Vetting injuries!

RE: Vetting injuries!

Andrew Mellor — Mon, 25 Sep 2017 18:26:52 GMT

Various and innumerable injuries , a few that stand out , kc vaccine for a family with 2 shar peis, first one bit through my left thumb nail lots of cursing and cleaned and dressed it ( as was on own carried on manfully) second one went straight through same nail ! , normally lovely rottie big lad 65kg ish just in for booster , chatting to owner he grabbed my wrist, and must have bruised nerve pain intense at wrist but couldn't feel or move majority of my hand for 45 minutes, that worried me. impaling myself with dental luxator - really dirty mouth, slipped off tooth out through gum into my palm. Steinmann pin impaled base of thumb, actually not to bad but having to retrieve the perfect triangle of sterile glove that was left 12 mm inside my thumb base was really unpleasant.

the worst one for me was a collie that was known to be unpredictable and was sedated to examine a really foul mouth, muzzle on sedated and sparked out , catheter in started inducing ,no blink I thought whip muzzle off and get a look and tube Bxxtxxd clamped down on my thumb , right through, it wasn't the bite it was the infection despite all the irrigation and debridement by myself and the hospital, tracking infection to elbow, iv ab's and bearly able to work for a week that was a killer.

RE: Vetting injuries!

Martin Atkinson — Mon, 25 Sep 2017 14:25:54 GMT

[quote user="Julian Earl"] those clever Swedes developed the MIPs system where the helmet does the rotation instead of your brain. [/quote]I remain to be convinced that MIPS is of much benefit in the sort of helmets we've discussed. The theory is that the system allows your head to move around inside the helmet as it twists following certain types of impact thus reducing the rotational acceleration forces. The fact is that most helmets for recreational pursuits such as riding, cycling and skiing are not on that tight so the head can already rotate inside and indeed most people wear them too loose anyway, unlike motor racing helmets. I have a Swedish ski/snowboard helmet (actually most helmet manufacturers now offer a MIPS option in their top-of-the range products) with MIPS but much more important to me is that its built to a much higher standard than SNELL requirements to offer me protection at much higher speeds than the average recreational skier. Plus most important: its orange so matches my kit!! Incidentally I'm modelling it in my avatar.

RE: Vetting injuries!

Thomas Johnson — Mon, 25 Sep 2017 13:14:11 GMT

[quote user="Julian Earl"]

. I have managed to impale my palm with a 5cm 18-gauge needle. You know the plastic covers for needles? After injecting the cow I replaced the cap and casually tapped it onto the needle to make it secure. Alas I didn't notice that it had dropped off and instead, the needle went all the way through my palm at the base of my thumb! My palm went almost as as blue as the air did! Luckily the farmer did not spot this idiotic accident. My wife, a nurse, tells me that nurses are not allowed to replace needle covers for this reason! Now she tells me!!

[/quote]

I also once impaled my palm with a 5cm 18-gauge needle, the problem in my case was that the needle cap shattered as I replaced it on the needle. It turned out the owner of the pet sheep I was about to euthanase was a human nurse and she did a lovely job of bandaging my hand.

RE: Vetting injuries!

Mark Hedberg — Mon, 25 Sep 2017 10:46:44 GMT

The scar on my upper lip and chin are from a labrador. Recumbent dog, helping the client lift it up the practice stairs (some years ago now, old practice) - dog whipped around and tried to perform a face-ectomy.

Hair doesn't grow there anymore. :p

RE: Vetting injuries!

Tim Browning — Mon, 25 Sep 2017 10:40:05 GMT

I don't understand the no recapping rule now widespread. I used to get censured for walking about with an uncapped needle though it was always only me who got needled occasionally. Surely it depends on what is happening with what drugs?

RE: Vetting injuries!

Niall Connell — Sat, 23 Sep 2017 14:50:50 GMT

[quote user="Julian Earl"]

My wife, a nurse, tells me that nurses are not allowed to replace needle covers for this reason! Now she tells me!!

[/quote]

Vet students are told not to recap needles now. Of course, I was a nightmare for holding the needle cap in my mouth....not good

RE: Vetting injuries!

Julian Earl — Sat, 23 Sep 2017 13:24:09 GMT

RE: Vetting injuries!

Niall Connell — Sat, 23 Sep 2017 12:39:46 GMT

I once managed to impale two of my fingers with a 1.6mm arthodesis wire which skipped off the dog’s olecranon I was drilling. The blood spurted impressively and the nurse shrieked with hysterical laughter. Worst injury I saw was when I was sitting in the prep room, writing up notes and I heard a colleague roar,”Oh you f****ing C*nt! You B**tard!” I thought that seemed excessive so I went through to see what was the matter. My experienced colleague and friend had walked past a couple with their GSD to see another case. Without warning, the dog turned it’s head and sank it’s teeth into his hand as he walked by. It looked really horrendous, intestines hanging out of his hand and everything. The owners seemed surprisingly unconcerned. My friend required 2 GAs and surgery to repair his hand. The dog went on to bite another two people then I had to put it down. I can remember doing that procedure with the image of the hand in my head and I was very nervous indeed.

