Any mountaineers out there?

Re: Any mountaineers out there?

Clive Ansell — Mon, 09 Dec 2013 11:21:20 GMT

If you have time or want a good training day, the classic climb Cioch nose on Applecross is worth a go. 200 meters and 7 or 8 pitches, graded VDiff by some, but severe by the SMC. It is very exposed in parts and has a few tricky moves so I would rate it as severe rather than VDiff. If you have the guides, or cannot complete the Cuillin ridge because of the weather Cioch nose is good plan B. Food and ale in the Applecross inn just rounds the day off nicely.

Re: Any mountaineers out there?

Alex Allen — Mon, 09 Dec 2013 10:05:52 GMT

It's been a few years since I did the ridge but important points mentioned above worth repeating:

1. Take enough water - NONE on the ridge line

2. Keep pack light - it can be a long day(s)

3. Start early - that means leaving base camp pre sunrise - this means you hit the ridge just when you need to otherwise the queues build up +++.If you're trying for as many in 1 day this is essential or even if you're doing it over 2ds it allows you more time on the ridge to take in the views, queue, change your plans due to weather etc.

4. TD gap, In Pinn, Kings Chimney all have the potential for sitting around and waiting - sitting around for 45mins at 5am waiting while a team of 4 rope their way down and up TD gap can be frustrating but you have to make allowances as it is daunting due to the exposure for some.

5. There are short cuts round the more technically difficult parts but take care navigating in poor weather it does drop away quite quickly! In Pinn is exposed and not hard from one side but does require an abseil off a fixed ring at the top. In my mad youth we free climbed the steep end as there were too many people queuing up the ridge line. Would highly recommend the In Pinn by whichever route as it is so iconic of the Cuillins.

Will never forget the ridge as I've yet to climb / scramble anything like it. Luckily for me both occasions have been perfect weather too!

NB - we camped at Glen Brittle which is a good starting point for the ridge.

Good luck

Re: Any mountaineers out there?

Bibs — Sun, 08 Dec 2013 15:14:58 GMT

I wondered if you would remember who I was or not haha.

Re: Any mountaineers out there?

Rob Reid — Sat, 07 Dec 2013 14:52:21 GMT

Thanks for your advice folks.

Yeah, being 'mountain fit' is very different to gym or sport fit! For me the mountain fitness isn't too much of an issue - I'll just need to step it up a little in April and May. I rack up around a fair number of miles every weekend on the NY Moors and in the Dales and I do around 8 hours of of snowboarding a month which is great for the legs. The boarding will increase over the winter as I get up to Scotland and build up for hitting the Alps in March. I also do swimming and mountain-biking so plenty of mixed cardio and leg exercise.

I'll look at climbing clubs around here, one of my local friends used to do a lot of climbing so I'll speak to him. I know of a couple of indoor centres, I can add an hours climbing into my snowboarding sessions for example as the centre also has a climbing wall. It will be good to get some outdoor experience as well though.

Much to ponder over the next few weeks!

Re: Any mountaineers out there?

Clive Ansell — Sat, 07 Dec 2013 12:49:05 GMT

The Inaccessible Pinnacle, or In Pin, as it is often called is the easiest of the climbs. The usual route (east face I think) is graded moderate and is hardly any more technical that a Gd 3 scramble. It is the exposure that makes it seem more difficult. If you had the confidence you could scramble up roped together. There are other routes that are shorter and higher graded, but none are that hard.

It is popular as it is on the list of Munro's, and there are likely to be queues, so be warned. Taking one of the shorted harder climbs will avoid them though.

Any exercise that improves cardiovascular fitness and endurance will help. I cycle to get fit for mountaineering trips, but the best way to get fit to climb mountains, is to climb mountains. Even long days in lesser hills helps, in Worcestershire I sometimes walk the length of the Malvern hills and back, about 1200 meters of ascent in total, more than one might think.

Re: Any mountaineers out there?

Laurence Webb — Sat, 07 Dec 2013 12:27:45 GMT

It is a few years since I climbed in the Culin, so my memories are not too fresh but I will give my two pence worth.

I've not done the ridge (would love to) although I've climbed the In Pinn. The climbing is not technically difficult but there is a LOT of exposure there - if someone else leads that it should not be too big a problem. It sounds as though you'd be OK with the exposure but having recently got a friend rockfast in Wales resulting in a rather embarrassing ride in a big yellow flying taxi it is something I'm much more aware of now.

I think indoor climbing is probably not too much help for this (general fitness is more important) but getting more outdoor experience would be the best thing. If you can move confidently on the rock without the need to confidence rope or put protection in for the majority of the ridge then you will have a much better chance of doing it. For the bits where protection is required being confident with some basic rope work will help.

Your bio says you are in Darlington so you are close to several climbing areas. If you don't know anyone close by to climb with I expect there are plenty of clubs that you could join to get some experience

There's a good article on the route in this link http://www.ukclimbing.com/articles/page.php?id=1024

Re: Any mountaineers out there?

