Encouraging the bitch

Re: Encouraging the bitch

Martin Atkinson — Fri, 01 May 2015 17:10:49 GMT

[quote user="Michael Woodhouse"]We know that as soon as any colostrum reaches the lamb's gut the cells start closing down much more quickly. You could be significantly reducing the ability of the lamb to absorb antibodies in a couple of hours when it has got itself together and suckled.[/quote]But if she has done this and found it has been successful with no increase in morbitity subsequently that is equally valid surely? Sometimes what is true in theory is not borne out in practice and some colostrum must be better than none if it doesn't get itself together, Don't know, I couldn't tell a sheep from a white wooly rug but is sounds logical to me.

Re: Encouraging the bitch

Badger er — Thu, 30 Apr 2015 19:53:30 GMT

[quote user="Michael Woodhouse"]

[quote user="H Mc"]And if the neonatal lamb is slow to get up and suck, a squirt of colostrum on the tongue seems to have a similar encouraging effect.[/quote]

Don't do that. Not unless you are going to tube it very soon afterwards. We know that as soon as any colostrum reaches the lamb's gut the cells start closing down much more quickly. You could be significantly reducing the ability of the lamb to absorb antibodies in a couple of hours when it has got itself together and suckled.

[/quote]

I had no idea I was being potentially counter-productive by doing that. Thank you.

Re: Encouraging the bitch

Michael Woodhouse — Thu, 30 Apr 2015 15:13:35 GMT

[quote user="H Mc"]And if the neonatal lamb is slow to get up and suck, a squirt of colostrum on the tongue seems to have a similar encouraging effect.[/quote]

Re: Encouraging the bitch

Badger er — Thu, 30 Apr 2015 07:47:02 GMT

It's a common trick when lambing dystocic sheep, especially young or primiparous ones, if the ewe is tired or disinterested in the lamb after birth. It seems to be that first taste sort of prompts them into knowing what to do. I use my hands or can stick a lamb's leg into her mouth via the diastema which seems to do the trick.

(And if the neonatal lamb is slow to get up and suck, a squirt of colostrum on the tongue seems to have a similar encouraging effect. I wonder if this works with puppies?)

Thanks for sharing!

Re: Encouraging the bitch

An On MRCVS — Wed, 29 Apr 2015 20:51:44 GMT

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counting the minutes till this is deleted

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Re: Encouraging the bitch

mariette asselbergs — Wed, 29 Apr 2015 20:00:02 GMT

The relevance is the maternal bonding induced by oxytocin. I always give them some extra just before they go home after a caesarean. And the sheep farmers I left another injection for the next day to help then accept the lambs.

But anyway, thanks for the idea of trying meconium, I'll definitely put it in the trickbox.

Mariette

Re: Encouraging the bitch

Evelyn Barbour-Hill — Mon, 27 Apr 2015 21:05:44 GMT

I think I'm capable of judging whether oxytocin is contra-indicated or not in a particular case.

Not sure of the relevance to my little OP.

Re: Encouraging the bitch

Hannah Wynne Richards — Mon, 27 Apr 2015 17:38:31 GMT

I was thinking oxytocin and huge puppies - no no no.

Wynne

Re: Encouraging the bitch

Evelyn Barbour-Hill — Mon, 27 Apr 2015 17:27:31 GMT

[quote user="Sammy82"]

I always like to give Oxytocin post caesaer (in cows and dogs)

to help uterine contraction and bring the milk down, it's also known as the bonding hormone. I only use it pre casar if the bitch is just not getting on, not if there is any doubt about oversized pup/pup stuck as there is a risk of uterine rupture in these cases.

[/quote]

She was a pretty clear case of uterine inertia. She had one chance with oxytocin and calcium (always calcium) and when it was plain nothing was going to happen we got on with the surgery. Oxytocin on completing the surgery (I like to give it after closing the uterus, usually). NSAID and methadone.

Re: Encouraging the bitch

Sammy82 — Mon, 27 Apr 2015 16:49:11 GMT

I always like to give Oxytocin post caesaer (in cows and dogs)

Re: Encouraging the bitch

Martin Atkinson — Mon, 27 Apr 2015 16:34:31 GMT

Could equally been she was just knackered and needed time to recover or get her head around the idea. Did you give any oxytocin prior to making the decision to caesar?

Re: Encouraging the bitch

Michael Woodhouse — Mon, 27 Apr 2015 15:38:31 GMT

I saw the title and secretly hoped one of your nurses needed a kick up the backside