EXTREME VETTING

RE: EXTREME VETTING

Sarah Jane Denny — Thu, 16 Feb 2017 12:52:45 GMT

[quote user="Neil Wheadon"]

Am I not the only one checking out this thread for thoughts on spaying cats on mountain tops or cleansing cows on cliff edges......disappointed from Somerset

(Please visit the site to view this video)

[/quote]

Thanks to everyone who answered. Yes will look into freedom fence etc. Something like that is needed. But also I was thinking of Trump's EXTREME VETTING too. One US political commentator has pointed out that the US needs EXTREME VETTING for presidential nominees. Ha ha!

And Thank you Neil. I thought this title might inspire some ideas of what EXTREME VETERINARY might involve...

RE: EXTREME VETTING

Neil Wheadon — Wed, 15 Feb 2017 21:32:45 GMT

Am I not the only one checking out this thread for thoughts on spaying cats on mountain tops or cleansing cows on cliff edges......disappointed from Somerset

www.youtube.com/watch

RE: EXTREME VETTING

Bob Russell — Tue, 14 Feb 2017 12:48:33 GMT

I put our Staffie to sleep on Christmas Eve aged over 16yrs.

Without a Freedom Fence around our fields she would have not survived for a fraction of this. She received a shock on two occasi9ons that I recall. Learned not to go too close again. She did know if the battery was missing and occasionally 'tested' the water to see if there was a warning buzz.

Not cruel used properly and very different to the so called training collars. These should not be in the hands of the general public and pretty much have no value in training IMO.

Don't compare perimeter collars with training ones. With one the dog learns and makes a choice, the other is punishment (even if supposed to distract).

RE: EXTREME VETTING

Rob Davis — Mon, 13 Feb 2017 12:08:03 GMT

[quote user="Eilidh Corr"]They're a genuinely terrible concept with the potential to be extremely harmful and dangerous.[/quote]

I can only assume you have no experience of the Freedom Fence. As Evelyn has said, they are perfectly safe and very effective if used correctly. You do need to train the dogs to the fence initially, but they quickly learn and then pretty much never receive the "shock" (which as Evelyn has said can be adjusted and is very mild) as they learn to respond to the audible signal.

Shock collars used for training can be a disaster and definitely should not be used by the general public (if at all).

RE: EXTREME VETTING

Evelyn Barbour-Hill — Sun, 12 Feb 2017 23:30:42 GMT

[quote user="Eilidh Corr"]

Cats don't generally exercise their potential to cause extensive physical damage to unsuspecting humans when highly aroused.

[/quote]

Sorry but I genuinely don't understand what you are trying to say.

RE: EXTREME VETTING

Eilidh Corr — Sun, 12 Feb 2017 23:13:55 GMT

Cats don't generally exercise their potential to cause extensive physical damage to unsuspecting humans when highly aroused.

RE: EXTREME VETTING

Evelyn Barbour-Hill — Sun, 12 Feb 2017 22:41:14 GMT

[quote user="Eilidh Corr"]They're a genuinely terrible concept with the potential to be extremely harmful and dangerous.[/quote]

Sorry but that's nonsense.

[quote user="Eilidh Corr"]Shock collars have the potential to actually teach a dog something if in highly skilled hands (although it's a rare occasion that they're necessary in highly skilled hands, because highly skilled trainers are likely to have many better methods of teaching).[/quote]

The "shock collar" is something completely different.

[quote user="Eilidh Corr"]There is no way of knowing what associations a dog will make when it's shocked by these fences and they carry the risks of bolting, injury, accidents and obviously the development of behavioural problems.[/quote]

Not if the thing is used correctly according to the instructions that come with it. I actually object to the use of the word "shock" in this context. Even the maximum stimulus is no more than the slight jolt of "static' you may get from a car door handle (anybody remember when cars had little chains dangling from the rear bumper?)A Freedom Fence has adjustable stimuli and you start with the lowest – I tried the stimuli on myself and the lowest was barely perceptible. If you take the trouble to set the thing up right, the dog may never receive more than one stimulus ever, because it learns to recognise the audible warning that is given at a greater distance and then rapidly learns the boundary which to begin with you have marked with little flags. Quite often people forget to renew the batteries in the collar, but the dog continues to respect the boundary.

Obviously a physical dog-proof boundary may be better (and cheaper) but this is not always practicable or wise. The joke is, in Wales it's illegal to use a Freedom Fence but there's nothing to prevent you using the familiar ordinary electric fence, which gives a much larger and more painful stimulus, a genuine shock, and gives no pre-warning.

