Pets Passport responsibility!

Re: Pets Passport responsibility!

Anthony Dennison — Mon, 01 Dec 2014 17:34:27 GMT

[quote user="Martin Atkinson"]

[quote user="Bob Russell"]

I have spoken to VDS and they have accepted it was not well worded. It is still 1-5 days before travel and not within 1-5 days of return!

Interesting to see that Arlo has moved into the raw meaty diet camp and is advertising Natural Instinct food. Actually sounds good enough to eat!!

[/quote]Well that is still wrong isn't it - as it is 1-5 days before return to the UK

And naughty Arlo - send it to the sin bin with RMB.

[/quote]

Natures Instinct is a BARF diet - the only thing that Tom Lonsdale hates more than that commercial kibble poison.

Shame on you for not knowing your raw diets!

Re: Pets Passport responsibility!

Martin Atkinson — Mon, 01 Dec 2014 16:21:21 GMT

[quote user="Bob Russell"]

I have spoken to VDS and they have accepted it was not well worded. It is still 1-5 days before travel and not within 1-5 days of return!

Interesting to see that Arlo has moved into the raw meaty diet camp and is advertising Natural Instinct food. Actually sounds good enough to eat!!

[/quote]Well that is still wrong isn't it - as it is 1-5 days before return to the UK

And naughty Arlo - send it to the sin bin with RMB.

Re: Pets Passport responsibility!

Bob Russell — Mon, 01 Dec 2014 14:42:55 GMT

I have spoken to VDS and they have accepted it was not well worded. It is still 1-5 days before travel and not within 1-5 days of return!

Interesting to see that Arlo has moved into the raw meaty diet camp and is advertising Natural Instinct food. Actually sounds good enough to eat!!

Re: Pets Passport responsibility!

Thomas Johnson — Mon, 01 Dec 2014 14:30:12 GMT

[quote user="Bob Russell"]

Just had the VDS Advice Notes update and am a bit confused/concerned. It states that 'Within 1-5 days of returning to the UK, dogs must be treated with Praziquantel and the passport certified'.

If this is the case what percentage of travelling pets are going to get wormed after travelling? Owners will get it done if they know they might be refused boarding but why would they pay a vet to supervise worming once safely back in the UK?

Strikes me as a major dilution of the rules on worming. Is this a mistake by VDS? Should they have said scheduled rather than returning?

https://www.gov.uk/take-pet-abroad/tapeworm-treatment-dogs

[/quote]

Sounds to me like a badly written sentence, as far as I am aware the tapeworm treatment is still 1-5 days before arrival back in the UK.

Re: Pets Passport responsibility!

Martin Atkinson — Mon, 01 Dec 2014 09:52:36 GMT

[quote user="Bob Russell"] Is this a mistake by VDS? Should they have said scheduled rather than returning?[/quote] I would say that there is a major misunderstanding here. The animal has to be treated within 1-5 days BEFORE returning to the UK and the passport should be endorsed to show this or it should be refused entry. This of course means under certain circumstances it could be treated before it goes but not after it has returned.

I really don't understand why some people on this forum, like on the other thread currently running on pet passports, want to question the rules and find ways around them, they are there for a reason, those not complying are breaking the rules and should pay the consequences. It really is simple enough.

Re: Pets Passport responsibility!

Bob Russell — Mon, 01 Dec 2014 09:31:21 GMT

Nothing more to report (so far!) following my two line letter to the owner.

Just had the VDS Advice Notes update and am a bit confused/concerned. It states that 'Within 1-5 days of returning to the UK, dogs must be treated with Praziquantel and the passport certified'.

Strikes me as a major dilution of the rules on worming. Is this a mistake by VDS? Should they have said scheduled rather than returning?

https://www.gov.uk/take-pet-abroad/tapeworm-treatment-dogs

Re: Pets Passport responsibility!

Martin Atkinson — Tue, 04 Nov 2014 13:46:00 GMT

[quote user="Gillian Mostyn"]Martin! My image of you has been shattered. I thought you never made mistakes![/quote]Well even Mary Poppins was only practically perfect!

Re: Pets Passport responsibility!

Gillian Mostyn — Tue, 04 Nov 2014 11:38:37 GMT

Martin! My image of you has been shattered. I thought you never made mistakes! Going to have to go and have a lie down now to recover.

;-)

Re: Pets Passport responsibility!

