Anyone else got a slipped disc?

RE: Anyone else got a slipped disc?

George Cooper — Mon, 12 Sep 2016 11:09:56 GMT

I've spent the entire summer at four foot ten instead of six foot two, gazing at my feet. It struck overnight, and pole axed me. I've had issues for years which usually resolve within a week, but this time... ... ... Eventually asked for an X-ray, which found a bulging disc. No "red flag" signs, and now improving, but pain relief of Dihydrocodeine for 20 years wasn't effective so ported onto Tramadol which helped. Apparently a high percentage of people will succumb to disc related sciatica in their lives - and will see a resolution inside 6-20 weeks. Fingers crossed. Strangely the ability to carry stuff was unaffected, but standing was not good. Good luck Arlo!

RE: Anyone else got a slipped disc?

Bob Russell — Mon, 12 Sep 2016 09:59:39 GMT

[quote user="Michael Woodhouse"]

No one has ever given me a good answer on P pharmacy medicines. You can get packs of things like ibuprofen from the vet wholesaler, clearly with no vet use. Same tablets as available OTC, but bigger pack size. Is the issue just with POM products? A pharmacy can sell P products over the counter without a doctors script. You can buy co-codamol (lower codeine dose) OTC. I'm sure my local pharmacy would sell me a few hundred ibuprofen if I asked. Pharmacy meds do not require a prescription to issue them, can I leave a box in the staff room for general use?

Vets who was getting wife medicine got a warning IIRC.

[/quote]

POM category is simply down to numbers. A GP prescription can cover a month (or more) of medication in one go. Over the counter and P products are available in limited numbers. Pharmacy doses can be higher because a qualified professional is monitoring the sales.

Our POM Ibuprofen and Paracetamol are on the shelf with other POM's and monitored by the PMS so misuse pretty unlikely.

RE: Anyone else got a slipped disc?

Aine Seavers — Sun, 11 Sep 2016 08:50:54 GMT

Type 3 HEV disc type. Painkillers couldnt touch it. Tens machine for pain, small portable, small hand held Interferential machine for physio, currently use small disc like patch-Pain patches-do help. Swimming or rather passive traction by hanging by arms off the side of deep swimming pool and let spine expand out (we contract by some mm each morning we stand up)- sometimes I use gym weights on my legs in pool to get gentle stress traction effect. Then I get out and use a belt or corset to hold the now correctly aligned spine back in place for a couple of days use. Much of the pain is from the muscle spasms-physios here really work on finding the trigger points(you feel them as pea shaped lumps in in area of pain-hard finger pressure on it and some massage-sharp pain then ahh as the pain level just drops a thousand fold. Spinal belts or Sacro-iliac belts also really helpful. Bowen therapy-again a type of gentle massage focusing on trigger points and deep muscle stimulation really helps. Quite a few clients have had spinal surgery in the 15 years mine an issue-they are in constant pain, can't walk and are incontinent. I am none of those even if from time to time I do get flares up and can't straighten, to sit is like sitting on 9 knives and to stand up a screamfest-until I get all my machines back on me and if can get into the pool depending on weather-not with machines on obviously

RE: Anyone else got a slipped disc?

Michael Woodhouse — Sat, 10 Sep 2016 21:17:59 GMT

Vets who was getting wife medicine got a warning IIRC.

RE: Anyone else got a slipped disc?

Hannah Wynne Richards — Sat, 10 Sep 2016 17:35:43 GMT

Self medicating with codeine could land you in serious trouble with RCVS. You're not supposed to self medicate with anything that isn't available over the counter. Some 10 years ago, a veterinary surgeon's wife had chronic pain following a RTA She went to the doctor, who prescribed a NSAID Time pressures meant that collecting prescriptions/ medications was difficult, so ( with the knowledge and consent of her doctor) her husband obtained the medication from his wholesaler. He was actually saving the taxpayer money, as the medication cost more than the prescription fee...........it was purely a time saving exercise. One of his nurses was either dismissed, or left on bad terms. She reported him to RCVS, and he was suspended from the register for a time.

