Less than 24 hours to go.

RE: Less than 24 hours to go.

Virginia Campbell — Fri, 24 Jun 2016 09:04:22 GMT

Turning and turning in the widening gyre

The falcon cannot hear the falconer...

RE: Less than 24 hours to go.

Gerry Henry — Fri, 24 Jun 2016 05:54:29 GMT

Now, God be thanked Who has matched us with His hour,

And caught our youth, and wakened us from sleeping,

With hand made sure, clear eye, and sharpened power,

To turn, as swimmers into cleanness leaping.

RE: Less than 24 hours to go.

Virginia Campbell — Fri, 24 Jun 2016 05:30:07 GMT

Morning all. Hark, what's that sound? The stock market crashing and the pound sterling smashing through the floor tiles. Ah well, the sun is rising and the birds are still singing. Hey ho.

RE: Less than 24 hours to go.

Evelyn Barbour-Hill — Fri, 24 Jun 2016 02:48:33 GMT

[quote user="Neil Wheadon"]They took 12.6% of the vote, and doorstep politicians commented that maybe 1 or 2 people wanted to discuss Europe, that was it.[/quote]

And the relevance is......?

Currently, Leave has 49.3%. That's a tiddy bit more than 12.6. Conclusion?

Shambolic? On the whole, yes. Lots of lies and fabrications and threats and bullshit from the Remain side, and I'll take your word for it the same on the Leave side.

Waste of time and resources? Absolutely not.

RE: Less than 24 hours to go.

Nhombokisheni — Thu, 23 Jun 2016 23:56:17 GMT

Remain may win but the real winners are the boys and girls in Brussels......now they have the mandate to "take the piss" (words fail me) knowing fully well we can't do anything about it!!!!!!!!!

RE: Less than 24 hours to go.

Neil Wheadon — Thu, 23 Jun 2016 22:41:00 GMT

[quote user="Evelyn Barbour-Hill"]The real victory has already been achieved: that the people of the UK have actually been asked, for the first time, whether they want to be in this thing or not.[/quote]

I could have sworn UKIP was on my voting paper at the last election.

They took 12.6% of the vote, and doorstep politicians commented that maybe 1 or 2 people wanted to discuss Europe, that was it.

I agree with Marie and have made this point several times, it's been a shambolic waste of time and resources.

However it's looking like a narrow Remain win and a huge message will be sent to Brussels and in this I'm hopeful that changes will happen backed by Sweden, Denmark and the Netherlands, because I think there will be more of this elsewhere.

Neil

RE: Less than 24 hours to go.

Marie Kubiak — Thu, 23 Jun 2016 21:47:29 GMT

[quote user="Evelyn Barbour-Hill"]

The real victory has already been achieved: that the people of the UK have actually been asked, for the first time, whether they want to be in this thing or not.

[/quote]

I'd counter that by saying there has been a big loss overall- in-fighting and lies from politicians leading to further mistrust and fuelling of anger based only on exaggeration and falsehoods, open hatred expressed between civilian factions, exacerbation of the ostracisation of UK based immigrants, the UK seen as a xenophobic selfish nation by the rest of the world and a huge amount of money wasted muddying what should have been a fact-based decision. A huge mess.

RE: Less than 24 hours to go.

Gillian Mostyn — Thu, 23 Jun 2016 21:40:39 GMT

I'd love to think that, whatever their vote, people made an informed decision. Unfortunately, I doubt that was the case.

RE: Less than 24 hours to go.

Evelyn Barbour-Hill — Thu, 23 Jun 2016 19:55:32 GMT

The real victory has already been achieved: that the people of the UK have actually been asked, for the first time, whether they want to be in this thing or not.

RE: Less than 24 hours to go.

Arlo Guthrie — Thu, 23 Jun 2016 18:54:07 GMT

[quote user="Gerry Henry"]Never thought of my country as a product.[/quote]

No, nor do I. The product was 'control'.

RE: Less than 24 hours to go.

Gerry Henry — Thu, 23 Jun 2016 18:47:01 GMT

Never thought of my country as a product.

RE: Less than 24 hours to go.

Hannah Wynne Richards — Thu, 23 Jun 2016 18:41:50 GMT

Virginia My viewpoint has probably been affected by the fact that Swansea has the 6th highest ratio of asylum seekers in the UK.

Wynne

RE: Less than 24 hours to go.

Arlo Guthrie — Thu, 23 Jun 2016 18:24:52 GMT

[quote user="Evelyn Barbour-Hill"]Oh Arlo. The sudden cold feet decision.[/quote]

Really not. I just concluded that at the end of it all, I hadn't been sold the product.

For me, the 'product' was greater control over our country's affairs.

Problem was, whilst I might like to buy some more 'control' today, nobody could tell me what this control would cost me (us).

I wouldn't buy anything without knowing what it costs. Particularly something surrounded by so many wild claims and hot air.

[quote user="J G Wray"]Just how gracious must those who are on the losing side be? Just how decent must those on the winning side be?[/quote]

Depends who wins.

RE: Less than 24 hours to go.

Virginia Campbell — Thu, 23 Jun 2016 18:21:57 GMT

[quote user="Hannah Wynne Richards"]We accept everybody, and then allow them benefits.[/quote]

What's your personal experience of immigrants/economic migrants Wynne?

