapline!

[quote userid="3169" url="~/001/nonclinical/f/site-support-discussions/28899/vetsurgeon-strapline/219905"]

Arlo Guthrie said:
It may indeed be the case that I have to close down the general discussion forums and JUST focus on the clinical ones. Really focus on making this a centre of clinical excellence.

That would be the final nail. I stick around because of the other chatter. If the forum was just clinical I'd get bored and drift away. Like a cosy pub. You feel like you know the regulars, although holidaymakers and new people to the village are more than welcome.

[/quote]

I was having a really bad hair day. It has been quite tough for me, having put so much into these sites for so long, seeing the growth in the popularity of Facebook, and people from here drifting off over there.

I don't personally use Facebook very much. Share the odd photo. But I have to log in regularly to check on things like our VetSurgeon Facebook news feed and jobs feed. And every time I do I am showered in posts from Veterinary Voices, which, I have to admit, gets me down.

And the day I posted the above comment, I had just seen a post where someone described the VetNurse forums as where nurses used to hang out. It's true, of course, the forums there are much quieter than they once were, but we still get a huge amount of traffic to the jobs and news sections, amongst other things, so Facebook hasn't put me out of business, I'm just very aware of things getting quieter and it saddens me.

Part of the problem, of course, was that VetSurgeon and VetNurse were on old, creaky platforms that really were not very mobile friendly. So the first step was to get that sorted, and I do think it's a huge improvement.

But it's not enough to stop the rot, so to speak. I do feel that if I stand head to head with facebook offering a platform for general discussions, I simply cannot compete, and the forums will probably die out.

But I DO think we can offer so much more than Facebook for clinical discussions, so I've put a huge amount of time and effort and money into developing that side of things, so that we can offer a) Expert help from referral practitioners, b) good provenance for posts on here (ie qualifications, experience of those sharing advice and info, and c) much better curation.

[quote userid="3169" url="~/001/nonclinical/f/site-support-discussions/28899/vetsurgeon-strapline/219905"]I suppose unless you want a stale forum of anonymous clinical questions and nothing else.[/quote]

Of course I don't! I'm not sure I agree with the premise that clinical questions will be stale, or that they will be anonymous.

Anyway, look, I can't think why I would ever close the general discussion forums, I was just on a bit of a downer. What I MAY have to do, though, is give the clinical side greater prominence.

In fact, if we can give people a good experience here when they come to get advice from referral practitioners, I think some will stay and get stuck in with some general discussions.

It's the Expert Help Forums that will give newcomers a reason to come and post here (and give them something you won't get on Facebook). Then not such a huge step to come and get involved in the more general discussions.

RE: VetSurgeon Strapline

Miriam Lodewyks — Sat, 29 Feb 2020 15:43:09 GMT

Yeah I like it.
for what it’s worth I’m seriously considering closing my Facebook account completely. The tendency for posts to drift into the toxic sphere, the ad-bombardment and the endless drivel is making me feel more and more that I’m wasting my time.
probably just stick with Instagram....

RE: VetSurgeon Strapline

Sam — Sat, 29 Feb 2020 11:41:55 GMT

It would be really sad to close down the general discussions. I know I would probably drift away to Facebook!

At least on here we are not bombarded with awful adverts and we can easily find the discussions we are interested in.

The idea of a clinical resource is good, but this is like a community and needs the more general discussions to keep us here.

RE: VetSurgeon Strapline

Jill Butterworth — Sat, 29 Feb 2020 10:53:18 GMT

I agree, I check this site daily, because of the dopamine buzz to see what's going on, you get hooked in by that, which I assume is your business model. I also look at Facebook, to see what friends are up to, and the Vet ones come up spontaneously because of algorithms, not because I search. In daily working life, we are not researching the whole day, difficult cases are uncommon, so you won't have that daily check in thing going on if you close down the forum. Really you are competing with the RCVS Knowledge Evidenced Based Medicine resource and VIN, whose business model is subscription based and more formal CPD and Dr Google himself.