Beware!

Wynne

RE: Anyone else got a slipped disc?

mariette asselbergs — Sat, 10 Sep 2016 14:53:30 GMT

I had slipped disks for years with on and off debilitating backpain which always got better after a few days or weeks with painkillers and exercise. Strange enough lifting things did help,

Then I got a bad one after sneezing while sitting in a wrong positiopn, and it proceeded to neurological symptoms in my leg, and that is when the medics advised surgery, although, when I finally had the surgery things already were on the mend again.

After surgery i had a strict period of wearing a corset and doing exercises. I was annoyed at having a stiff and painful back all the time which lasted for years, but did not get worse, and actually got better over time and now, 15 years later i have rarely any problems anymore. What helped me a great deal being a large animal vet/farmer at the time was whenever I had backpain I wore my corset again, and then i could just work, physically, without too much of a problem.

Moral of the story: exercise and maintain core strength is very important, weight control, painkillers and possibly a corset if things are too bad. Don't go for surgery unless it all becomes unbearable or you get serious neurological symptoms. And things really can get better over time.

Good luck

Mariette

RE: Anyone else got a slipped disc?

Anthony Todd — Sat, 10 Sep 2016 12:58:21 GMT

[quote user="David Mills"]Fentanyl patches or oral? Codeine is great as you can self medicate. [/quote]

Yeah well, from my, and others' experience I'd get a script from the man in the moon, and I'd go to his surgery, if it relieved the pain.....

Apparently constipation is a side-effect too but there are ways of dealing with that.

Also it establishes a history with your GP.

RE: Anyone else got a slipped disc?

David Mills — Fri, 09 Sep 2016 18:26:19 GMT

[quote user="Anthony Todd"]

What's the status of surgery for discs now? Noel seems not to have a problem and can fix them in a night....

When I dislocated my ankle Fentanyl stopped all pain so I wonder why codeine is still favoured??

[/quote]

Depends on whether it's extrusion (sudden, debilitating) or protrusion (chronic, annoying) and how severe the signs are- most people are in the latter and surgery has no published advantage (and potential serious complications) over wait and see (surgery always available). Most dogs are sudden and so surgery is indicated (as in people) as signs normally more dramatic and debilitating and the area is far more unstable with potential for worsening.

Fentanyl patches or oral? Codeine is great as you can self medicate. Just remember to eats lots of figs. Shitting a brick no fun with back pain.

RE: Anyone else got a slipped disc?

Anthony Todd — Fri, 09 Sep 2016 18:15:52 GMT

What's the status of surgery for discs now? Noel seems not to have a problem and can fix them in a night....

When I dislocated my ankle Fentanyl stopped all pain so I wonder why codeine is still favoured??

RE: Anyone else got a slipped disc?

David Mills — Fri, 09 Sep 2016 18:07:45 GMT

[quote user="Arlo Guthrie"]

[quote user="Martin Atkinson"]Two things happen the disc can prolapse part of its contents into the spinal canal and press on the spinal cord which is not good[/quote]

Yep, that's my sort.

[quote user="David Mills"] chronic prolapse over time. Used to get back pain and sciatica down left leg which was bad for 6/12 months esp after a day on my feet.[/quote]

Mine's the right leg! Started after I made the mistake of lifting then carrying my (now heavy) daughter from one end of the house to another post seizure. Shouty pain for about 3 weeks after; now OK when sitting, but when walking I have to stoop like an old man till I find a pain-free sweet spot.

Unnervingly, the doc said if it got worse, it might affect bladder. "But don't worry", he said, "You'll just have to carry a catheter with you."

Don't worry????!!

But he also said that that usually, when these things go, they tend to go acutely and unlikely to worsen. He also said that they prolapsed bit tends to disintegrate and shrink / self-resolve, but if it didn't (or gets worse) in the next 4 weeks, then to consider surgery to remove it.

Still, I wondered what happens to the rest of the disc after the prolapsed bit disintegrates/shrinks. Presumably doesn't regrow.

