Alternatives to Practice Standards Scheme

Re: Alternatives to Practice Standards Scheme

Evelyn Barbour-Hill — Wed, 03 Oct 2012 18:45:17 GMT

[quote user="Bob Russell"]

[quote user="Evelyn Barbour-Hill"]

By the way, tax inspectors doing "enquiries" get a bonus proportionate to the amount of extra tax they can claw in.

[/quote]

I suspect this may be the reason why our last VAT inspection lasted less than an hour (and seemed to be stretching the work to last an hour!) and disappeared without a thank you or good-bye.

Every bit of paperwork he wanted was presented within seconds. Our accountant was present and had booked the full day (and provisionally the next day) was speechless and took the day off!

Clearly he did not see much chance of making money from us.

If they had visited when we were living under the shadow of our terrible 'practice manager' I suspect things would not have been so smooth! Now all long-since sorted and they are welcome whenever they wish.

[/quote]

Oh, VAT inspections should hold no terrors as long as you have kept everything in order and you aren't working any fiddles. I was referring to self-assessment income tax inspectors doing in-depth investigations. One tactic they use is to spin out the distress and hassle for as long as possible, demanding ever more obscure bits of paper from five years ago. Their hope is that you will give up and let them demand extra tax at random and settle for that. You can't claim your accountant's fees, for dealing with this, as a business expense (unless there is no extra tax whatever to pay). That Tax investigation Insurance is worth every penny.

Re: Alternatives to Practice Standards Scheme

Bob Russell — Wed, 03 Oct 2012 14:26:44 GMT

[quote user="Evelyn Barbour-Hill"]

By the way, tax inspectors doing "enquiries" get a bonus proportionate to the amount of extra tax they can claw in.

[/quote]

I suspect this may be the reason why our last VAT inspection lasted less than an hour (and seemed to be stretching the work to last an hour!) and disappeared without a thank you or good-bye.

Every bit of paperwork he wanted was presented within seconds. Our accountant was present and had booked the full day (and provisionally the next day) was speechless and took the day off!

Clearly he did not see much chance of making money from us.

Re: Alternatives to Practice Standards Scheme

Evelyn Barbour-Hill — Tue, 02 Oct 2012 19:23:23 GMT

By the way, tax inspectors doing "enquiries" get a bonus proportionate to the amount of extra tax they can claw in.

Re: Alternatives to Practice Standards Scheme

Evelyn Barbour-Hill — Tue, 02 Oct 2012 19:18:54 GMT

I'd like to have lots of traffic wardens in Bangor.

High on the list of things that drive me to insane fury are a) people who park on the pavement and b) delivery drivers who drive and stop in the pedestrian area.

Re: Alternatives to Practice Standards Scheme

Thomas Johnson — Tue, 02 Oct 2012 18:04:59 GMT

[quote user="Martin Atkinson"]

[quote user="james herriot lied"]PSS. Ofsted. Separated at birth.[/quote] Add VMD, tax inspectors, local politicians, traffic wardens, motorway wombles, church leaders, in short anyone who is in a position of a little power - they have to justify their existence.

[/quote]

I have red starred this post, though I have only just done it, and no, I am not 'red star man'. I feel the post is a gross over-generalisation. As a regular church attender, my experience of church leaders has generally been very good. Also whatever you may think of traffic wardens, you wouldn't want to be without them, as they found out in Aberystwyth:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/motoring/news/9302318/Town-that-scrapped-traffic-wardens-welcomes-them-back-after-enduring-car-chaos.html

I don't have any experience of VMD or tax inspectors. My only experience of local politicians is a friend who is a local councillor, she has a very sensible and professional approach, but I can't comment on them generally!

Re: Alternatives to Practice Standards Scheme

Evelyn Barbour-Hill — Sun, 30 Sep 2012 21:06:23 GMT

[quote user="J G Wray"]

Improved management procedures in general.

Nowhere does RCVS explain to the public that PSS delivers the fourth point only

[/quote]

Even that would depend upon your definition of "improved"

Re: Alternatives to Practice Standards Scheme

Anthony Todd — Sun, 30 Sep 2012 18:51:36 GMT

[quote user="Anthony Todd"]Bit worried about their vague monitoring of anaesthetic gases though.[/quote]

None of the protagonists have defended anaesthetic gas monitoring which, incidentally, although stupid, has become essential for VN training.

It's so simple to get right too.

Re: Alternatives to Practice Standards Scheme

J G Wray — Sun, 30 Sep 2012 16:00:09 GMT

[quote user="bob lehner"]Absolutely not true ! [/quote]

Got to disagree here.

[quote user="bob lehner"]As a PSS inspector I frequently ask practice principals why they have chosen, on a voluntary basis, to put themselves through what is a pretty time-consuming and arduous process. [/quote]

Yup.

[quote user="bob lehner"]Almost without exception the reply is that they want to know that they are complying with the host of legislation and regulation laid down by all manner of Government agencies and others, which regulate the running of all businesses in this country , let alone specifically veterinary businesses.[/quote]

Does the PSS offer any indeminification or guarantee that practices are compliant in these respects? I believe inspection is not annual by the way.

Is there anything to prevent a business being compliant and not be in PSS?

[quote user="bob lehner"]In addition they like to know that their facilities and level of equipment are recognised as being of an acceptable standard.[/quote]

Hmmm. Acceptable is an interesting word to use for this.

[quote user="bob lehner"]The PSS is extremely wide-ranging and provides a very useful (indeed within our profession unique) method of covering virtually all bases. [/quote]

It is wide-ranging. It is not unique. Any practice can do what is in the PSS for themselves. It does not cover "virtually all bases". There are holes. The client contract is one. Standards of behaviour is another - you simply can't escape the image of a PSS plaque oin the wall of a practice on a Panorama program.