RE: Vetting injuries!

Wren — Sat, 23 Sep 2017 10:15:05 GMT

[quote user="Julian Earl"] I do not think they offer protection against a kicking horse because they need the automatic inflation system before impact, currently triggered by leaving your bike behind! Also the gas cylinders are not rechargeable so they need replacing after one inflation = very expensive.[/quote]

Air jackets are widely used in horse riding and supposed to protect against crush injuries, but you're right, you need to fall off the horse before they're triggered. The technology came from motor bike protective wear. While you do need to replace the gas canister each time they are triggered they are only around £17, so not too bad. If I was falling off often enough to find this prohibitively expensive I'd probably be better off finding another sport ....

RE: Vetting injuries!

Julian Earl — Fri, 22 Sep 2017 23:25:36 GMT

[quote user="Jill Butterworth"]Yes, counter-intuitively, helmet don't prevent concussion. Have you seen the Swedish Hovding cyclists' neck 'airbag'?[/quote]

I speak from experience of course and my top-quality helmet saved my life but did not prevent a basal skull fracture, multiple brain haemorrhages in a crash involving nothing but my head and the ground!

I have seen the Swedish airbag and they are effective against direct impact but do not protect against being scraped along the floor at speed. For this reason, they are not permitted in races. I do not think they offer protection against a kicking horse because they need the automatic inflation system before impact, currently triggered bya change in body-position! Also the gas cylinders are not rechargeable so they need replacing after one inflation = very expensive.

Regarding the rotation-effect that causes a lot of brain damage, those clever Swedes developed the MIPs system where the helmet does the rotation instead of your brain. Available in just a few brands so far.

For more details, A website is here: http://mipsprotection.com/technology/

RE: Vetting injuries!

Edward Jones — Fri, 22 Sep 2017 15:39:13 GMT

[quote user="Clive Ansell"]

[...] hamsters a different story though - bar stewards!

Most painful bite was from a rat, named Lenny, belong to a big Afro Caribbean chap - that really hurt.

[/quote]

I've never been convinced of the merits of handling a conscious rodent. If needs must I prefer to find an enthusiastic nurse to help

RE: Vetting injuries!

Martin Atkinson — Fri, 22 Sep 2017 14:12:03 GMT

[quote user="Julian Earl"]I was caught by a green iguana about 1.2 metres long with a lameness....My hand had a nice perforations visible as a result [/quote]Doesn't have to be that big I saw a fairly small Gecko gave me a similar injury. We had a 2 metre alligator in a few months ago for an export health certificate - I admit I didn't check its teeth, it had already bitten its handler and nearly removed his thumb!

RE: Vetting injuries!

Clive Ansell — Fri, 22 Sep 2017 11:41:17 GMT

I had my first dog bite of my 21 year career about a month ago. A previously gentle dog with no history of aggression at all bit my thumb as I tried to give a KC vaccine.

Swollen thumb and black nailbed, which has healed without antibiotics despite everyone else in the practice telling my I ought to take them as a precaution. I just kept it clean with chlorhexidine.

Cats and hamsters a different story though - bar stewards!

Most painful bite was from a rat, named Lenny, belong to a big Afro Caribbean chap - that really hurt.

RE: Vetting injuries!

Marie Kubiak — Fri, 22 Sep 2017 11:07:32 GMT

[quote user="Julian Earl"]Can one apply a dog-muzzle to an iguana? [/quote]

No but vetwrap around the mouth works well!

RE: Vetting injuries!

Julian Earl — Thu, 21 Sep 2017 17:52:32 GMT

My worst bite was from a GSD lying in the road with a broken back next to Burnley bus station. The police called me out and in the darkness I gave an initial cursory examination to try and identify why it was lying in the road , unable to stand. Of course, I should have applied a muzzle immediately because as soon as I gently ran my fingers down the body, it whipped round and sank its incisor in my right forearm, the scar of which is still just visible some thirty three years later. It swelled a bit later as well! All my own mistake!

Otherwise, I was caught by a green iguana about 1.2 metres long with a lameness. It was nice and calm but decided it did not like a stranger handling it and clamped its jaws on my hand. They do not have big teeth but they have a lot, all very sharp. My hand had a nice perforations visible as a result Can one apply a dog-muzzle to an iguana? Vegetarian they might be but they know how to bite!

RE: Vetting injuries!

Anthony Dennison — Wed, 20 Sep 2017 11:42:07 GMT

[quote user="Jill Butterworth"]

Yes, counter-intuitively, helmet don't prevent concussion. Have you seen the Swedish Hovding cyclists' neck 'airbag'?

[/quote]

In rugby, there's a big thing about scrum caps at the moment as they don't protect againast concussion but a lot of rugby clubs are insisting the mini and junior teams wear them. They're only designed to prevent cauliflower ears and abrasions.

RE: Vetting injuries!

Jill Butterworth — Tue, 19 Sep 2017 21:34:36 GMT

Yes, counter-intuitively, helmet don't prevent concussion. Have you seen the Swedish Hovding cyclists' neck 'airbag'?

RE: Vetting injuries!