Mine has been fellow vets (Dutch, Italian, French and Greek - and excellent to a man, or rather woman in most cases); one very good Lithuanian vet nurse who is now an RVN and speaks with a slightly Norn Iron accent; and clients - mostly Polish, all employed and happily paying taxes and vet bills. I don't think I've ever been told "I'm on benefits" by a foreign national (this happens quite often with homegrown clients looking for discount).

RE: Less than 24 hours to go.

J G Wray — Thu, 23 Jun 2016 18:07:32 GMT

Dear Mr G,

A ruling please. Just how gracious must those who are on the losing side be? Just how decent must those on the winning side be? Or, is it not really about winning or losing, in or out, black or white (not an immigration reference)?

Surely, both sides can find common ground and let the harsh words written be consigned to history, to start afresh, brought together by the common bond of being veterinary professionals.....oh I can't keep it going

RE: Less than 24 hours to go.

Arlo Guthrie — Thu, 23 Jun 2016 18:02:32 GMT

[quote user="J G Wray"]

[quote user="Arlo Guthrie"]Partly, that reform must be about the EU having greater engagement with the populations of the member states, and striving to adopt a less-is-more approach to regulation.[/quote]

Did that read.....

"..Partly, that reform must be about the RCVS having greater engagement with the populations of the members, and striving to adopt a less-is-more approach to regulation..."

??!??

Hmmmmm a referendum

[/quote]

Laughed out loud

RE: Less than 24 hours to go.

Evelyn Barbour-Hill — Thu, 23 Jun 2016 18:01:33 GMT

[quote user="Marie Kubiak"]Is this aimed at me?[/quote]

No! Emphatically not, Marie.

If aimed at all, aimed at all those on both sides who keep banging on and on and on about immigration and distracting from all the other aspects we should consider (and, to my regret, in some instances giving "Leave" a bad name).

RE: Less than 24 hours to go.

J G Wray — Thu, 23 Jun 2016 17:50:25 GMT

Did that read.....

"..Partly, that reform must be about the RCVS having greater engagement with the populations of the members, and striving to adopt a less-is-more approach to regulation..."

??!??

Hmmmmm a referendum

RE: Less than 24 hours to go.

Marie Kubiak — Thu, 23 Jun 2016 17:17:00 GMT

[quote user="Evelyn Barbour-Hill"]

Sigh... there is so much more to this than immigration.

I've given you so many reasons to leave, and never once mentioned immigration.

[/quote]

Is this aimed at me? If so it is clear I am replying to Wynne's comment on population increases being a reason to leave the EU- there is even a quote at the start of my post.

RE: Less than 24 hours to go.

Hannah Wynne Richards — Thu, 23 Jun 2016 17:01:24 GMT

GREAT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

A tiny tiny step in the right direction.

Wynne

RE: Less than 24 hours to go.

Evelyn Barbour-Hill — Thu, 23 Jun 2016 16:49:58 GMT

Sigh... there is so much more to this than immigration.

I've given you so many reasons to leave, and never once mentioned immigration.

RE: Less than 24 hours to go.

Neil Wheadon — Thu, 23 Jun 2016 16:46:42 GMT

[quote user="Hannah Wynne Richards"]

and then allow them benefits.

[/quote]

You might have missed this Wynne. It snuck in under the radar between Michael Gove and David Cameron

14th June 2016

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-36526158

European court backs UK curbs on child benefit rights

Neil

PS I'm not being SHOUTY, that's how the headline pasted.

RE: Less than 24 hours to go.

Hannah Wynne Richards — Thu, 23 Jun 2016 16:41:31 GMT

You can't move to Switzerland, unless you either have a considerable amount of capital, or a job to go to. We accept everybody, and then allow them benefits.

The longer humanity (worldwide) puts off facing the fact that there's simply far too many of us, the nastier will be the eventual wars/famines before a stable, non-polluting, environmentally sustainable population level is estblished.

By the way, I've never advocated culling, unless you use that term for the judicial execution of convicted criminals - and the rest of us would be much beter off without them

Wynne

RE: Less than 24 hours to go.

Marie Kubiak — Thu, 23 Jun 2016 15:54:29 GMT

[quote user="Hannah Wynne Richards"]

British population has increased by 500k in just the last year alone , and now stands at 65million. This island is simply too small. That is not a racist comment, simply an environmental one.

Wynne

[/quote]

But there would still need to be free movement of EU nationals as part of ongoing free trade agreements (see Switzerland's agreement) so migration is unlikely to be altered even if the UK was outside the EU. I cannot see any government opting to cut off EU trade as this would be a monumental disaster for industry exports and our necessary imports.

Even if we do hypothetically take net migration out, the native UK population is increasing. Leaving the EU will not alter this growth and no political party would ever advocate limiting child numbers (or indeed any of your policies to cull parts of society).

Marie

RE: Less than 24 hours to go.

Hannah Wynne Richards — Thu, 23 Jun 2016 14:40:35 GMT

British population has increased by 500k in just the last year alone , and now stands at 65million. This island is simply too small. That is not a racist comment, simply an environmental one.

Wynne