Veterinary surgeons average salary falls 9.9%

Re: Veterinary surgeons average salary falls 9.9%

Sarah Keir — Fri, 31 May 2013 20:43:49 GMT

[quote user="Iain McAllister"]

[quote user="Sarah Keir"]details of your current package[/quote]

Think I would get creative Play them at their own game...

Cheeky S**ds!

[/quote]

That's what I thought, but I checked around and it is legal and they can check up on this fairly easily and legally (and when you give them your P45).

Re: Veterinary surgeons average salary falls 9.9%

Martin Atkinson — Fri, 31 May 2013 15:28:07 GMT

Veterinary surgeons average salary falls 9.9%

Having seen my turnover and profits increase, albeit modestly, last year for the first time in several years and having had the best January on record I felt moved to give my nurses a generous bonus and was optimistic for the coming year. Since then things have gone downhill. Just at the point I was going to give the nurses a real pay rise for the first time in 18 months the past 4 months turnover has been on average 12% down on last year so this headline doesn't surprise me

Re: Veterinary surgeons average salary falls 9.9%

Thomas Johnson — Fri, 31 May 2013 09:23:03 GMT

[quote user="Sarah Keir"]

Wages are definitely going to be pushed down when advertisements looking for experienced vets are asking for the details of your current package along with your CV as the initial application! See job ad for 'experienced surgeon and internal medic' by 'waggintails' in Chelsea in Veterinary Times Vol 43, No 21, published 27th May.

[/quote]

I have usually been asked at interview what my current salary is, usually I reply by telling them what salary I would want from them. In one interview things definitely went down hill at that point, but then I'd have turned the job down if they couldn't get close to what I was asking for!

Re: Veterinary surgeons average salary falls 9.9%

Iain McAllister — Thu, 30 May 2013 13:43:56 GMT

[quote user="Sarah Keir"]details of your current package[/quote]

Think I would get creative Play them at their own game...

Cheeky S**ds!

Re: Veterinary surgeons average salary falls 9.9%

Sarah Keir — Thu, 30 May 2013 13:10:58 GMT

The only reason to ask the salary outright would be to find the cheapest vet or try to pay as little as possible, rather than having a discussion on worth.

But you get what you pay for.

Sarah

Re: Veterinary surgeons average salary falls 9.9%

Charlotte Marshall — Mon, 27 May 2013 11:02:05 GMT

[quote user="Neil Wheadon"]I see barristers and judges at 60th place on just over £40000, with a drop of 5.5%[/quote]

However if you look higher up the chart legal professionals appear twice. There appears to be some overlap in certain categories.

Re: Veterinary surgeons average salary falls 9.9%

james hunt — Sun, 26 May 2013 21:15:47 GMT

[quote user="Thomas Johnson"]

Does the figue take into account whether vets are working full or part time? If not an increasing number of people working part time would push the figure down.

Also a lot of new graduates get accomodation as a non-taxable benefit, so this would also push the figure down.

[/quote]

The full spreadsheets can be downloaded from the office of national statistics website. The mean (25-75th interquartile range) weekly earnings for full time vets are recorded as 715.10 (537.80-828), for part time the weekly figure is recorded as 409.90 (percentile figures not produced).

Re: Veterinary surgeons average salary falls 9.9%

Neil Wheadon — Wed, 22 May 2013 18:06:33 GMT

Lies, lies and statistics?

I see barristers and judges at 60th place on just over £40000, with a drop of 5.5%

The percentage drops are interesting as I had a session of 'barrister training' a few years ago in case I was called to court as an expert witness and so needed to know how to deal with professionals who thrive on an arguement. Apparantly they were just starting to overtrain with more colleges training barristers (only one before) so leading to oversupply........sounds familiar.

Neil

Re: Veterinary surgeons average salary falls 9.9%

Gillian Mostyn — Tue, 21 May 2013 22:11:25 GMT

I'd recommend talking to HMRC and getting it in writing if they are happy for it to be tax free. Other helplines are all well and good, but I don't suppose they will pay your tax bill if HMRC disagrees.....

Re: Veterinary surgeons average salary falls 9.9%

Helen Wallace — Tue, 21 May 2013 21:50:50 GMT

When we stopped doing our own OOH I was taxed on accomodation. Took a while to sort out so I was hit with a massive back tax bill. Had I still done OOH hmrc said it might have been allowable.It all depends on the situation.

Re: Veterinary surgeons average salary falls 9.9%

Mark Holmes — Tue, 21 May 2013 21:01:03 GMT

It's in black and white. It is customary in many cases for vets to be provided with accommodation. Customary in that every job I have had bar the last 6 months has had one or more vets with practice housing and all or most of my friends have been in practice housing at some stage. I spoke to the BVA tax advice line specifically.

Re: Veterinary surgeons average salary falls 9.9%

Gillian Mostyn — Tue, 21 May 2013 19:51:30 GMT

Be very careful..... I assure you that if HMRC find out you may get a big bill(as one of my employees did when she didn't disclose all her employment benefits). You are only entitled to tax-free accommodation in very specific circumstances, such as getting frequent emergency calls etc. If you don't do much OOH, or if other equivalent employees live away from the practice with no problems etc, then you are taking a big risk!

http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/payerti/exb/a-z/l/accommodation.htm#1

http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/helpsheets/hs202.pdf

Re: Veterinary surgeons average salary falls 9.9%

Mark Holmes — Tue, 21 May 2013 10:02:26 GMT

[quote user="Thomas Johnson"]

[quote user="Gillian Mostyn"]

[quote user="Thomas Johnson"]Also a lot of new graduates get accomodation as a non-taxable benefit, so this would also push the figure down.[/quote]

I don't know what decade you're in, but these days it is nigh on impossible to get exempt from any accommodation-related tax unless it is imperative you live permanently at the practice.