RE: VetSurgeon Strapline

Bob Russell — Sat, 29 Feb 2020 09:46:51 GMT

As Sir Humphrey would say; 'that would be a very brave thing to do, Prime Minister! followed by a Hacker back off!!!

(Should have appeared under the comment regarding Arlo closing the discussions groups)

RE: VetSurgeon Strapline

Anthony Todd — Fri, 28 Feb 2020 17:30:59 GMT

No, please, no! Although I have been subject to more ordure than most, this is the place I wish I had access to when I knew very little, and there were very few to turn to [who, fortunately, apart from the Unis] were very supportive and helpful.

There is no "dumb question"! Just a question to which the poster [and loads of silent others] don't know the answer!

RE: VetSurgeon Strapline

Michael Woodhouse — Fri, 28 Feb 2020 17:19:11 GMT

[quote userid="2100" url="~/001/nonclinical/f/site-support-discussions/28899/vetsurgeon-strapline/219837"]It may indeed be the case that I have to close down the general discussion forums and JUST focus on the clinical ones. Really focus on making this a centre of clinical excellence. [/quote]

I suppose unless you want a stale forum of anonymous clinical questions and nothing else.

RE: VetSurgeon Strapline

Michael Woodhouse — Fri, 28 Feb 2020 17:16:25 GMT

Vetsurgeon.org - THE place to mass debate on the internet

Funny is the key :D

RE: VetSurgeon Strapline

Arlo Guthrie — Fri, 28 Feb 2020 14:39:06 GMT

[quote userid="11308" url="~/001/nonclinical/f/site-support-discussions/28899/vetsurgeon-strapline/219902"]Vetsurgeon.org - free of the phrase 'Hive Mind' [/quote]

RE: VetSurgeon Strapline

Anthony Dennison — Fri, 28 Feb 2020 14:34:53 GMT

Vetsurgeon.org - free of the phrase 'Hive Mind'

RE: VetSurgeon Strapline

Alison Clare Hickman — Fri, 28 Feb 2020 10:40:51 GMT

Hello, RVN here - thoughts are you might want to include the description say 'accredited' or 'peer-reviewed' clinical discussion - this is what you want to specifically promote as your market differentiation isn't it?

RE: VetSurgeon Strapline

Beats — Wed, 26 Feb 2020 21:58:56 GMT

The home of Vets you won't find on facebook

VetSurgeon.org: where vets are smarter than their phones.

Expert-led, free, veterinary clinical chat.

Vet-to-vet case chats with expert-input.

Ask an expert-vet; free CPD.

FREE Structured case-based VET learning, advice and CPD with expert moderation

The home of reliable clinical information for vets.

The veterinary profession's most trusted source of clinical discussion.

Be Vet. Be Smart. Be Free.

RE: VetSurgeon Strapline

Evelyn Barbour-Hill — Wed, 26 Feb 2020 19:09:05 GMT

The home of high quality clinical information and knowledge sharing by experts.

The home of high quality clinical information where knowledge is freely shared by experts.

RE: VetSurgeon Strapline

Arlo Guthrie — Wed, 26 Feb 2020 18:03:18 GMT

[quote userid="5904" url="~/001/nonclinical/f/site-support-discussions/28899/vetsurgeon-strapline/219841"]OK, The home of high quality Veterinary discussion [/quote]

No Tony, not specific enough. As I keep on saying, for general chit chat, Facebook is where it's at.

It's CLINICAL discussion where we can offer better provenance for the opinions, better curation, and more expert engagement (because experts will get rewarded for their effort over here).

And I really don't think I need to specify 'Veterinary' alongside a website called VetSurgeon!!

RE: VetSurgeon Strapline

Anthony Todd — Wed, 26 Feb 2020 17:59:12 GMT

OK, The home of high quality Veterinary discussion