Don't use a Freedom Fence, but do use barbed wire, or a hedge of blackthorn or roses – the logic?

[quote user="Eilidh Corr"]The one person local to us who uses one is at the practice with tiresome regulatory to collect his dog which has been picked up running panicked in the street. The dog is a nervous wreck.[/quote]

Then he hasn't got a proper one, or he's misusing it, or both.

Daniel Mills has just completed and published some extensive research on its use with cats. The adverse effects were slight, if any.

RE: EXTREME VETTING

Eilidh Corr — Sun, 12 Feb 2017 09:26:23 GMT

They're a genuinely terrible concept with the potential to be extremely harmful and dangerous. Shock collars have the potential to actually teach a dog something if in highly skilled hands (although it's a rare occasion that they're necessary in highly skilled hands, because highly skilled trainers are likely to have many better methods of teaching). There is no way of knowing what associations a dog will make when it's shocked by these fences and they carry the risks of bolting, injury, accidents and obviously the development of behavioural problems.

The one person local to us who uses one is at the practice with tiresome regulatory to collect his dog which has been picked up running panicked in the street. The dog is a nervous wreck.

RE: EXTREME VETTING

Evelyn Barbour-Hill — Sat, 11 Feb 2017 17:38:22 GMT

[quote user="Eilidh Corr"]Build a higher fence,[/quote]

Or if necessary invest in a Freedom Fence while you still can. You're not in Wales are you? The stupid Welsh Assembly banned them and the stupid "minister" refused to budge at the quinquennial review. BSAVA didn't help, with a stupid "official opinion" that confused them with "shock collars".

Sorry, bit of a sore point.

RE: EXTREME VETTING

janine redman — Sat, 11 Feb 2017 15:26:31 GMT

one of our vets went to get a new puppy and found it was a litter being sold out of the back of a van with a questionable mother present. Only one tiny pup left .knew she should have walked away but couldn't . She now has an adorable little dog with a big heart murmur . Didn't think to check its heart before purchase. Pedigree and KC registration have never been sent. However it has the most gorgeous temperament and it's here to stay.

RE: EXTREME VETTING

Utlendigur — Sat, 11 Feb 2017 11:17:18 GMT

[quote user="Sarah Wheatley"]She chases cars, she likes to rub her backside on my lovely expensive pure wool patterned rug and she does occasionally jump over the fence into the neighbours garden.[/quote]

[quote user="Sarah Wheatley"]Am I a crap vet for not forseeing these problems. [/quote]

Must admit my thought was that those are pretty minor problems. It's not like she's aggressive or guarding, or constantly barking and upsetting the neighbours. Two of the five dogs I've had were unclaimed strays (no history), the other three were rescues with no history - there were teething problems eg one was a food thief and even mastered childproof locks on the fridge. The dog doesn't arrive miraculously knowing the "rules" in her new home - chasing, jumping and rubbing her bum are normal behaviours, just ones that aren't appropriate and that she can be taught not to do.

RE: EXTREME VETTING

Eilidh Corr — Sat, 11 Feb 2017 09:13:05 GMT

No rehomed dog presents its full range of issues until it's well bedded in (and, I'm convinced, until you've fallen totally in love with it). It'll be fine. Build a higher fence, get a (modern, force free) trainer to help give you strategies to counter the car chasing and put your nice rug away for the next decade. And enjoy!

My little horror was an accidental addition to our household and I should probably have foreseen the stealing, the reactivity and the absolute unwavering insistence on sleeping under the covers. But I can forgive the little brute anything.

RE: EXTREME VETTING

Rob Davis — Sat, 11 Feb 2017 09:06:09 GMT

[quote user="Michael Woodhouse"]For some reason we have a lot of cushions in our house, I'm not entirely sure why but we do[/quote]

Probably because you live with a woman..... The three females in my house all seem to have an inexplicable and insatiable desire to own more cushions.

RE: EXTREME VETTING

Michael Woodhouse — Fri, 10 Feb 2017 22:46:13 GMT

For some reason we have a lot of cushions in our house, I'm not entirely sure why but we do. The Patterdale can pick out the expensive ones and will only sleep on them. The money I've wasted on dog beds......

I didn't even want a bloody dog and she has me fully trained. Damn things.

RE: EXTREME VETTING

Clare Tapsfield-Wright — Fri, 10 Feb 2017 22:34:03 GMT

Definitely not a crap vet . I'm sure if anyone can sort her out an intelligent committed vet can , she's young , she's a border collie so she's smart and there's lots of advice out there. Anyway sounds like you love her already so start from scratch with the training. We live and learn