Antibiotics and cats

RE: Antibiotics and cats

Rob Loxley — Sat, 10 Nov 2018 17:49:26 GMT

[quote user="David Mills"]I'd fully support a ban on systemic fluoroquinolones in animals.[/quote]

Not sure I'd go so far (what do you do with the 'ulcerative colitis' in boxers and french bulldogs?) but they should be responsibly used and only where indicated.
The Netherlands, for instance, has pretty tight controls on FQ and 3rd&4th-gen cephalosporin prescribing.

RE: Antibiotics and cats

Francisco Gomez — Sat, 10 Nov 2018 17:25:49 GMT

[quote user="Julian Earl"]

There is no excuse for most pet cats not to receive their tablet.

[/quote]

Well, this was a few years back. I realise I was losing my hair already... https://youtu.be/ZMV3RGtH2gg

Anyway, Jack was a 'difficut' one to do and I still did it. The reasons behind not accepting a tablet varies but the most common (not saying true) are:

- I keep finding tablets in places so I'm not sure if he has had any

- it's pointless you prescribe this, I know full well he won't take them.

- He won't eat if I put anything in it. (this includes metacam solution)

...

Is it best to prescribe and knowing the cat will only have a 1/3 of the course? Implications not just resistance but not knowing if your treatment worked. Or give something that you know the cat had?

I hope you realise I'm playing devils advocate here as I am conscientious and try avoid the product when a better option is indicated. But I even had to deal with complains or excessively long consultations were the refusal from the client is quite extreme to even the point of trust being lost on the prescribing vet.

RE: Antibiotics and cats

Julian Earl — Sat, 10 Nov 2018 17:17:37 GMT

[quote user="Robin Grimmer"]I'm not very sure what you mean by this, Francisco. Do you mean your clients don't like convenia? mine love it! I try to use it responsibly, but it has been a Godsend for all those owners who are emphatic that "he WONT take tablets!" ie they WILL NOT even try![/quote]

Sounds to me like an invitation for me to get on my soapbox: We, s stub=dents ought to be taught how to infallibly give tablets to cats, of the domestic type, not the psychopathic feral of course, because it is easy and simple to do when you know how! It should be a day-one core-skill for vets I'm afraid. I was told how to do it when aged a mere 13 or 14 and in practice I used the technique in front of clients every single day for nigh on forty years! There is no excuse for most pet cats not to receive their tablet. My method was described in my letter and photographs to the Vet. Record in March 2017.

RE: Antibiotics and cats

Clive Ansell — Sat, 10 Nov 2018 11:26:07 GMT

[quote user="David Mills"]I'd fully support a ban on systemic fluoroquinolones in animals.[/quote]

Not sure I would go that far, but maybe some form of control where use has to be recorded and justified, along with any supporting laboratory work, would be a good idea - along the lines of controlled drugs?

RE: Antibiotics and cats

Clive Ansell — Sat, 10 Nov 2018 11:23:28 GMT

I try not to use Convenia in cats, and almost never use fluoroquinolones unless laboratory evidence supports it.

Many clients ask for Convenia, stating they cannot possible medicate their cat etc. Once I point out that it would not be my first choice and its cost, almost all can be persuaded to take tablets. very very few come back saying they've been unable to medicate.

I once threatened a rescue centre to start using Convenia first line. They were in the habit of acquiring and stock piling Synulox. which a colleague and I were determined to stop. Using convenia and not dispensing any form of tablets would have helped achieve that.

RE: Antibiotics and cats

Anthony Todd — Sat, 10 Nov 2018 09:23:03 GMT

[quote user="Beats"]apparently polymixins are a first-line choice for cocci infested ears. i conceded.[/quote]

Polymyxins may kill the cocci but it is the topical steroid, also present, that reduces the allergic exudate on which the cocci depend, which, as usual, everyone fails to realise or acknowledge.

RE: Antibiotics and cats

Evelyn Barbour-Hill — Fri, 09 Nov 2018 22:24:38 GMT

[quote user="Francisco Gomez"]That's what I meant. Once they try it, there's no way you can prescribe them an antibiotic tablet. No matter how much you try to explain if convenia isn't the right one.[/quote]

So don't even let them try it. If they ask about it, tell them they can't have it (and why). Invite them to come in every day for a repeat injection of amoxycillin.

Also ask yourself silently: does this cat really need a prolonged course of systemic antibiotic?

RE: Antibiotics and cats

Beats — Fri, 09 Nov 2018 21:20:46 GMT

[quote user="David Mills"]systemic fluoroquinolones[/quote]

Would you permit topical FQ's and if so why? (I may be reading too much into your post!)

I was pontificating to latest new grad just this week about a pet hate (the frequent promotion of pouring useful systemic antibacterials of critical importance in human health-care down dogs ears) and pointed out that it appeared somewhat ironic that in the same year that plasmid-mediated resistance to the "antibiotic of last resort" reached the UK (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-35153795) that a new marketing authorisation for a polymixin containing otitis treatment for itchy dog ears was "licensed" in the UK. She brought in her BSAVA antimicrobial stewardship poster, hot off the press seemingly, the next day - apparently polymixins are a first-line choice for cocci infested ears. i conceded.

RE: Antibiotics and cats

David Mills — Fri, 09 Nov 2018 21:06:58 GMT

I'd fully support a ban on systemic fluoroquinolones in animals.

Convenia is a tricky one really, as it has its uses, but is overused. Not helped by some horribly soft studies published on its release when it was launched, in respected journals.

RE: Antibiotics and cats

Beats — Fri, 09 Nov 2018 20:27:26 GMT

cats = betamox LA (repeated if necessary) and home on betamox palatable drops or amoxibactin tablets.

I will confess that I also gave veraflox suspension to a kitty last month, but that was a very rare occasion - I am a hypocrite who would support a ban on such behaviour

RE: Antibiotics and cats

Francisco Gomez — Fri, 09 Nov 2018 20:27:18 GMT

[quote user="Julie Innes"]

[quote user="Francisco Gomez"]I do and it only takes one shot to alienate the client forever[/quote]

I'm not very sure what you mean by this, Francisco. Do you mean your clients don't like convenia? mine love it! I try to use it responsibly, but it has been a Godsend for all those owners who are emphatic that "he WONT take tablets!" ie they WILL NOT even try!

[/quote]

That's what I meant. Once they try it, there's no way you can prescribe them an antibiotic tablet. No matter how much you try to explain if convenia isn't the right one.

RE: Antibiotics and cats

Robin Grimmer — Fri, 09 Nov 2018 17:20:11 GMT

[quote user="Julie Innes"]

[quote user="Francisco Gomez"]I do and it only takes one shot to alienate the client forever[/quote]

[/quote]

Long acting amoxycillin will suffice in the majority of cases.

RE: Antibiotics and cats

Bob Russell — Fri, 09 Nov 2018 16:47:24 GMT

I dispense Kesium and it too is generally palatable but there are many cats it is a waste of time dispensing.

So many people have had bad experiences with tablet giving and I agree many will resist or more importantly stop the minute the cat improves.

RE: Antibiotics and cats

Julie Innes — Fri, 09 Nov 2018 16:39:26 GMT

[quote user="Francisco Gomez"]I do and it only takes one shot to alienate the client forever[/quote]

RE: Antibiotics and cats

Francisco Gomez — Fri, 09 Nov 2018 16:07:20 GMT

[quote user="KMurphy"]

I don't stock Convenia

[/quote]

I do and it only takes one shot to alienate the client forever.