Martin Atkinson — Tue, 04 Nov 2014 11:15:20 GMT

[quote user="Lazy Bee"]Don't issue any additional paperwork[/quote] I realise that a disclaimer is not a defence if there is a catastrophic error. Mine is intended as much for the benefit of the client and myself as it is for a disclaimer. The value of this was illustrated just last week. I asked the client to check the entries in the passport were correct before signing the form and we spotted that I'd inadvertently entered an incorrect date which was then easily corrected before it became an issue. It is easy to miss a simple error like this or a zero missing from a chip number when proof reading your own work yourself.

Re: Pets Passport responsibility!

Lazy Bee — Mon, 03 Nov 2014 22:34:30 GMT

Don't issue any additional paperwork, all you are doing is providing employment for Sue Grabbit & Run, looking for a weak spot. Just inform the owner of the date from which the passport becomes valid, and the date before which it must be renewed. You might draw the owner's attention to your entry on the passport. Most important however, in your contemporaneous clinical notes, record the above dates and the fact that you informed the owner of these dates. I suppose you might add that, in your opinion, the owner had taken your comments on board - but you are probably just finding something else for S.G&R to get their teeth into. I find that generally, simple is best.

Re: Pets Passport responsibility!

Anthony Todd — Sun, 02 Nov 2014 01:41:57 GMT

The trouble and cost of compensation we had was always when a staff member [or vet!] had given totally incorrect advice, and usually dogmatically insisted it was correct , when challenged by the client.

Can be very expensive!

We ended up telling staff to advise clients to get their own advice, in writing from the shipper or DEFRA.

Re: Pets Passport responsibility!

Neil Wheadon — Sat, 01 Nov 2014 22:11:12 GMT

Interestingly I was told recently that some Equine practices no longer send reminders for vaccination. I assume the strict time restraints and possibility of litigation being the reason. There are parallels here, might be worth asking an equine vet.

Neil

Re: Pets Passport responsibility!

An On MRCVS — Sat, 01 Nov 2014 13:26:20 GMT

[quote user="Robin Grimmer"]

[quote user="An On MRCVS"]

Anon posting because I am discussing a few personal details.

I just cannot see how this is your fault. We cannot be responsible for everything for every animal. In my view you have done nothing wrong. You wrote on the passport the vaccine valid until date, you explained this to the client, job done!

What did the VDS say, out of interest?

It is behaviour like this from clients that has pushed me out of clinical work. It's all about the money and it's always your fault according to the owner. I have had 2 RCVS complaints, both were closed at the first opportunity, but I never ever want to go through the stress again. I did nothing wrong and VDS told me this, but I was still worried, and it was a huge blow to my confidence. I decided then that practice wasn't for me, as owners can easily complain, through guilt, money or whatever. The most upsetting thing is that you are trying your best, doing the best thing for the animals, with no bad intentions and they will still complain.

Sorry to hijack the thread but I feel this is worth discussing given the ridiculous claims that this owner is trying to make.

[/quote]

What are you doing now Anon?

[/quote]

I'm working in academia now, and enjoying it much more than practice! Some of us just aren't meant to be in a consult room or an operating theatre everyday!

Re: Pets Passport responsibility!

Bob Russell — Fri, 31 Oct 2014 15:40:58 GMT

It amazes me how much impact a stupid complaint can have. Everyone here is pretty riled by it. Nobody is worried nor losing a minutes sleep over it but it makes you realise what people must go through if they are not as old, stubborn and bloody minded as I am!

If anyone else is going to see the poppies please avoid sunset tomorrow as it would be nice to be the only ones there when they play the Last Post. Despite the hassle (not to mention the ludicrous amount of money I have spent on a hotel) I have to say I am really looking forward to it even if there are big crowds.

My grandfather was badly wounded twice but met my grandmother who was one of his nurses. The only close relative that we lost in WW1 was a great uncle who got drunk and fell off the cart going to the recruiting office. He broke his neck! May have been a blessing in disguise when you consider what so many went through.

Re: Pets Passport responsibility!

Martin Atkinson — Fri, 31 Oct 2014 15:25:26 GMT

[quote user="Bob Russell"]We are off to see the poppies in London tomorrow.[/quote]This is one thing that is actually as good as the hype would have you believe if not better so have a good trip.

