disposable agreements that should be burnt after reading

Re: disposable agreements that should be burnt after reading

Jon Bray — Fri, 05 Apr 2013 07:14:04 GMT

Liked your strap line. You might like to Google "equacy" :-)

Re: disposable agreements that should be burnt after reading

Martin Atkinson — Wed, 13 Mar 2013 12:52:22 GMT

[quote user="Bob Russell"]Cheap vets are fine as long as it is not at the cost of the staff working in these practices.[/quote] Or they cut corners in their standard of care either because they are so busy they cant do the job properly or just to reduce their overheads but the unsuspecting punters who go there based solely on a cost basis assume that all vets do the same job to the same standard.Sadly we are aware that is not the case but the clients may not be.

Re: disposable agreements that should be burnt after reading

Bob Russell — Wed, 13 Mar 2013 12:26:58 GMT

I was the one making the 'plenty of fish in the sea' comment and it is a sad reflection on the profession. There is no place for unethical behaviour in any profession, especially one dealing with such emotional situations as small animal practice.

The big business models that are appearing throughout the UK are not good for the profession IMO. Wages and conditions will continue to be eroded if the management of these businesses chose to take aggressive marketing further and further into the Spec-Savers model.

Cheap vets are fine as long as it is not at the cost of the staff working in these practices.

By the way I am still waiting for a pet food company to come to me with a wad of cash so they can write 'Veterinarian Approved' on the bag and put a Photo-shopped image of me in a prominent place!!

Re: disposable agreements that should be burnt after reading

Thomas Johnson — Wed, 13 Mar 2013 11:08:06 GMT

[quote user="Martin Atkinson"]

That's unless they make me offer I can't refuse.

[/quote]

I suppose the question will be when you decide to retire whether you take the money offered by a property developer or a corporate group, both of which are likely to put an offer on the table and produce the money quickly, or if you sell the practice on as a going concern to another vet looking to own their own practice, who may not be able to offer you as much money and may take longer to arrange the finance.

Re: disposable agreements that should be burnt after reading

Martin Atkinson — Wed, 13 Mar 2013 10:31:55 GMT

[quote user="Arlo Guthrie"]

[quote user="Martin Atkinson"]Blimey that was a result for the OP, contrite replies from the offending party are as rare as hen's teeth.[/quote]

Just what I was thinking. And I must say, hats off to Heather for such a candid post. In this litigious age we live in, it seems most companies' response to a complaint is either to ignore it, or deny it, or to offer some bland template apology. Heather's post makes a refreshing change.

[/quote] Another brownie point for the forum Arlo it shows two things: that a forum such as this is able to resolve matters which may not otherwise have been aired and the global reach of this particular forum. Long may it continue (just so long as you can get rid of the blasted Drontal pop-up)!

Re: disposable agreements that should be burnt after reading

Mark Hedberg — Wed, 13 Mar 2013 08:44:36 GMT

[quote user="Martin Atkinson"]

That's unless they make me offer I can't refuse.

[/quote]

Exactly. This is unfortunately the key sentence here...money talks, dogs don't.

Re: disposable agreements that should be burnt after reading

An On MRCVS — Wed, 13 Mar 2013 03:16:12 GMT

Thank you for you reply Heather. I will certainly be taking this up with you further, via your email. Not surprised to learn of his track record, it is very common in corporate business managers - the last nasty piece of work I had to deal with a few years ago in North Canterbury has also resulted in most of the staff leaving, and despite 'working' (read as delgating all his jobs to the lower paid minions and getting paid for it and driving around in a company subaru that is apparently necessary to drive 5km to and from work) he now thinks that the vets should work 7am to 7pm, AND do on call, AND do weekend clinics both saturdy and sunday, for NO extra pay, as apparently ' this is the way forward' - interestingly this process has been taken up by one of his other buddies in Christchurch who, not surprisingly, is constantly advertising for a 'new' vet. Unfortunately Christchurch seems to have an excessively high number of these kind of undesirables; meanwhile the Vet Council seems to sit around and does nothing despite evidence of contrary behaviour.

There is a very interesting book called Psycopaths in Suits that everyone should read if they are considering employing a business manager, regarding the damage that they can wreak while damaging many other people.

Previously the clinic under discussion was run by 3 vets, who were extremely good managers, and the working environment there was exceptionally good.

Regarding other peoples comments about plenty of fish in the sea, not sure if people remember basic etqiuette of treat people how you would like to be treated. It seems that globalisation has destroyed any essence of humanity in a lot of businesses.

