A plucky vet

Re: A plucky vet

Dagmar Steele — Mon, 11 Nov 2013 10:29:19 GMT

Go for it Thomas, it's stunning!

Re: A plucky vet

Thomas Johnson — Mon, 11 Nov 2013 10:20:08 GMT

[quote user="Dagmar Steele"]

[quote user="Thomas Johnson"]

I climbed Carauntoohill a few years ago, one of those days that starts without a cloud in the sky, a wonderful climb to the summit, but then the clouds came in and the scramble down with only a few feet of visibility was one of the most terrifying things I have ever done.

[/quote]

Yes, unfortunately both the last way up to the summit after the devil's ladder and the way down was mainly in the clouds, hence we didn't have any good views. Which is why I'd like to do it again on a sunny day and why the walk onto Mount Brandon was so memorable for us.

[/quote]

Unfortunately we didn't have time to do Mount Brandon, it's on my 'to do' list though!

Re: A plucky vet

Dagmar Steele — Mon, 11 Nov 2013 10:14:52 GMT

[quote user="Thomas Johnson"]

[/quote]

Re: A plucky vet

Thomas Johnson — Mon, 11 Nov 2013 10:07:44 GMT

[quote user="Dagmar Steele"]

Two years ago we went up Carauntoohill via the devil's ladder in late march which they easily managed, others they did before or afterwards.

[/quote]

Re: A plucky vet

Laurence Webb — Sun, 10 Nov 2013 22:47:54 GMT

[quote user="Evelyn Barbour-Hill"]Helicopter SAR in the UK is about to be privatised. It will be interesting to see if fees start creeping in.[/quote]

Yes, I'm aware of this and uncertain how the funding is going to work. At the moment I expect that MRT assess the necessity of a helicopter call-out very well so the RAF are only called in it situations that it is really justified rather than it being an 'easy' option for them. In our case we happened to call them at the end of a training day so there were lots of people on site when we called. They sent 2 foot parties up to us which were recalled once we were winched aboard so didn't reach us, but they were prepared to get us out on foot anyway if the helicopter request had been denied.

If fees were involved would we have called them when we did? Not sure, but probably not at that point. We were still in an escapable position (back up the gully and downclimb or up to the summit) but that would have involved forcing someone who had used up all his mental reserves through more stress which would have put is into more danger. Still a different kettle of fish from someone injured who can not be moved any other way.

If fees creep in I can't say they wouldn't be justified in cases like ours. Perhaps insurance (eg through BMC membership) may be an answer but, much like in our profession, a lot of headache will be caused by those with no insurance and no ability to pay when they suddenly need something they hadn't though they'd need. Probably by the same people who climb mountains wearing a jumper and trainiers with an Iphone with a flat battery to navigate by.

Re: A plucky vet

Dagmar Steele — Sun, 10 Nov 2013 22:35:22 GMT

Thanks Laurence, I've looked into some walk descriptions and routes in the meantime. I think heather terrace would be the way up for us. The kids are fine with things like this, their stamina is better than mine and they are very confident on their feet (and hands). We won't take them in strong winds, snow or icy conditions or fog. But I'm not keen on walking in these conditions myself. Two years ago we went up Carauntoohill via the devil's ladder in late march which they easily managed, others they did before or afterwards. So far one of my favourites is Mount Brandon on the Dingle peninsula. We were lucky enough to walk it in beautiful weather when the top was still covered in snow, some very spectacular views. I hope you'll enjoy the tour yourself one day, good on you for making the right decision that day!

Re: A plucky vet

Laurence Webb — Sun, 10 Nov 2013 22:20:01 GMT

Sorry Dagmar - I've been busy having a different sort of fun this weekend so didn't see your post but I think MrsVanoord has summarised it well. Although not technically difficult (we had a confidence rope that ended getting used heavily for my friend but a confident scrambler could do it without) you do gain height rapidly and the exposure is quite marked and that was the problem that scared my friend. Physically I found it quite easy but I'm not sure I'd take kids there unless they were very confident. Even if you don't require a helicopter ride back down, to downclimb the scramble would be very slow and difficult.

It was the first time I'd tried the North Ridge (although I'd climbed Tryfan from Heather Terrace up the West face before) so can't tell you what the end of the scramble is like although the other member of our group has done it over 15 times and reports that the ground gets easier towards the end. For nearly all the route there are plenty of options - you just pick a route that suits your ability and what you fancy trying. Where we became unstuck (or should that be stuck) was a short climb up North Tower then dropping down into a gully. The mountain narrows at that point so there would be very few options to avoid that part of the route.