Re the OP. this is what the VDS is for. Even if you lose the case (which you won't) let them get on with it and forget it, its not worth losing even one minute's sleep over.

Re: Pets Passport responsibility!

Bob Russell — Fri, 31 Oct 2014 09:37:07 GMT

We are off to see the poppies in London tomorrow. I have checked the train booking, tickets and hotel reservations so often that they are a blur!

Six of us and a slip up would be a disaster. My responsibility and facing the wrath of the other half is a lot more scary than a DC 'trial'!

I could, of course blame South West Trains if I have booked for the wrong days!

Re: Pets Passport responsibility!

Hannah Wynne Richards — Thu, 30 Oct 2014 18:52:29 GMT

I'm usually supportive of Royal College - but honestly! Their latest arbitration scheme will just give the dishonest who don't want to pay yet another stick to beat us with

Wynne

Re: Pets Passport responsibility!

Dagmar Steele — Thu, 30 Oct 2014 18:02:34 GMT

I'm new to this thread, but honestly, do they expect the council to remind them when their passport expires, read their minds where they might want to travel and so on? Everyone in their right minds checks or asks someone who knows what kind of paperwork they need to go abroad, but they expect us to do it for their pets?

I am with Anon on this one especially after having received a letter from a solicitor two days ago (owner doesn't want to pay, reasoning why is ridiculous - but still, the hassle and worries are real and it will consume my time and energy)...

Re: Pets Passport responsibility!

Robin Grimmer — Thu, 30 Oct 2014 17:17:21 GMT

[quote user="An On MRCVS"]

Anon posting because I am discussing a few personal details.

What did the VDS say, out of interest?

Sorry to hijack the thread but I feel this is worth discussing given the ridiculous claims that this owner is trying to make.

[/quote]

What are you doing now Anon?

Re: Pets Passport responsibility!

Rob Loxley — Thu, 30 Oct 2014 16:31:43 GMT

[quote user="mariette asselbergs"]he/she will need to show to have been blood tested 21 days after the vaccination[/quote]

I thought under current rules (2012 onwards) the blood test needed to be taken at least 30 days after vaccination

Re: Pets Passport responsibility!

Hannah Wynne Richards — Thu, 30 Oct 2014 11:14:28 GMT

Exactly my fear about Royal College's new arbitration scheme. Veterinary surgeons will be tempted to let clients off paying fully justified bills, simply to avoid the hasslr - then other clients will also try it on.

Wynne

Re: Pets Passport responsibility!

Bob Russell — Thu, 30 Oct 2014 10:35:19 GMT

Obviously it is still ongoing but the jist of it is he said, she said. Clearly it would be bonkers for me to throw aways work so had anyone asked if vaccinations were overdue it would have been clearly flagged up!

VDS suggested a sympathetic letter but clear emphasis on the responsibility being with the owner. This proved insufficient. Follow up letter was two lines politely reinforcing the message that it is the responsibility of the owner.

Not sure where it goes from here but I have to say it is extremely frustrating to deal with this type of situation. If they find a greedy enough solicitor everything will be dealt with by VDS!

Sadly just because a claim is ludicrous and trying to pass the buck, it does not mean it can be treated casually.

Money is the motivation!

I have no fear of the PIC but really don't want the hassle. This is the world we live in!

Re: Pets Passport responsibility!

An On MRCVS — Wed, 29 Oct 2014 19:17:05 GMT

Anon posting because I am discussing a few personal details.

What did the VDS say, out of interest?

Sorry to hijack the thread but I feel this is worth discussing given the ridiculous claims that this owner is trying to make.

Re: Pets Passport responsibility!

Martin Atkinson — Wed, 29 Oct 2014 18:42:36 GMT

[quote user="mariette asselbergs"]So the passport is only valid for return to the UK depending on where the pet returns from.[/quote]That is why I put all I do in my information sheet/disclaimer that goes out with every passport and is also on my website. It just has to be made clear to the client that we will help where we can but ultimately it is their responsibility to know the rules.

Re: Pets Passport responsibility!

Bob Russell — Wed, 29 Oct 2014 16:41:30 GMT

Still on-going!

Naturally I am negligent for not making sure they checked the dates on the passport before travel!

Been warned that the owner may prefer to take the case to the Royal College (and owners really do seem to have got their teeth into this!).

Perhaps I will be seeing the disciplinary process from the inside!!