OV Fees

Re: OV Fees

Neil Wheadon — Fri, 24 Apr 2015 18:23:42 GMT

[quote user="Michael Woodhouse"]4 yearly testing so it's not a major issue[/quote]

At the moment

Neil

Re: OV Fees

Michael Woodhouse — Fri, 24 Apr 2015 18:04:27 GMT

We've signed up. 4 yearly testing so it's not a major issue, just a kick in the teeth. I don't want other practices on my farms.

Re: OV Fees

Bob Russell — Fri, 24 Apr 2015 17:55:13 GMT

My personal stance would be to pack up OV work under the new scheme. Thankfully not a real issue for a SA practice!

This is the only time that it will be possible to fight this move. Once enough young, inexperienced vets have been employed from the whole of Europe then OV testing for mixed practices is dead and gone IMO.

There are plenty of vets willing to move to the UK from countries with much lower average salaries. These are/will be doing our meat inspection, TB and brucellosis testing and filling the more dodgy 'budget' vaccination clinics.

There is cheap labour out there and this seems to be the magic answer to everything. Sadly it misses the fact that the profession is likely to be a sad reflection of its former self.

Last chance!

Re: OV Fees

John Dennis — Fri, 24 Apr 2015 15:28:52 GMT

[quote user="John Dennis"]

I suspect a large influx of overseas "testers". With the eventual collapse of the TB Testing system within two years as deadlines fail to be met and farms are "locked down". I'm not basically militant but after 40 years in rural Practice I feel that OV's have always bent over backwards to help their clients but this time the back will break.

[/quote]

So sorry to raise this topic once again but John Blackwell has put pen to paper in the Vet Rec with a clear statement that OVs have at last recognised the precarious position that exists between Farming and their Practice. Obviously BVA are getting a lot of questions and they will be providing legal advice about the FUTURE with a Delivery Partner Monopoly. Locally I've established three scenario one of which may not be entirely legal despite every sympathy. 1) Remain working with a 30% reduction in fees based on 2010 fees (probably nearly 45% in real terms) 2) Cease work as OV 3) Ask farmers to engage in "loyalty schemes and pay" to ensure the provision of Testing by the Practice via the Delivery Partners.

Surely the whole system would collapse almost instantly if there was an across the board withdrawal from the schemes.

Perhaps others would like to share their decisions and experiences?????

I'm so glad not to have to decide because I probably would have declined to work for the Delivery Partner on the basis of the fees been derisory.

Re: OV Fees

John Dennis — Sat, 07 Feb 2015 08:00:49 GMT

Thank you Arlo

Thank you for putting solid information into the general practice domain so promptly. It is now obvious that England is going to be won for Tendering based on the lowest bid and that a monopoly will exist. Here is a quote from the article about the challenge:-

Xperior's Veterinary Director, Phil Elkins said: "We are concerned that proposed payment rates for TB testing are considerably lower than those proposed by other bidders, and at a level which questions the viability of practices continuing to provide TB testing services to their clients.

and " this is contrary to a key tenet in the pre-tender documentation that Delivery Partners are expected to maintain a flow of TB testing work and revenue to contribute to the capability of the veterinary profession in rural areas to support food security and the rural economy"

I like Karen Jones am at the end of my career and have passed my Practice to the employees. My main reason for "retirement" from administration was my concern about the 5 and 10 year plan within rural practice. Those Practices working across borders will have many contradictions to face.

I am inherently not a militant but way back in May 2010 when I read the DEFRA letter I felt like stopping testing in protest and said so to others but then the loyalty to clients stepped in. Besides the letter contained veiled threats that "contingency" plans were available to counter withdrawal of labour. Imagine the chaos withdrawal would cause to agriculture and the NFU should support any action taken. We have always looked after our clients and bent over backwards to help DEFRA and our clients. Now those days may well be over since soon no one will be there and chaos may commence should Practices not accept the proposed fees (I note that these may not be available until the very last moment therefore ruining business planning).

I've changed to a glass half empty person after 40 years in Practice.