[quote user="Martin Atkinson"]Sadly my sole indiscretion was 126 mph[/quote]

Crikey, that's going it some! Mine was wasn't into the realms of automatic license removal, but I don't think I'll qualify for the speed awareness course.

[/quote]

Docs always paint worse case scenario so they don't get sued if you become an incontinent dribbler

The disc material is either absorbed if it's in the canal or filled in with scar tissue between the vertebrae. You'll forever have a stiff back so you won't win gold on the pommel in Tokyo or beyond. Essentially you're waiting for the scar tissue to form to dull the pain. Building back and abdo muscles - including stretching (at home or posh stretching pirates) - can help replace the movement in the joint. A six pack and v shaped back awaits. Ridding yourself of the beer paunch will also assist (6 years on and still there) although alcohol does work very well with codeine (you need the Co codamol 30/500 and you'll be grinning like this )

RE: Anyone else got a slipped disc?

Arlo Guthrie — Fri, 09 Sep 2016 12:13:31 GMT

[quote user="Clare Tapsfield-Wright"]My sympathy Arlo, I never appreciated my pain free back until I hurt mine and it affects so many aspects of your life . I'm sure it must be very difficult to remember your back when you see the need to lift your daughter.[/quote]

Thanks Clare, and yes, it's very instinctive to try and get her somewhere comfortable, but after seeing my MRI, I've realised my days of carrying anything much heavier than a paperback are now over.

[quote user="Clare Tapsfield-Wright"]You need to look after the rest of your discs now as unfortunately when one goes there is more likelihood of others going.[/quote]

Although I wondered, I didn't know that. Dear oh dear. Eyesight going, hair falling out. Now the scaffolding is starting to go. There really isn't much to be said for middle age!

[quote user="Clare Tapsfield-Wright"]keep slim and toned[/quote]

Keep?! I've got to get there first. 'Slim' I can aim for. 'Toned' is rather further off, I fear!

RE: Anyone else got a slipped disc?

Clare Tapsfield-Wright — Fri, 09 Sep 2016 11:22:35 GMT

My sympathy Arlo, I never appreciated my pain free back until I hurt mine and it affects so many aspects of your life . I'm sure it must be very difficult to remember your back when you see the need to lift your daughter. Have you assessed ways in which you could minimise the need to lift? I'm sure you have but sometimes you need to stand back and make sure .

You need to look after the rest of your discs now as unfortunately when one goes there is more likelihood of others going. Youve got a lot of years ahead of you but hopefully new spinal techniques will evolve. Human spines are of really bad design.

I found in the acute stage with muscle spasm heat eased the situation and got me moving but I'm sure you've got all that covered plus the analgesia. It takes a hell of a long time to improve , I was amazed how many months it took.

I have found that the stronger my core is the better my back so maybe look at lifelong ways to keep the muscles toned such as Pilates. Horse riding does it for me but just a few weeks of being a slob and I can feel it again . Ditto weight gain , keep slim and toned . I only wish I were better at practising what I preach.

RE: Anyone else got a slipped disc?

Martin Atkinson — Fri, 09 Sep 2016 10:19:56 GMT

[quote user="Hannah Wynne Richards"]What speed would Martin have been cycling at if hips. knees, sacrum etc had been in perfect working order?[/quote]Actually possibly not far off - Guy Martin set a cycling speed record of 112 mph, albeit drafting a specially adapted truck, and he's not really even a cyclist, just a crazy, speed junky!

RE: Anyone else got a slipped disc?

Bob Russell — Fri, 09 Sep 2016 09:58:41 GMT

Not sure whether it ever got a proper diagnosis but diazepam and Voltarol made my very shouty back easier to live with. Not sure it did much for the pain but I certainly stopped worrying so much about it and the memory is slightly hazy!

Did those nice people at the Constabulary invite you to one of their driver awareness courses? I was caught doing 48 mph across the Forest and they sent me this kind invitation to join them at a local hotel for the morning!