Martin Atkinson — Tue, 19 Sep 2017 10:30:58 GMT

[quote user="Jill Butterworth"]The newer Snell standard does try to replicate the impact of a kick:[/quote]The problem with any helmet is not just that it has to prevent injury from the impact itself but the acceleration/deceleration forces on the brain as it moves around in the skull following impact. This requires technical compressible material within the helmet not just a hardshell and preferably a MIPS system. Don't know too much about riding helmets but cycle helmets are only really designed for low speed impact: falling off at 15 mph not being hit by a car at 30 or more and ski/snowboard helmets only for something like 25 kph - fortunately most recreational skiers don't go faster than that but it is easy to reach over 130 kph even on a pisted run.

RE: Vetting injuries!

Jill Butterworth — Tue, 19 Sep 2017 09:13:55 GMT

The newer Snell standard does try to replicate the impact of a kick:

Snell E2001
This is the newest standard, developed in America by the Snell Institute. It is a higher performance standard which includes all aspects of ASTM and PAS 015 but with a sharper horseshoe anvil (to replicate a horse kick or impact with a sharp surface), higher impacts and an additional hemispherical anvil to represent an uneven but not sharp surface such as a tree, fence or cobbled surface.

RE: Vetting injuries!

Michael Woodhouse — Mon, 18 Sep 2017 00:46:30 GMT

[quote user="Charlotte Marshall"]Though cows can be just as bad as horses when it comes to injuries![/quote]

Quite. I had to have surgery to reattach my ulnar collateral ligament in my thumb after a cow kick.

[quote user="bob lehner"]

I'm always slightly bemused as to how few equine practices seem to make much of a deal about ppe - despite all the BEVA survey publicity and plenty of anecdotes....

Hopefully the universities will play a part in changing the current culture by drumming into students the potential hazards when dealing with the equine patient.

[/quote]

It's all rather tricky. There is an argument (carried over from cycling) that helmets may not offer as much protection and encourage greater risk taking behaviour because of a false sense of security. I've looked up the testing of riding helmets and they are not tested against kicks. I know of a builder who lost 2 toes because his foot was crushed and the steel toe cap in his boot deformed and chopped them off - chances are they would have been ok and just sore without the PPE.

Maybe we just need to say 'no' to more dangerous situations?

That said most of my injuries have come out of nowhere doing things I've done a thousand times before. I don't know what the solution is but I don't think its PPE.

RE: Vetting injuries!

Charlotte Marshall — Sun, 17 Sep 2017 22:55:14 GMT

I think cat bites in small animal practice are the worst. I am just waiting to see if my finger will regain full flexibility after the worst cat bite I or any in my practice have had. Instead of biting and hanging on or biting and letting go as is usually the case, the cat chewed and I ended up with about 12 holes in my finger before I could get it off.

I am just grateful that I was lucky enough not to get injured when I did large animal practice as I have heard plenty of stories. Though cows can be just as bad as horses when it comes to injuries!

RE: Vetting injuries!

bob lehner — Sun, 17 Sep 2017 17:38:59 GMT

[quote user="Jill Butterworth"]I agree this is a step forward, but hats don't work in the back of the car...[/quote]

Again - I couldn't agree more - but you've got to start somewhere.

I'm always slightly bemused as to how few equine practices seem to make much of a deal about ppe - despite all the BEVA survey publicity and plenty of anecdotes....

Hopefully the universities will play a part in changing the current culture by drumming into students the potential hazards when dealing with the equine patient.

RE: Vetting injuries!

David Mills — Fri, 15 Sep 2017 20:32:25 GMT

[quote user="Anthony Dennison"]

[quote user="Neil Wheadon"]

It's entertaining though and if I met them, I'd buy both of them a drink

London Vet Show?

Neil

[/quote]

If you do, I'l bring the popcorn to watch!

[/quote]

I hope you can eat quickly. It'd be a first round intellectual knock out. Almost cruel. Atko daughters as ring girls.

RE: Vetting injuries!

Jill Butterworth — Fri, 15 Sep 2017 19:26:04 GMT

[quote user="bob lehner"]Happily PSS now addresses this and it is a Core standard requirement for Eq practices to provide and use PPE inc. hard hats - and it is something I am very happy indeed to promote in my work as a PSS assessor. I think it is largely a culture/age thing and whilst the senior partner probably wouldn't dream of wearing a hard hat, if younger colleagues do so, then it will hopefully eventually be accepted and seen as the norm.[/quote]I agree this is a step forward, but hats don't work in the back of the car...

The girl in this picture had a small blow to her left temple, the result of a playful kick when turning a horse out: it happened in the briefest moment. She nearly died, the dramatic scar is a bone flap to remove the clot on her brain.

www.thinkaheadcampaign.org

THAT's why it's infuriating. Of course it was her free choice not to wear her hat, but ask her, her family and her employer which they would have preferred in hindsight.

RE: Vetting injuries!

Anthony Dennison — Fri, 15 Sep 2017 16:39:17 GMT

[quote user="Neil Wheadon"]

It's entertaining though and if I met them, I'd buy both of them a drink

London Vet Show?

Neil

[/quote]

If you do, I'l bring the popcorn to watch!