Vote for your Topic of the Month

RE: Vote for your Topic of the Month

Arlo Guthrie — Tue, 08 Aug 2017 13:18:19 GMT

Just to keep you all posted, we've got our first Topic of the Month Brainstorming coming along soon - towards the end of this month.

It's the winning subject from the poll at the start of this thread: Use of antibiotics in common cases, and we have our first guest moderator lined up for the event.

Sorry it has taken a while - it's the usual thing of trying to juggle rather a lot of things. But once we have the first under our belts, they'll become a regular feature ...

RE: Vote for your Topic of the Month

Evelyn Barbour-Hill — Mon, 05 Jun 2017 17:52:19 GMT

I've made a tangent for this thread, Mac. It's under a new thread now entitled Transfer Factor.

https://www.vetsurgeon.org/uk/general/f/6/t/25845.aspx

RE: Vote for your Topic of the Month

Mac Barksdale — Mon, 05 Jun 2017 16:14:46 GMT

Dear Mac, it's not necessary to get any private e-mail addresses. You can post the documents on this site for all to see. And you could answer the simple questions:

What is your product? It is called "Transfer Factor" these "Messenger Molecules" [used by the immune system to communicate with the somatic cells.] The name was adapted when Dr Shepherd Lawrence in 1949 washed some very small molecules off human white cells and injected them into an immunologically naive human subject and found he had "transferred" immune data from one person to another. Transfer Factor is now an array of data carrying "Messenger Molecules" marketed since 1995 or so. My personal experience with it has been since 1997. I will be happy to answer any questions.

M. T. Barksdale DVM

What does it do?

What is a Transfer Factor?

What does it transfer from what to what?

RE: Vote for your Topic of the Month

Arlo Guthrie — Mon, 05 Jun 2017 14:24:18 GMT

[quote user="Mac Barksdale"]I apologize for talking about my product and favorite topic Immunology on this forum.[/quote]

Absolutely no need to apologise!

But ...

Really, since you're extolling the virtues of this product publicly, the information I asked for should likewise be posted publicly, not emailed privately to one member.

and ...

Evelyn is a man's name too, and in this case, she is not a she, she is a he!

(Though don't worry, you aren't the first, and sure you won't be the last)

RE: Vote for your Topic of the Month

Evelyn Barbour-Hill — Mon, 05 Jun 2017 14:04:31 GMT

[quote user="Mac Barksdale"]

Arlo Guthrie:

I apologize for talking about my product and favorite topic Immunology on this forum. I have tried to get a private e-mail addy from Doctor Evelyn Barbour-Hill with out successs. Perhaps she will take notice of your note and favor me with her e-mail addy!

Regards,

Mac Barksdale, DVM

[/quote]

Dear Mac, it's not necessary to get any private e-mail addresses. You can post the documents on this site for all to see. And you could answer the simple questions:

What is your product?

What does it do?

What is a Transfer Factor?

What does it transfer from what to what?

RE: Vote for your Topic of the Month

Mac Barksdale — Mon, 05 Jun 2017 13:51:20 GMT

Arlo Guthrie:

Regards,

Mac Barksdale, DVM

RE: Vote for your Topic of the Month

Gillian Mostyn — Mon, 05 Jun 2017 12:37:18 GMT

[quote user="Arlo Guthrie"]Can I ask you to avoid making vague claims, and instead provide a clear synopsis, i.e. name of product / active, mode of action (or proposed mode of action), plus any evidence to support efficacy (ie published, peer-reviewed studies), so that anyone interested can evaluate properly.[/quote]

Probably also relevant to know whether the veterinary surgeon encouraging the use of a product has any financial investment in it, and therefore a conflict of interest?

p.s.I am loving the footnote of the web pages.

These statements have not been evaluated by the Food and Drug Administration. These products are not intended to diagnose, treat, cure, or prevent any disease.

sorry Arlo - I'll go away now!

RE: Vote for your Topic of the Month

Arlo Guthrie — Mon, 05 Jun 2017 09:07:12 GMT

[quote user="Kate Richardson"]Arlo Guthrie could you make it a requirement of anyone from industry joining in on the forum to have some form of biography. At least I assume Mac Barksdale is from industry. [/quote]

Mac Barksdale is registered as a retired veterinary surgeon (DVM).

Hi, Mac

[quote user="Mac Barksdale"]

OK quick outline of mechanism. Product "Reorganizes" Immune System. Increases Immune Activity 437%. Eliminates Auto Immune. Important to note effects are NOT like those of a drug. Individuals Immune System does the work! NOT the product itself ! Effective in Equine PPID which convinces me there is an auto immune phase in its pathology. Paper in 2004 details correction of 23 cases PPID. Submitted to AAEP. Height of effect of single oral dose; 5 days; half life 15 days; some effect can be noted out to 30-35 days.