[/quote]

I think it's easier if you're doing large animal work, I moved out of practice accommodation that I got as a non-taxable benefit in 2009 when we bought a house, but as far as I am aware the vet who moved in after me got it as a non-taxable benefit as well.

[/quote] As far as I understand you can still use it as a non taxable benefit. Certainly it wasn't taxable 2 years ago when I had one. I spoke to a BVA tax adviser about it

Re: Veterinary surgeons average salary falls 9.9%

Bob Russell — Tue, 21 May 2013 09:22:05 GMT

I assume the figures were based on like for like basis so should be a fair comparison with previous figures. A 10% drop means a 10% drop unless other factors have changed.

I have been paying 40% tax on money I never see as income. A limited company set up allows a practice owner to pay an amount of tax, more in keeping with true income.

Profit is not the same as available income!

Re: Veterinary surgeons average salary falls 9.9%

Thomas Johnson — Tue, 21 May 2013 09:06:46 GMT

[quote user="Gillian Mostyn"]

[quote user="Thomas Johnson"]Also a lot of new graduates get accomodation as a non-taxable benefit, so this would also push the figure down.[/quote]

I don't know what decade you're in, but these days it is nigh on impossible to get exempt from any accommodation-related tax unless it is imperative you live permanently at the practice.

[/quote]

Re: Veterinary surgeons average salary falls 9.9%

Noweia — Mon, 20 May 2013 22:20:58 GMT

I work full time and under 30K. 5 years out.

Re: Veterinary surgeons average salary falls 9.9%

Sarah Wheeler — Mon, 20 May 2013 21:18:38 GMT

I work part time (30 hours a week) and earn nowhere near 30k. Qualified 12 years.

Re: Veterinary surgeons average salary falls 9.9%

Michael Woodhouse — Mon, 20 May 2013 20:43:33 GMT

[quote user="Gillian Mostyn"]

You're not telling me that any practice principals are only taking 10K for personal use..... !!

[/quote]

I take that as a salary so entitled to full pension payout etc. The rest of my income is derived from dividend payments that are taxed. As far as HMRC are concerned my taxable salary is 10K.

I trade al limited because more tax efficient, but it also separates my personal liability from that of the business. If the practice folded tomorrow all I can be chased for is the business loan that I signed a personal guarantee for.

I can only take a dividend out if there is money in the business. Was the worst to happen I can make myself redundant and be eligible for benefits etc.

I'm amazed anyone is not trading as ltd co.

Re: Veterinary surgeons average salary falls 9.9%

tess — Mon, 20 May 2013 20:42:50 GMT

I think it may be the increasing number of part-timers which are affecting the results.

Having said that, I locum on an hourly rate which I haven't increased in 4 years. I'm lucky to have work locally where the hours fit in around children - I don't feel able to ask for a rise in the current climate

Re: Veterinary surgeons average salary falls 9.9%

Gillian Mostyn — Mon, 20 May 2013 20:38:53 GMT

[quote user="Thomas Johnson"]Also a lot of new graduates get accomodation as a non-taxable benefit, so this would also push the figure down.[/quote]

I don't know what decade you're in, but these days it is nigh on impossible to get exempt from any accommodation-related tax unless it is imperative you live permanently at the practice.

Re: Veterinary surgeons average salary falls 9.9%

Gillian Mostyn — Mon, 20 May 2013 20:36:09 GMT

You're not telling me that any practice principals are only taking 10K for personal use..... !!

Re: Veterinary surgeons average salary falls 9.9%

Hanna Bennett — Mon, 20 May 2013 20:19:21 GMT

[quote user="Clive Ansell"]

As Michael says many higher earners may be using Ltd co's to reduce taxation and have salaries on paper of 10K (maybe there should be a separate debate on the professionalism and ethics of tax avoidance/evasion?). Maybe only younger and/or employed vets were included in the survey?

[/quote]

from experience of a partnership, that tax is based on what accounts show as profit, so you pay tax on this whether you actually get paid this or not (in my case, not) whereas as a limited company i find i pay tax on what i actually take home. More cost effective and certainly stops the business being drained of money it has not earned (trust me, P&L sheets bear no resemblance to cashflow!). Not tax avoidance, merely survival of a business.

Re: Veterinary surgeons average salary falls 9.9%

Thomas Johnson — Mon, 20 May 2013 17:16:03 GMT

[quote user="Clive Ansell"]

The average quoted of £33,709 seems very low, I was earning more than that when I was 2 years qualified in 1998. how many employed vets are on <33k?

[/quote]

Does the figue take into account whether vets are working full or part time? If not an increasing number of people working part time would push the figure down.

Also a lot of new graduates get accomodation as a non-taxable benefit, so this would also push the figure down.

Re: Veterinary surgeons average salary falls 9.9%

Clive Ansell — Mon, 20 May 2013 16:53:17 GMT

presumably, those working as nurses, or on work experience, or part time are not included in the survey though?

Are SPVS producing a survey, I know I filled in a questionaire from them recently?

I have recently seen an advert for a new graduate to join a "graduate scheme" at one of the low cost clinics for 22K

Re: Veterinary surgeons average salary falls 9.9%

Bob Russell — Mon, 20 May 2013 16:46:32 GMT

[quote user="Clive Ansell"]

The average quoted of £33,709 seems very low, I was earning more than that when I was 2 years qualified in 1998. how many employed vets are on <33k?

[/quote]

But the world has changed drastically since 1998! There are lots of vets chasing a finite number of jobs. Some are working as nurses, some working for experience and some not working at all!