John

Re: OV Fees

karen jones — Fri, 06 Feb 2015 22:05:52 GMT

I'm glad I'm at the far end of my career, what a mess, not sure where all this leaves us smallish rural practices in a hotspot of TB with 2/3 in England and 1/3 in Wales. Maybe sell up and go locuming feeling disillusioned with the whole situation tonight😒

Re: OV Fees

Arlo Guthrie — Fri, 06 Feb 2015 18:30:18 GMT

Latest news: http://www.vetsurgeon.org/blogs/veterinary_news/archive/2015/02/06/129592.aspx

Re: OV Fees

John Dennis — Thu, 05 Feb 2015 12:09:27 GMT

[quote user="Anthony Dennison"]Grapevine says Westpoint have put in a legal challenge to Excel's bid for tendering[/quote]

Is that out of the frying pan into the fire or vice versa (fire to pan)?

Re: OV Fees

Anthony Dennison — Thu, 05 Feb 2015 12:02:36 GMT

[quote user="Arlo Guthrie"]I’ve just been told there will be some news breaking about this subject tomorrow morning. I’ll post more details as soon as I can - probably late morning or early afternoon tomorrow.[/quote]

Grapevine says Westpoint have put in a legal challenge to Excel's bid for tendering.

Re: OV Fees

Arlo Guthrie — Thu, 05 Feb 2015 11:21:42 GMT

[quote user="John Dennis"]while the English OV's wait until April for the result of tendering. Where is the application of the EU ruling which has led to the Tendering process? Scotland voted to be part of the Union. I know it is extremely complicated but it is an insult to all English OV's who will TB test continuously to help their clients. Maybe OV's should put the brakes on until the Tendering systems are announced so that they can determine whether it's economically valuable to continue TB Testing.[/quote]

I’ve just been told there will be some news breaking about this subject tomorrow morning. I’ll post more details as soon as I can - probably late morning or early afternoon tomorrow.

Re: OV Fees

Hannah Wynne Richards — Thu, 05 Feb 2015 09:37:02 GMT

I was far happier during my final 2 years at Langford than the 1st 3 when I lived in Bristol itself.

Wynne

Re: OV Fees

CatherineThomas — Wed, 04 Feb 2015 21:32:58 GMT

I hate cities too. I just about managed 2 years in Edinburgh before I had to move out to the outskirts. There is no way I would ever live or work in London. (by which I mean anything inside the M25)

Re: OV Fees

John Dennis — Wed, 04 Feb 2015 19:08:25 GMT

[quote user="John Dennis"]I have lived 1/2 hour from Tenbury and had interviewees actually admit they hadn't realised "it was so far from London (for example)".[/quote]

Sorry to revive this but so impressed by the response to London as an example. I was a RVC graduate so it seemed natural first choice.

Thought I would try and see what happens if the example was changed to Liverpool or Bristol. About equidistant to Tenbury.

Re: OV Fees

Michael Woodhouse — Wed, 04 Feb 2015 14:14:23 GMT

I lived in London proper for 2 years (RVC grad). Hate the place. Not been back since.

Re: OV Fees

David Mills — Wed, 04 Feb 2015 11:57:46 GMT

Once you are tired of London, my dears, you are tired of life. Why wouldn't you want to live in the cultural and artistic centre of the world unless you were, well, a bit strange?

And Twickenham, darling, certainly isn't London.

Re: OV Fees

Dagmar Steele — Wed, 04 Feb 2015 10:39:56 GMT

No big cities for me either. I am the happiest when walking in rural Ireland/Norway/... without meeting a soul but my family for hours. To live I prefer places where the kids have access to good schools and activities (daughter owns a Thelwell pony) but I'd never choose to live in a major city!

Re: OV Fees

Hannah Wynne Richards — Wed, 04 Feb 2015 10:25:39 GMT

I'm another who can't stand London. The sheer numbers of people exceed my tolerance levels! Anyway, I think my mother put me off the place. She'd done her nursing training in London, and liked the city. I don't know exactly what I said, but she suddenly realised her daughter was ignorant about the capital, so decided to haul me off to London for the autumn half-term week when I was in Form 2. I was a real Thelwell child, and had planned to spend the entire week riding. Instead I was dragged around a whole lot of sights, museums, art galleries,and was bored out of my mind.