There are other routes up there that are easier - going along Heather Terrace to the West side is quite easy going although when I previously went there we turned off before the end to climb Pinnacle Rib, so I can't vouch for the end part. At the end you'd turn back to reach the summit, which is easy scrambling and less exposed (I've descended that and it was fine). Even less exposed routes walk up the valleys either side of the mountain then you have the same easy scramble you would meat if you went up Heather Terrace.

I like that photo - I kept taking a picture then a minute later the rainbow was clearer so I'd take another so it is the end of a series of 4 or 5. It doesn't come out well, but it was actually a double rainbow. What does come out quite well though is the MRT cottage in the bottom left although at that point I had no idea we would be paying a visit an hour or so later.

Re: A plucky vet

Dagmar Steele — Sat, 09 Nov 2013 22:38:49 GMT

Sorry Evelyn, I took your post the wrong way apparently. No worries.

Re: A plucky vet

Evelyn Barbour-Hill — Sat, 09 Nov 2013 21:06:47 GMT

[quote user="Clair Firth"]Just a word of warning for anyone "wanting" to try this in the Austrian alps - any helicopter rescues carry a large fee! About 3000 euros I think, which is payable whether you request the helicopter or not. Once mountain rescue is called out and decides it's too dangerous/impossible to get the climber/walker off the mountain by foot or mountain road, then the choppers are summoned and there's nothing you can do about it! It recently happened to someone with a broken leg, mountain rescue got there by jeep but had already called the medicopter and this woman was left with a huge bill![/quote]

Helicopter SAR in the UK is about to be privatised. It will be interesting to see if fees start creeping in.

Re: A plucky vet

Evelyn Barbour-Hill — Sat, 09 Nov 2013 21:03:29 GMT

[quote user="Dagmar Steele"][quote user="Evelyn Barbour-Hill"]

Tryfan is not for novices.

[/quote] Well I certainly didn't expect it to be Evelyn, having read about the three lads winched to safety by a sea king. MrsVanoords answer was a tad more helpful to be honest, thanks again for that!

[/quote]

Sorry, just my instant response, Mrs. V must have been posting while I was composing or something. I didn't mean to be patronising. I'ver never been up Tryfan and I don't suppose I will now.

Re: A plucky vet

Dagmar Steele — Sat, 09 Nov 2013 20:41:54 GMT

Same applies to sea rescues off the Danish Coast I've been told. We once had the time of our lives on a great windsurfing day. Some people got worried about us and it nearly turned out to be a very expensive day.

Re: A plucky vet

Clair Firth — Sat, 09 Nov 2013 20:36:25 GMT

[quote user="Laurence Webb"]

It is with no small degree of embarrassment that I must report that my trip to Snowdonia ended with some unwelcome excitement after my friend lost confidence whilst we were scrambling on Tryfan on Sunday. Being unable to move up or down we had to call on Ogwen MRT and we were winched aboard a Sea King.

[/quote]

Just a word of warning for anyone "wanting" to try this in the Austrian alps - any helicopter rescues carry a large fee! About 3000 euros I think, which is payable whether you request the helicopter or not. Once mountain rescue is called out and decides it's too dangerous/impossible to get the climber/walker off the mountain by foot or mountain road, then the choppers are summoned and there's nothing you can do about it! It recently happened to someone with a broken leg, mountain rescue got there by jeep but had already called the medicopter and this woman was left with a huge bill!

Glad you got back safely though - sounds like an adventure to tell the grandkids about

Re: A plucky vet

Dagmar Steele — Sat, 09 Nov 2013 19:17:38 GMT

[quote user="Evelyn Barbour-Hill"]

Tryfan is not for novices.

Re: A plucky vet

Dagmar Steele — Sat, 09 Nov 2013 18:35:14 GMT

Thanks, that's mainly how I expected it to be. We're no novices to climbing and scrambling, we've done our bit in Norway, Switzerland, Ireland and the like. We even dragged the kids up whenever possible and responsible. Funny enough though my husband comes from Devon we've never made it to Wales! That will change the next time we go to see the in laws meI thinks :-)

Re: A plucky vet

Evelyn Barbour-Hill — Sat, 09 Nov 2013 17:43:28 GMT

Tryfan is not for novices.

Re: A plucky vet

Ceri Gruffudd Jones — Sat, 09 Nov 2013 17:28:02 GMT

It is demanding but not in the extreme. You need to be physically enough to spend the whole day exercising moderately (with tea / butty breaks, of course) using hands and feet. The North Ridge is very definitely a scramble, not a walk. While most of the tricky bits can be circumnavigated with some careful route selection there are a few places where you HAVE to climb, usually no more than about 6 vertical feet with very positive hand and foot holds. However, the sense of exposure is quite high so a cool head is needed as well. route finding can be tricky on the North ridge - lots of rescues happen because people head too far round to the east and get stuck on steeper ground - if you aren't a confident scrambler, I advise going with someone who is and knows the way for your first attempt. Pick a dry and not too windy day. That said, it is an awesome route and gets you high very quickly. Scrambling is great fun when done carefully and really gives you above. Especially when the RAF jets come screaming by below you....