Re: disposable agreements that should be burnt after reading

Arlo Guthrie — Tue, 12 Mar 2013 19:24:55 GMT

[quote user="Martin Atkinson"]Blimey that was a result for the OP, contrite replies from the offending party are as rare as hen's teeth.[/quote]

Re: disposable agreements that should be burnt after reading

Martin Atkinson — Tue, 12 Mar 2013 19:18:02 GMT

Blimey that was a result for the OP, contrite replies from the offending party are as rare as hen's teeth. I offer no other opinion other than to say this is why I am sole-charge, self -employed and will probably remain so to the day they carry me out in a box and my practice property is only of value to a property developer because although I had toyed with the idea of retiring gently by selling my soul practice to a corporate and winding down as an employee the thought of towing the line to some corporate dogma fills me with dread. That's unless they make me offer I can't refuse.

Re: disposable agreements that should be burnt after reading

Anonymous — Tue, 12 Mar 2013 18:48:09 GMT

Hi there, As a shareholder of the Christchurch After Hours clinic, I have to say I am so sorry you have been treated so badly by the HR Manager there. If you want to lodge a formal complaint with me I will pass it on to all of the shareholders and call a special meeting to discuss this with them. (Edited for obvious reasons)

Re: disposable agreements that should be burnt after reading

Sylvia Wilson — Wed, 06 Mar 2013 18:05:51 GMT

Got to be a bit careful, because I don't know much about how NZ employment law differs from British law, but if you were in the UK, I would definitely be advising you to either sue them (if you were going to stay self employed) or take them to Employment Tribunal (if you were expecting to become an employee). Unfortunately, the more people rant but do nothing, the more they will believe they can get away with it.

Re: disposable agreements that should be burnt after reading

Gerry Henry — Tue, 05 Mar 2013 19:50:28 GMT

why is it then that employers always ignore contracts and frequently blatantly defy them, and we must bear the consequences or leave, as nothing gets done about their behaviour

Because people like you put up with it. Sue them, bet they settle before court.

Re: disposable agreements that should be burnt after reading

Bob Russell — Tue, 05 Mar 2013 17:27:27 GMT

I entered a profession where ethics and good manners were considered the norm. The rogue practices quickly became well known and vets could avoid them.

Nowadays a job is a job and businesses know this. In reality do these companies (big and small) need to care? If there are plenty more fish in the sea they will just go and fish again!

Is it right? No! Is it acceptable? No! Will they keep doing it, more and more? I bet they will. Very sad.

Re: disposable agreements that should be burnt after reading

Clive Ansell — Tue, 05 Mar 2013 11:53:04 GMT

[quote user="Michael Woodhouse"]

Whilst I am fully sympathetic with your situation you have chosen to work as a locum and by its very nature that means an unstable income, especially in difficult financial times (recession, earthquake etc). If you need a regular wage maybe get a regular job for a couple of years and get some money behind you for these situations.

[/quote]

[quote user="Bob Russell"]

The profession might as well get used to it!

Market forces apply. Lots of available vets, no need to pay properly!

[/quote]

Both very valid points but they do not, or at least should not, give the green light for companies or employers to behave badly, unprofessional, unethically or illegally. This is supposed to be a profession, we should treat each other with respect regardless of the economic and employment situation.

I too have been on the receiving end of bad behaviour from corporates three times now. On the last occasion in 2010 a 3 week, 21 day, locum was agreed and I even signed their own contract. 2 days before I was due to start I had an answer phone message telling me it was cancelled. No reason was given, and do this day I still don't know why. Despite various teams of managers and a massive HR department, they even breached their own contract. I was told by a lawyer it was clear breach and I should be paid for the full locum term. Initially, emails were ignored they didn't even possess the common courtesy to reply. The threat of an action in the county court seemed to summon them in to life and an amicable settlement was reached.

Re: disposable agreements that should be burnt after reading

Bob Russell — Tue, 05 Mar 2013 10:32:04 GMT

The profession might as well get used to it!

Market forces apply. Lots of available vets, no need to pay properly!

I wish I could find a local part-timer though!!!

Re: disposable agreements that should be burnt after reading

Michael Woodhouse — Tue, 05 Mar 2013 10:01:51 GMT

If you were employed it is very easy in the first year to get rid of an employee, it is after a year things get tricky.

With all the hassle I imagine you are not actually wanting to work for them. Maybe better to 'name and shame' so others can heed the warning.