Not an easy concept to accept ! We are accustomed to thinking in terms of physiological effect by a drug. I have to be careful not to accurately describe the several effects to the point of disbelief ! ![/quote]

Can I ask you to avoid making vague claims, and instead provide a clear synopsis, i.e. name of product / active, mode of action (or proposed mode of action), plus any evidence to support efficacy (ie published, peer-reviewed studies), so that anyone interested can evaluate properly.

Failing that, we should probably bring this discussion to a close (it is off-topic as well).

RE: Vote for your Topic of the Month

Clive Ansell — Mon, 05 Jun 2017 08:40:54 GMT

It seems there is more than one type of transfer factor, unsure which one I would choose. The one with green tea and pomegranate looks promising, the ingredients look similar to that of a sports drink (Except for the colostrum of course)

We were fed colostrum, "beastings", pudding as kids (Yuk!) we had to eat it all up too, it was vile - better than catching FIP though I suppose.

https://www.researchednutritionals.com/product-category/health-products/transfer-factor

RE: Vote for your Topic of the Month

Judith Archbold — Mon, 05 Jun 2017 07:56:10 GMT

I've just read all about "Transfer Factors" on Dr.Mac's website ( found it via his Linkdin page).

Now I completely understand how they cure FIP.

They work in a similar way to "Lorenzo's Oil"!

RE: Vote for your Topic of the Month

Kate Richardson — Sun, 04 Jun 2017 23:33:40 GMT

Arlo Guthrie could you make it a requirement of anyone from industry joining in on the forum to have some form of biography. At least I assume Mac Barksdale is from industry.

And I'd still like an answer to[quote user="Kate Richardson"]what do you mean by FIP positive- is there a diagnostic test (other than histopathology) that's been available for nearly 20 years that none of us know about? [/quote]

If you mean corona virus positive then that is well known not to be diagnostic for FIP.

RE: Vote for your Topic of the Month

Evelyn Barbour-Hill — Sun, 04 Jun 2017 23:28:48 GMT

[quote user="Mac Barksdale"]Licensed as a Nutriceutical "Transfer Factor" ![/quote]

Yes but what is it?

What is a "transfer factor"?

What does it do?

Is the one you sell the same as this one: "(made from cow colostrum (milk)), bulking agent (maltodextrin), gelatine and water." ?

What's the mode of action (hypothesise if you are not sure)?

Mac, if you have these papers as pdfs, you can post them on this site for all to read: go to "My Account" thence to "My Photos and Files".

RE: Vote for your Topic of the Month

J G Wray — Sun, 04 Jun 2017 23:19:17 GMT

[quote user="Mac Barksdale"]

Licensed as a Nutriceutical "Transfer Factor" !

[/quote]

https://unitedkingdom.4life.com/kayb

What noise does Anas platyrhynchos make?

RE: Vote for your Topic of the Month

Mac Barksdale — Sun, 04 Jun 2017 22:52:14 GMT

Licensed as a Nutriceutical "Transfer Factor" !

RE: Vote for your Topic of the Month

Evelyn Barbour-Hill — Sun, 04 Jun 2017 22:03:43 GMT

[quote user="Mac Barksdale"]Not an easy concept to accept ! We are accustomed to thinking in terms of physiological effect by a drug. I have to be careful not to accurately describe the several effects to the point of disbelief ! ![/quote]

That's OK. I do have an open mind, as should we all. But, roughly speaking, what is the product?

RE: Vote for your Topic of the Month

Kate Richardson — Sun, 04 Jun 2017 08:51:05 GMT

[quote user="Mac Barksdale"]

Evelyn Barbour-Hill: Please send me your e-mail addy and I will send a copy of the 1999 FIP Paper. 28 cats [100%] Sero-converted from FIP Positive to FIP Negative and were rehomed. Treated numerous cats last 18 years.

Mac mac.barkasdale@yahoo.com

[/quote]

what do you mean by FIP positive- is there a diagnostic test (other than histopathology) that's been available for nearly 20 years that none of us know about?

And whats an addy?

RE: Vote for your Topic of the Month

Mac Barksdale — Sun, 04 Jun 2017 00:47:31 GMT

RE: Vote for your Topic of the Month

Evelyn Barbour-Hill — Sat, 03 Jun 2017 22:55:24 GMT

[quote user="Mac Barksdale"]

Mac mac.barkasdale@yahoo.com

[/quote]

Why not give us a quick outline of the principles now?