Clive Ansell — Sat, 07 Dec 2013 12:01:58 GMT

Go for it!

I've completed the Cuillin ridge traverse twice, plus many other summer and winter trips there too. It is a fantastic mountaineering expedition, but is tough and should not be under estimated.

You'll need to be in good shape, 12 Km plus 4000 meters of ascent and descent over 2 days with a night bivvy. Some do it one day, but that is a very high and probably unrealistic expectation taking 20+ hours. You'll need to be mountain fit as opposed to gym fit. Plenty of training and getting in long mountain days with multiple long ascents ideally. You should be able to ascend 400 to 500 meters per hour on a good path or track.

It is physically and mentally demanding but not all that technical. Most of the ridge is graded 2 and 3 out of 3 scrambling. From memory there are 4 graded climbs ranging from moderate to severe, but they are all fairly short pitches on good grip gabbro rock. They can all be bypassed depending on time, the group, conditions, and how much of a purist you are. The Aonach Eagach ridge above Glencoe and Crib Goch in Snowdon would be good preparation. Any climbing and rope work experience would be useful, particularly moving together quickly and continuously on a rope along a ridge line.

It is very exposed in parts, you'll need a head for heights.

The weather can be a problem, conditions can be appalling up there and route finding is difficult on the ridge line in poor visibility. Most folk that bail out do so because of the weather. I'm told it rains 330 days a year on Skye. May seems to be the most reliable month for good weather.

Travel light. Keep you pack as light as possible and only carry the bare minimum. What seems like a light and reasonable pack when you start can become a real burden if it gets wet and heavier and when you're tired and negotiating tricky moves. You have to carry all your water, there is none on the ridge line in summer. You could as a training day, take water and food to your bivvy point before you start, but you need to be sure you will reach it in the event of things not going to plan. If you're really lucky the guides will arrange it.

Re: Any mountaineers out there?

Dagmar Steele — Sat, 07 Dec 2013 11:42:27 GMT

Bob, good on you for being so reflective about it. Reading what you've written now I think you should go for it. If even your brother who knows you well enough thinks you're up for it, I think I would trust him. Anyway I would put in as much exercise in and out doors as I could beforehand if not for my fitness level it would be for the build up excitement and as the Germans say Vorfreude :-) (anticipation)

Re: Any mountaineers out there?

Rob Reid — Sat, 07 Dec 2013 11:32:43 GMT

Thanks for your input guys.

Exposure / fear not really an issue TBH - I've got a healthy respect for heights but no real fear of them. I've done a couple of exposed scrambles before and I snowboard at a decent level (which has included doing cliff drops, dropping in off cornices, going down 50 degree pitches 'and jumping off 20 foot kickers.) Yeah I admit it, I kinda like adrenaline!

My main worries for the trip are firstly that I don't want to hold back the rest of the group. One of them is my older brother and he is much more experienced than me, but he's asked me to do it and thinks I'll be up to it - a nice compliment as he probably knows me better than most. The other 2 I don't know so well, though I've walked with 1 before and we're a similar level fitness-wise though he's got more climbing experience than me.

Secondly, although it's in June, I will be limited preparation-wise as really I've only got 4-6 weeks beforehand (weather-permitting) of getting some outdoor experience in. I can get indoor rock-climbing training easily enough near where I live, but nothing really prepares you like the real thing!

Liz - the In Pin is part of the ridge and in theory is the only part where you have to rock climb, the other rock climbs on the ridge can be skipped but there's a lot of level 3 scrambling in between so it's a challenge both physically and mentally. My gut feeling on this one is that I'm kind of torn so going to mull it over a bit before I decide (don't need to make a decision until the New Year.) Oh and good to see you again the other day, albeit briefly!

Re: Any mountaineers out there?

Dagmar Steele — Sat, 07 Dec 2013 10:05:08 GMT

Bob, I can't really comment on the climbs you want to do or you have done because I know none of them. I just want to ask you a few questions. If you are not concerned about your fitness level, are you concerned about your level of anxiousness? Is it possible that you get frightened if something is really steep or hard to climb? How long is it before it will take place? Is there enough time to gain experience that you might need? Technical stuff is something you can learn, in contrast to fighting possible fears, so it depends on which your concerns are! It does sound like a once-in-a-lifetime experience, and if I really wanted to go for it I'd start preparing now!

Re: Any mountaineers out there?

Bibs — Sat, 07 Dec 2013 09:01:53 GMT

I've not done The Cullin ridge but I have done the Aonach Eagach and have in the past dabbled in climbing quite a bit.

If I were you I suppose I'd want to check I was OK with that much exposure first, and would probably want to get a bit of instruction/experience with some basic rock climbing rope work outdoors....abseiling and so on.The In Pinn is part of the ridge isn't it?

I hear it's quite technical. I'd go with your gut feeling on anything like this anyway. If you're not sure then maybe do some other stuff to build up to it first. I am quite cautious though :)