Wynne

Re: OV Fees

Anthony Dennison — Wed, 04 Feb 2015 08:55:22 GMT

[quote user="Evelyn Barbour-Hill"]I'd have thought being far from London a big advantage.[/quote]

I've been to central London twice in my adult life, and one of those times was RVC hosting AVS Sports weekend, so that doesn't count. Don't see what the fuss is about (London, not AVS).

The only other reason I've been to London is Twickenham for the rugby, don't mind that.

Re: OV Fees

Evelyn Barbour-Hill — Tue, 03 Feb 2015 19:04:22 GMT

[quote user="John Dennis"] I have lived 1/2 hour from Tenbury and had interviewees actually admit they hadn't realised "it was so far from London (for example)". [/quote]

I'd have thought being far from London a big advantage.

Re: OV Fees

John Dennis — Tue, 03 Feb 2015 19:00:11 GMT

[quote user="mariette asselbergs"] Where are the UK vets desperately looking for and not succeeding employment in rural practice?[/quote]

Hello Mariette and Alan

Yes, loads of potential vets want to be Rural/mixed for the start of their career. I have lived 1/2 hour from Tenbury and had interviewees actually admit they hadn't realised "it was so far from London (for example)". Besides once they have "mixed" under their belt and on their CV they move on (18 months on average). Guess the OOH or TB Testing causes the move on and the difficulty staying in touch with College friends. Lifestyle is the big determinant. Practices end up with a stream of "New Grads".

Additionally, there are times of the year when advertising is a waste of time. Re advertising in April tends to just give one a stream of potential grads been offered often by the "Job Placement companies" which then charge for their service of promoting a "New Graduate or immigrant vet" because there are few 2 year plus vets wanting Mixed /Rural Practice.

John

Re: OV Fees

Thomas Johnson — Tue, 03 Feb 2015 17:14:09 GMT

[quote user="mariette asselbergs"]

There is a lovely job advertised for mixed practice work in a small practice in Tenbury Wells. Well paid, good conditions, lovely clients, great freedom of practice decisions. There have only been 3 applications, all from foreign vets, none appropriate so far. The practice has never succeeded in getting a proper British vet in the last 8 years. Where are the UK vets desperately looking for and not succeeding employment in rural practice?

[/quote]

And a lovely part of the country to live in as well, I worked for 3 years at the other mixed practice in Tenbury Wells!

Re: OV Fees

Hannah Wynne Richards — Tue, 03 Feb 2015 13:19:31 GMT

Yes, but the smaller farms are becoming less and less profitable - and a decrease in welfare standards is the inevitable result. As I've said before, farm gate milk prices need to be at least 80p/l to restore profitabiliy to a level where animal welfare is returned to acceptable levels.

Wynne

Re: OV Fees

Anthony Dennison — Tue, 03 Feb 2015 12:30:24 GMT

[quote user="Hannah Wynne Richards"]

When I qualified, I saw my future in mixed practice. Cattle medicine has become more like pig and poultry medicine was then, so I'd hate it now.

Wynne

[/quote]

I don't think that this is true Wynne, you're tarring a lot of people (vets and farmers) with the same brush there. There are plenty of smaller farms where individual animals are treated.

Just because herd health monitoring has improved, leading to earlier recognition of problems. It isn't a bad thing.

Re: OV Fees

Hannah Wynne Richards — Tue, 03 Feb 2015 11:27:12 GMT

When I qualified, I saw my future in mixed practice. Cattle medicine has become more like pig and poultry medicine was then, so I'd hate it now.

Wynne

Re: OV Fees

Anthony Dennison — Tue, 03 Feb 2015 09:44:13 GMT

[quote user="Alan Tevendale"] All I was saying was that I suspect there may be an influx of farm vets in a few years, or possibly months, time.[/quote]

Speaking to final years at Bristol a couple of months back, I was surprised at the number that were planning to go straight into farm practice