Actually was quite a good refresher course, good humoured and the tea and coffee was good and plentiful.

They run the same course for businesses using drivers and apparently charge a lot more than we paid!

Overall a much better deal than 3 points and a hike in insurance premiums!

RE: Anyone else got a slipped disc?

Wren — Fri, 09 Sep 2016 08:27:25 GMT

[quote user="David Mills"] and tons of beautiful, wonderful, uplifting codeine.

[/quote]

God bless codeine! I have something pinching the root of my sciatic nerve (excruciating pain from buttock to heel, and an almost completely numb foot) and bucketloads of codeine is the only thing that keeps me working.

Just to hijack the post, has anyone had gabapentin for anything similar? I am finding amitriptyline fairly useless (though may not have hit a high enough dose yet) and neuro consultant says I can try gabapentin if I'd prefer.

RE: Anyone else got a slipped disc?

Arlo Guthrie — Fri, 09 Sep 2016 07:55:21 GMT

[quote user="Martin Atkinson"]Two things happen the disc can prolapse part of its contents into the spinal canal and press on the spinal cord which is not good[/quote]

Yep, that's my sort.

[quote user="David Mills"] chronic prolapse over time. Used to get back pain and sciatica down left leg which was bad for 6/12 months esp after a day on my feet.[/quote]

Unnervingly, the doc said if it got worse, it might affect bladder. "But don't worry", he said, "You'll just have to carry a catheter with you."

Don't worry????!!

Still, I wondered what happens to the rest of the disc after the prolapsed bit disintegrates/shrinks. Presumably doesn't regrow.

[quote user="Martin Atkinson"]Sadly my sole indiscretion was 126 mph[/quote]

Crikey, that's going it some! Mine was wasn't into the realms of automatic license removal, but I don't think I'll qualify for the speed awareness course.

RE: Anyone else got a slipped disc?

Hannah Wynne Richards — Fri, 09 Sep 2016 07:49:49 GMT

What speed would Martin have been cycling at if hips. knees, sacrum etc had been in perfect working order?

Wynne

RE: Anyone else got a slipped disc?

David Mills — Thu, 08 Sep 2016 22:36:10 GMT

Yep had one about 6 years ago, chronic prolapse over time. Used to get back pain and sciatica down left leg which was bad for 6/12 months esp after a day on my feet. Had steroid injections, useless, only thing that helped was exercise, hot yoga and tons of beautiful, wonderful, uplifting codeine.

It does get better over time and things scar and stabilise. The medics call it regression to the mean, others just your body getting used to the pain.

Best return that leotard, though.

RE: Anyone else got a slipped disc?

Anthony Todd — Thu, 08 Sep 2016 19:43:30 GMT

[quote user="Martin Atkinson"]126 mph on the M2[/quote]

What, on a bike?

What with your knees, hips, lumbo-sacral-iliac degeneration, collar bone mal-union, rib, etc, and all with no gloves, geez, you'll cause a wound reaction for sure.

RE: Anyone else got a slipped disc?

Martin Atkinson — Thu, 08 Sep 2016 18:59:22 GMT

No, just have to settle for dodgy knees and hips, lumbar-sacral disease and sacro-iliac disease with the odd fractured collar bone and rib for good measure in the short term!

Slipped disc is a bit of a laymans term as they don't really slip. Two things happen the disc can prolapse part of its contents into the spinal canal and press on the spinal cord which is not good or they just become hard and inflexible and don't give very good suspension between the vertebrae - painful but not quite so bad. The good news is that the prolapsed but can fibrous to prevent further injury and the spinal cord can recover the bad news is a hard inflexible disc is going to stay hard and inflexible and give you gip from time to time. Rest, sensible exercise not lifting heavy weights and some NSAIDs should do the job unless you're in intractable pain of have neurological symptoms. Cue a neurologist to tell me I'm talking bovine dung.

Can't help you with the speeding ticket but you may get away with a speed awareness course. Sadly my sole indiscretion was 126 mph on the M2 which was a bit much for just 3 points and a slap on the wrist!!