"Lines Crossed Over Pet Health Advice Service"

RE: "Lines Crossed Over Pet Health Advice Service"

grumpyoldman — Sat, 19 Nov 2016 19:12:46 GMT

I read this and immediately thought of 2 types of client:

1. Mingers with no £££ who are looking for someone to tell them its not too bad and may get better on its own, so that if it dies or gets a lot worse OOH ,they can comment ,"well we rang the vet line and they said it was ok" .

2. Over zealous couch cases with child substitutes who want someone to tell them the blocked anal sacs really are so painful its ok to call out the emergency vet.

Not really bothered about loosing interactions with either group.

RE: "Lines Crossed Over Pet Health Advice Service"

Bob Russell — Fri, 18 Nov 2016 11:15:32 GMT

Using the term GP was one concern, using the terms expert was the next one and putting a qualified nurse in the position that they have little option than to make a diagnosis is another.

NHS Direct has software that has been developed to allow non-medical staff to 'triage' and prioritise. Millions have been spent on it and it does not require medical knowledge as far as I am aware.

It also has a habit of getting it wrong!

RE: "Lines Crossed Over Pet Health Advice Service"

Martin Atkinson — Fri, 18 Nov 2016 10:44:22 GMT

[quote user="Anthony Todd"]Nah, it's encouraging; soon you'll agree that everything needs steroids.[/quote]I thought about making a joke about that but was trying to avoid the s word. It's bit like Godwin's Law is to other discussions, perhaps we ought to call it Todd's Law - whatever the subject on this forum it will always end up with arguing with you about steroids. So we have invoked it already!

RE: "Lines Crossed Over Pet Health Advice Service"

Anthony Todd — Fri, 18 Nov 2016 10:32:45 GMT

Nah, it's encouraging; soon you'll agree that everything needs steroids..... [had to add the smillie in case you thought I was serious.

RE: "Lines Crossed Over Pet Health Advice Service"

Martin Atkinson — Fri, 18 Nov 2016 10:28:30 GMT

[quote user="Hannah Wynne Richards"] Total agreement with Anthony[/quote]This is worrying Wynne - we've both agreed with Anthony in one thread!

RE: "Lines Crossed Over Pet Health Advice Service"

Hannah Wynne Richards — Fri, 18 Nov 2016 08:24:25 GMT

Total agreement with Anthony

Wynne

RE: "Lines Crossed Over Pet Health Advice Service"

Evelyn Barbour-Hill — Thu, 17 Nov 2016 23:57:26 GMT

[quote user="Michael Woodhouse"] hand holding with the full anal glands and dog with mild V&D won't be skin off anyone's nose.[/quote]

What a wonderful picture....

RE: "Lines Crossed Over Pet Health Advice Service"

Michael Woodhouse — Thu, 17 Nov 2016 22:56:33 GMT

It's hardly any different to the NHS direct model, remember many of the people taking those calls are not medically trained, they run through computer triage.

They will weed out some obvious bollocks, but for it to work it has to be very risk averse, so a lot of people will be sent to see the vet anyway. Remember VNs now are professionally responsible and can be struck off.

A little reassurance and hand holding with the full anal glands and dog with mild V&D won't be skin off anyone's nose.

RE: "Lines Crossed Over Pet Health Advice Service"

Anthony Todd — Thu, 17 Nov 2016 20:40:08 GMT

From the difference between what a vet manages to glean, with forensic questioning, and what the vet subsequently sees on the table any advice without the animal is a recipe for disaster!

Added to the fact that the owner is ringing the service in the hope of avoiding the expense of a consultation and so will diminish any advice makes it seems a certainty.

RE: "Lines Crossed Over Pet Health Advice Service"

mariette asselbergs — Thu, 17 Nov 2016 20:33:08 GMT

I thought that the name "GP" was naughty, because they don't do what a GP does, they don't diagnose over the phone, they just advise if a client needs to see a vet or not. I don't see what is the harm in that. It is normal practice at veterinary practices or OOH that the first conversation over the telephone is with a trained receptionist or a nurse. The vet only comes on the phone if the client needs to be more forcefully convinced that they should bring the animal in. Our OOH service spends loads of time on the phone with clients who never come in, all for free! It is even one reason that we have two nurses in on Sundays, because of all the phone calls.

Mariette

RE: "Lines Crossed Over Pet Health Advice Service"

Arlo Guthrie — Thu, 17 Nov 2016 18:24:36 GMT

I don't think there is any need to get too over-exercised about this new service. Don't think it'll ever catch on.

https://www.vetsurgeon.org/news/b/veterinary_news/archive/2016/11/17/new-pet-health-service-claims-to-save-owners-163-300-cost-of-veterinary-appointment.aspx

RE: "Lines Crossed Over Pet Health Advice Service"

Bob Russell — Thu, 17 Nov 2016 16:20:35 GMT

I agree that the RCVS should deal with this. It would seem likely that the VN's involved may feel able or pressured to make a 'diagnosis' over the phone.

As is the case with many practices our clients can phone for advice FOC and will be guided to an appointment if it is felt appropriate.

I am pretty unhappy that nurses are employed via insurance companies already. I assume this is to save them money.

A real indicator of a lack of trust!

RE: "Lines Crossed Over Pet Health Advice Service"

Hannah Wynne Richards — Thu, 17 Nov 2016 15:49:56 GMT

RCVS should deal with this through the criminal courts, as it is a criminal offence to diagnose unless on the register..................don't hold your breath though.

Wynne

RE: "Lines Crossed Over Pet Health Advice Service"

Martin Atkinson — Thu, 17 Nov 2016 12:49:49 GMT

[quote user="Evelyn Barbour-Hill"]Fortunately most of my clients are already aware that they can have telephone advice from a veterinary surgeon at any time, free of charge.[/quote]Yeah, its what they do all the time during or out of hours. I don't know that is fortunate for the vet on call or not though.

As for the average £300 charge, I imagine this is related to OOH and having seen the ripoff charges some dedicated OOH providers make I wouldn't be surprised if those made it up that average even if I would charge a lot less. A client of mine had to go an OOH clinic last weekend with an 'off colour cat' (I won't name names but it began with M and ended in vet) and after no doubt many hundreds of pounds of blood tests, ultrasound scans, fluids, fentanyl patches and hospitalisation they found it had a cat bite abscess. Even if that was a genuine mistake of course it then needed cytology and microbiology on the pus and more hospitalisation. Sometimes I agree with Anthony about unnecessary investigations.

RE: "Lines Crossed Over Pet Health Advice Service"

Evelyn Barbour-Hill — Thu, 17 Nov 2016 12:44:08 GMT

Fortunately most of my clients are already aware that they can have telephone advice from a veterinary surgeon at any time, free of charge.

Somebody should nail that lie about "£300 is the average cost of a visit to the vet" though.