Re: A plucky vet

Dagmar Steele — Sat, 09 Nov 2013 11:55:33 GMT

Laurence, how demanding a climb is it? It looks like some hills we've done in Ireland and makes me want to go to Wales immediately! Beautiful photograph, even the kids agreed and didn't say "oh no, not another hill!" ;-)

Re: A plucky vet

Laurence Webb — Fri, 08 Nov 2013 21:37:01 GMT

[quote user="Gillian Mostyn"]Not done Tryfan myself....it is on my list! [/quote]

I would love to go back to complete the ridge. Views like this make it worth it (taken just before my friend got cragfast)

Re: A plucky vet

Gillian Mostyn — Thu, 07 Nov 2013 23:43:25 GMT

[quote user="Utlendigur"]You can tell quite a lot about what the MRT thought about the rescuees from the report on OVMRO website[/quote]

The one that made me laugh was the idiot who decided to climb in the dark, took the wrong map, was relying on a smartphone but then had to ring the MRT when he fell and smashed the screen.....

Re: A plucky vet

Utlendigur — Thu, 07 Nov 2013 23:29:52 GMT

[quote user="Laurence Webb"]

The guys at MRT were awesome and I am ashamed to have got into a situation where we needed them. During our debriefing they were completely non-judgemental and even said they hoped we would return.

[/quote]

You can tell quite a lot about what the MRT thought about the rescuees from the report on OVMRO website - some of them are fairly sarcastic to put it mildly when people treat them as a taxi service off the hills, or don't even know which mountain they are on - but ..."The novice climber was unable to go up or down so they wisely rang for help." I know a couple of ex members of the team, and get the impression that like us, the genuine emergencies, ie where people have been sensible but just got into difficulties, are what they do it for - it's the irresponsible, just pick up the phone at the slightest difficulty and make it someone else's responsibility, ones that are the problem

Re: A plucky vet

Laurence Webb — Thu, 07 Nov 2013 23:12:17 GMT

We only had the weekend up there. The weather on Saturday wasn't great so we went from Pen y Pas along the Miner's Track then cut off to go up towards Lliwedd. We were (sort of) aiming for Snowdon but didn't expect to reach it due to the weather and we retreated before getting to the ridge proper as the wind was too high. We dropped down and ended up on the Watkins path then walked up for a pint (or three) at the Pen Y Gwyrd. A thoroughly enjoyable day!

Tryfan itself is well worth a trip. I've previously climbed there but it was the first time I'd tried the North Ridge. Our mistake was taking someone who wasn't so good with heights and misreading how worried he was until we had got him into a situation where he didn't feel he could go forward or back. I know he is technically able to do it, as I climb with him regularly, but the degree of exposure was something he was unused to. Our fault for putting him in that situation entirely.

A lesson learnt and humble pie being eaten.

Re: A plucky vet

Gillian Mostyn — Thu, 07 Nov 2013 22:39:41 GMT

erm....oops!

Sounds like you made the best and safest decision in the circumstances. I have a good friend (and good hiker) who became cragfast when climbing a munro and needed to be talked down by a MRT. It can happen - but better to get help when everyone is unhurt and it is still light than wait for accident or darkness!

Not done Tryfan myself....it is on my list! Did you manage to get some walking/climbing done?

Re: A plucky vet

Laurence Webb — Thu, 07 Nov 2013 22:03:01 GMT

[quote user="Laurence Webb"]A good news story from Llanberis Mountain Rescue. I'm heading up that way for some mountain fun in a couple of weeks. Hopefully I wan't need to bother these guys[/quote]

The guys at MRT were awesome and I am ashamed to have got into a situation where we needed them. During our debriefing they were completely non-judgemental and even said they hoped we would return. They also make the best cup of tea I have ever tasted.

My wife was considerably more judgemental (and quite rightly).

http://www.dailypost.co.uk/news/north-wales-news/three-rescued-after-getting-stuck-6268457

Re: A plucky vet

Ceri Gruffudd Jones — Fri, 18 Oct 2013 21:49:05 GMT

Kes is a friend of mine. She does not go underground (caving, potholing etc) but is an experienced hillwalker and rock climber. Yes, she is brave and put her own fears aside. However, she would like everyone to remember that the rescue could not have happened without the volunteer team of Llanberis Mountain Rescue who frequently go out in all sorts of inclement conditions and at no small risk to themselves to rescue People for a whole lot less recognition. I am very proud of her, though!

Re: A plucky vet

Hannah Wynne Richards — Fri, 18 Oct 2013 11:16:03 GMT

At the very least an RSPCA bravery award

Wynne