Professional Indemnity Insurance

Re: Professional Indemnity Insurance

Alison Clare Hickman — Fri, 13 Mar 2015 15:23:59 GMT

Thanks Julian,

Sent you a PM.

Ali H

Re: Professional Indemnity Insurance

Julian Wells — Thu, 12 Mar 2015 09:59:30 GMT

I will try to clarify aspects of the VDS RVN policy for you. First of all a self employed RVN is covered FOC by the VDS policy of any practice in which he/she is working. This provides insurance against an allegation of negligence and, if proven, would include settlement of the costs of the third party. The Society does not need to know every time a RVN moves to another practice - this cover is provided to every member practice under the current policy. The criminal and disciplinary sections of the VDS policy are limited to named veterinary surgeons and nurses who either purchase their own individual policy or are named on a practice policy. Self employed vets and nurses are encouraged to have their own cover and the premium for RVNs is very competitive. This provides indemnity for investigations by any regulator (RCVS, VCI, police, TS, RSPCA etc) in connection with normal veterinary work. In the event of a prosecution or disciplinary hearing at the RCVS (VCI etc) the costs of representation are covered. In the event of a successful criminal prosecution any fine levied would not be covered. The costs of disciplinary hearings are not passed on to the vet or RVN by the College or the VCI (although the situation in Ireland is slightly complicated in the event of a sanction against the vet or nurse).

The VDS policy has been designed by vets to suit the practising profession and I do not believe you will find a more suitable policy. In fact we would want to hear about it if you did! I urge you to give the VDS a call to discuss in detail or alternatively make contact off line and I will try to answer any further questions.

Best wishes, Julian (VDS employee)

Re: Professional Indemnity Insurance

Evelyn Barbour-Hill — Mon, 09 Mar 2015 23:36:04 GMT

[quote user="Toadster"] I have quoted the 'small print' in my earlier post. Hence, the question to you guys (have we misunderstood it?).[/quote]

Yes. Admittedly the small print isa bit turgid, but VDS will explain.

Re: Professional Indemnity Insurance

Alison Clare Hickman — Mon, 09 Mar 2015 21:33:26 GMT

Hi Bob,

Yes, that's what we thought too! Our question arises as it appears the 'insurance' aspect of the VDS cover for an RVN does not provide cover in the event of fines and penalties etc. I have quoted the 'small print' in my earlier post. Hence, the question to you guys (have we misunderstood it?). Guess the sensible thing to do is to speak to VDS and get the lowdown on this aspect. Perhaps there is different/more comprehensive cover provided for veterinary surgeons to RVN's?

The confidence from everyone re VDS cover and their support is very comforting and we thank you very much for your feedback. Noted!

Many thanks

Ali H

Re: Professional Indemnity Insurance

Bob Russell — Mon, 09 Mar 2015 10:59:15 GMT

Fines and penalties would not be fines and penalties if an insurer pays them for you!

The point of insurance is to fight your corner to prevent fines or penalties.

Re: Professional Indemnity Insurance

Evelyn Barbour-Hill — Sun, 08 Mar 2015 23:28:14 GMT

[quote user="Toadster"]Hi All again, Been asked to clarify this...hope u can help! VDS; looks like (for self employed RVN), they will not be liable to indemnify the insured in respect of fines, penalties, orders or agreements to pay costs of a complainant, regulator, investigator or prosecutor of any professional conduct complaint against or investigation into the professional conduct of the insured or in relation to criminal proceedings (and so on...) In the above regard, it seems sensible to twin VDS with a separate professional indemnity insurer surely? Just to cover those aspects relating to fines, penalties, costs[/quote]

I'm not sure that you can insure against fines, penalties etc.

I think you have misunderstood. Unless I have, of course.

[quote user="Toadster"]and maybe even for death, injury to, illness or disease contracted by any person arising out of and in the course if employment under a contract of service...(and so on...).??? [/quote]

That would be in the Employer's Liability bit of any practice insurance package.

Re: Professional Indemnity Insurance

Alison Clare Hickman — Sun, 08 Mar 2015 22:36:45 GMT

Hi All again, Been asked to clarify this...hope u can help! VDS; looks like (for self employed RVN), they will not be liable to indemnify the insured in respect of fines, penalties, orders or agreements to pay costs of a complainant, regulator, investigator or prosecutor of any professional conduct complaint against or investigation into the professional conduct of the insured or in relation to criminal proceedings (and so on...) In the above regard, it seems sensible to twin VDS with a separate professional indemnity insurer surely? Just to cover those aspects relating to fines, penalties, costs and maybe even for death, injury to, illness or disease contracted by any person arising out of and in the course if employment under a contract of service...(and so on...).??? What advice/recommendations do you have for these requirements please😊 Regards Ali H

Re: Professional Indemnity Insurance

Hannah Wynne Richards — Thu, 05 Mar 2015 10:28:06 GMT

Hope the shock's not too much for you!

Wynne

Re: Professional Indemnity Insurance

Mark Hedberg — Thu, 05 Mar 2015 08:47:33 GMT

[quote user="Martin Atkinson"]

[quote user="Hannah Wynne Richards"]

I don't think I've ever known such unanimity about a thread. That must mean something.

Wynne

[/quote]Even I agree!