RE: Vote for your Topic of the Month

Mac Barksdale — Sat, 03 Jun 2017 22:09:22 GMT

Mac mac.barkasdale@yahoo.com

RE: Vote for your Topic of the Month

Clive Ansell — Sat, 03 Jun 2017 07:44:14 GMT

[quote user="Mac Barksdale"]Suggest discussion of some of the most and difficult conditions to Diagnose and treat. Equine PPID, Feline FIP and Corona Overload are easy and effective to treat. Yet most veterinarians continue to Euthanize these cases ![/quote]

I would be interested to know how you manage cases of effusive FIP. I have had 2 cases, in 2 different practices, this year. One has been euthanased because of rapid deterioration despite symptomatic therapy, and the other is heading in the same direction. I usually advise PTS once I have a fairly sure diagnosis.

RE: Vote for your Topic of the Month

Beats — Sat, 03 Jun 2017 07:31:52 GMT

[quote user="Evelyn Barbour-Hill"]

[quote user="Mac Barksdale"]the FIP and Corona Overload Feline cases that are often Euthanized. [/quote]

So, come on, what's the wonderful treatment?

[/quote]

I think mis-diagnosis (and therefore mis-euthanasia) might be what Mac refers to (i.e. high serum coronavirus titre being mis-interpreted as diagnosis of FIP).

Here is some info on suggested treatments, but i don't think they're terribly effective: http://www.catvirus.com/treatment.htm

RE: Vote for your Topic of the Month

Evelyn Barbour-Hill — Fri, 02 Jun 2017 23:33:57 GMT

[quote user="Mac Barksdale"]the FIP and Corona Overload Feline cases that are often Euthanized. [/quote]

So, come on, what's the wonderful treatment? Could it be Mountain Air?

RE: Vote for your Topic of the Month

Mac Barksdale — Fri, 02 Jun 2017 23:17:28 GMT

Sorry ! I should not have included PPID along with the FIP and Corona Overload Feline cases that are often Euthanized. Certainly we do not Euthanize Equine PPID cases. MAC

RE: Vote for your Topic of the Month

Mac Barksdale — Fri, 02 Jun 2017 23:12:11 GMT

Macsays: My understanding is that there are 4 strains of Corona Virus. One of these has a tendency to mutate into the FIP virus. Corona Virus "overload" appears to favor the mutation of that strain into the FIP Virus. Thus Corona Virus overload favors the mutation into FIP.

This is of course a great oversimplification of a very very complex phenomena.

If the cellular immune system is very weak, the virus can multiply virtually uncontrolled. A "wet" form of FIP develops. In this form, large amounts of fluid accumulate in the chest and abdomen due to damage to blood vessels and subsequent leaking of fluid and protein into the surrounding tissues.

The damage to the body from FIPV is not so much due to the virus itself, but to the body's response to it. Complexes of FIPV and antibodies the cat produces against it are deposited on the walls of blood vessels. Macrophages, which are cells that eat cellular debris and foreign material, consume the virus and the virus replicates inside these cells. These macrophages are also deposited along blood vessels and in tissues. When they accumulate in large numbers they can form granulomas.

Which cats are more likely to develop FIP?

As you would imagine, the cats most likely to develop FIP are those with the weakest immune systems. This includes kittens, cats infected with feline leukemia virus (FeLV), and geriatric cats.

The largest number of FIP cases occurs in young cats. Kittens are often infected when they are 4 to 6 weeks old, when the antibody protection they received from their mothers through the milk is declining. Kittens usually start showing signs of FIP when they are between 3 months and 2 years of age. Most of the kittens with FIP die between 8 and 18 months of age.

When infections with feline leukemia virus (FeLV) were more common, infections with FeLV and FIPV were often seen together because FeLV suppressed the immune system. Now that FeLV is less common only 5% of cats with FIP are also infected with FeLV.

We rarely see FIP in cats between 3 and 10 years of age. However, starting at 10-12 years of age, the immune systems of these older cats apparently decline, making them more susceptible.

FIP has been shown to be more common in certain breeds and lines. It appears to be more common in Persians, for example. It is unclear whether these breeds are more susceptible because of their genetics or whether they are exposed to FCoV more often since many of them live or come from catteries.

Although we separate FIP into 2 forms, wet and dry, there is really a gradient between the two forms, and we may often see signs of both forms.

Dry or Noneffusive Form: Dry FIP occurs in approximately ¼ of the cats with FIP. Generally, the signs of the dry form come on more slowly.

RE: Vote for your Topic of the Month

Martin Atkinson — Fri, 02 Jun 2017 09:31:06 GMT

[quote user="Mac Barksdale"] Feline FIP and Corona Overload are easy and effective to treat.[/quote]Really. FIP is one of the most challenging conditions to treat and I don't recall ever diagnosing a Coronavirus overload let alone euthanasing it. As the venerable Mr Mills says - enlighten us.