[/quote]

"I felt a great disturbance in the Force, as if millions of voices suddenly cried out in terror and were suddenly silenced. I fear Martin and Wynne have agreed on something..."

Re: Professional Indemnity Insurance

David Mills — Thu, 05 Mar 2015 01:54:39 GMT

To the OP:

VDS, as others have said, are worth their weight in gold. They protect their members in a way that is unique: protecting reputation above all else. Plus their unswerving, experienced support is absolutely invaluable.

If you go with a third party provider then they:

a) don't protect reputation. at all.

b) don't protect you if they envisage that you've done nothing wrong. famous case OOH in past 2 years - the 3rd party provider because the vet hadn't done anything wrong refused to cover the rcvs hearing or other legal fees. They are singularly awful. Avoid at all costs, they are, without a doubt, s***bags.

Re: Professional Indemnity Insurance

Niall Taylor — Wed, 04 Mar 2015 21:51:06 GMT

[quote user="Toadster"]Thanks everyone - I thought VDS represented their members, sort of an advocate/defendant service, but did not provide insurance cover per se in the event of being sued. Marvellous.[/quote]

And don't forget they will also fight your corner with the DC if you are reported to RCVS, something no other insurance co. does. And that alone is a massive comfort against the slings and arrows of clients, pissed off because the world isn't perfect and convinced everything is someone else's fault.

Stick with VDS.

Niall

Re: Professional Indemnity Insurance

Alison Clare Hickman — Wed, 04 Mar 2015 21:24:46 GMT

Wow!!

Thanks everyone - I thought VDS represented their members, sort of an advocate/defendant service, but did not provide insurance cover per se in the event of being sued. Marvellous. I will pass on your advice/recommendations!

Ali H

RVN

Re: Professional Indemnity Insurance

Stephen Courtney — Wed, 04 Mar 2015 20:15:31 GMT

But I am either deluded or naive, having never, ever worried about the prospect of being sued. i guess i have been lucky. Having three passports helps - international man of mystery! Escape is always an option!

Re: Professional Indemnity Insurance

Stephen Courtney — Wed, 04 Mar 2015 20:13:29 GMT

^^^ Wot they said !

Re: Professional Indemnity Insurance

Nicola Cole — Wed, 04 Mar 2015 19:55:07 GMT

Another vote for VDS

Re: Professional Indemnity Insurance

Anthony Todd — Wed, 04 Mar 2015 19:30:10 GMT

[quote user="Bob Russell"]Would you prefer someone to fight for your reputation even if it costs them a lot of money to do so?[/quote]

Yes, they did that for me several times whereas others, including vaccine manufacturers, paid up, therefore I was guilty.

Go for a cheaper option and prepare to feel alone, very alone.

[they also give sage ethical and employment advice if it is vaguely connected with professional indemnity and I mean very vague]

Re: Professional Indemnity Insurance

a.bardell — Wed, 04 Mar 2015 19:09:03 GMT

worked at a practice where they changed from vds to another provider.... lets just say that experience wasn't good and as soon as poss moved back again. If the proverbial hits the fan I know I'd want someone from the vds fighting my corner

I can also state from experience that when phoned in a panic they are very calming and reassuring and make everything seem so much better

Re: Professional Indemnity Insurance

Martin Atkinson — Wed, 04 Mar 2015 19:03:28 GMT

[quote user="Hannah Wynne Richards"]

I don't think I've ever known such unanimity about a thread. That must mean something.

Wynne

[/quote]Even I agree!

Re: Professional Indemnity Insurance

Hannah Wynne Richards — Wed, 04 Mar 2015 18:41:16 GMT

I don't think I've ever known such unanimity about a thread. That must mean something.

Wynne

Re: Professional Indemnity Insurance

Evelyn Barbour-Hill — Wed, 04 Mar 2015 18:20:50 GMT

I wouldn't even consider anyone other than VDS.

Re: Professional Indemnity Insurance

Bob Russell — Wed, 04 Mar 2015 17:43:14 GMT

[quote user="Anthony Todd"]

+1 x 100.

Anyone else "takes a view", and often pays up, leaving you in deep do-do 'cos you are therefore guilty.

No support, no advice.

[/quote]

Would you prefer someone to fight for your reputation even if it costs them a lot of money to do so? Or would you prefer a company that maximises its profits by minimising its costs?

Whatever the opposition tells you, there is something very special about VDS and long may it continue!

Re: Professional Indemnity Insurance

Anthony Todd — Wed, 04 Mar 2015 17:34:27 GMT

+1 x 100.

Anyone else "takes a view", and often pays up, leaving you in deep do-do 'cos you are therefore guilty.

No support, no advice.

Re: Professional Indemnity Insurance

Bob Russell — Wed, 04 Mar 2015 11:51:10 GMT

I would not even be tempted to get quotes from anyone else other than VDS.

They are quite amazing and comforting in a crisis! Thankfully so far we have avoided anything other than the general ups and downs of practice.

If the sh*t hits the fan I want a VDS advisor standing next to me!!

Re: Professional Indemnity Insurance

Yantha Smyth — Wed, 04 Mar 2015 09:10:33 GMT

+1 for VDS

Re: Professional Indemnity Insurance

Hannah Wynne Richards — Wed, 04 Mar 2015 07:56:45 GMT

Stick with the best VDS

Wynne