Anecdote One of my nursing staff left a locum position at a Panorama'd practice having witnessed a nurse kick a dog. This is alleged and unprovable. She is a trusted and now established member of our staff in a permanent position. She has no time for PSS, thinking naively that it afforded the owners and patients a standard of care.

[quote user="bob lehner"]Don't forget that the PSS is not just a set of rules laid down by the RCVS - input has come from all manner of other veterinary bodies including the British Small Animal Veterinary Association ; the British Veterinary Hospital Association ; the British Equine Veterinary Association ; the British Cattle Veterinary Association; RCVS Council; the Society of Practising Veterinary Surgeons; the Veterinary Practice Management Association ; the British Association of Veterinary Emergency Clinics Veterinary Nurses Council and the British Veterinary Nursing Association.[/quote]

And, all it achieves is compliance with law, which is achievable without PSS.

Other professions have standards schemes. The solicitors have Lexcel for instance. There are, for solicitiors four areas which Lexcel accreditation can enhance

Sales consequent upon Scheme participation, particularly in commercial work
Reduced indemnity insurance premiums, consequent upon improved management procedures and improved complaints handling;
Improved recruitment of staff,
Improved management procedures in general.

Nowhere does RCVS explain to the public that PSS delivers the fourth point only and in no sense does PSS deliver an equivalent of the other points made here. Dr Lehner only articulates the value of PSS to practitioners and I choose to disagree with his absolutism as , well, universal.

PSS doesn't help practices enough, but where, how does PSS help the public and patients?

JGW

Re: Alternatives to Practice Standards Scheme

Mark Hedberg — Sat, 29 Sep 2012 17:52:03 GMT

[quote user="james herriot lied"]

[quote user="Mark Hedberg"]

Yes, but to be fair, OFSTED make no secret of the fact that they can ask for ANYTHING paperwork wise. What was the point of refusing?

[/quote]

Sorry, have we not met?

Fight the Power, Comrades: there is no other point to be made

[/quote]Hehe - should have remembered. Viva La Resistance! ;)

Re: Alternatives to Practice Standards Scheme

patrick murphy — Sat, 29 Sep 2012 15:48:27 GMT

my thermometers to keep check on my drug storeage failed as they did not give decimal point! then I moaned at pharmacist and his have to go to 2 decimal places.

Re: Alternatives to Practice Standards Scheme

Anthony Todd — Sat, 29 Sep 2012 14:20:43 GMT

[quote user="robloxley"]Nothing that's come up in our re-approvals for PSS have been anything but sensible suggestions[/quote]

Care to comment on anaesthetic gas monitoring?

Re: Alternatives to Practice Standards Scheme

james herriot lied — Sat, 29 Sep 2012 14:11:01 GMT

[quote user="Mark Hedberg"]

Yes, but to be fair, OFSTED make no secret of the fact that they can ask for ANYTHING paperwork wise. What was the point of refusing?

[/quote]

Sorry, have we not met?

Fight the Power, Comrades: there is no other point to be made

Re: Alternatives to Practice Standards Scheme

Rob Loxley — Sat, 29 Sep 2012 14:01:49 GMT

[quote user="Anthony Todd"]which most of us follow anyway[/quote]

Then getting PSS approval shouldn't be arduous? My guess is that it is arduous because we're good vets and while we may have best intentions at complying with applicable legislation and regulations, bits always fall by the wayside?

Nothing that's come up in our re-approvals for PSS have been anything but sensible suggestions, and our inspectors have been sensible, pragmatic, experienced and useful (not to contrast them with the VN 'inspections' which throw up spurious comments that they are completely unable to justify in law or even common sense...)

Re: Alternatives to Practice Standards Scheme

Anthony Todd — Sat, 29 Sep 2012 13:38:46 GMT

[quote user="bob lehner"]The PSS is extremely wide-ranging and provides a very useful (indeed within our profession unique) method of covering virtually all bases.[/quote]

Well having read it [first time...] it's a useful check list for sure, which most of us follow anyway.

Bit worried about their vague monitoring of anaesthetic gases though.

Hope this counts as a credit against future red stars.

Mind you, a red star on the bottom of the logo on the list of threads means it's popular; go figure that? Shouldn't it be gold Arlo?

Re: Alternatives to Practice Standards Scheme

jamie winstone — Sat, 29 Sep 2012 13:08:37 GMT

If a tax inspector asked me why i was paying this much tax. I guess i would say everyone should pay their fair share!

Re: Alternatives to Practice Standards Scheme

bob lehner — Sat, 29 Sep 2012 12:39:57 GMT

[quote user="J G Wray"]The PSS is a curio. Few admit to knowing why they are in.[/quote]

Absolutely not true ! As a PSS inspector I frequently ask practice principals why they have chosen, on a voluntary basis, to put themselves through what is a pretty time-consuming and arduous process. Almost without exception the reply is that they want to know that they are complying with the host of legislation and regulation laid down by all manner of Government agencies and others, which regulate the running of all businesses in this country , let alone specifically veterinary businesses. In addition they like to know that their facilities and level of equipment are recognised as being of an acceptable standard.

The PSS is extremely wide-ranging and provides a very useful (indeed within our profession unique) method of covering virtually all bases. Don't forget that the PSS is not just a set of rules laid down by the RCVS - input has come from all manner of other veterinary bodies including the British Small Animal Veterinary Association ; the British Veterinary Hospital Association ; the British Equine Veterinary Association ; the British Cattle Veterinary Association; RCVS Council; the Society of Practising Veterinary Surgeons; the Veterinary Practice Management Association ; the British Association of Veterinary Emergency Clinics Veterinary Nurses Council and the British Veterinary Nursing Association.

Re: Alternatives to Practice Standards Scheme

Anthony Todd — Sat, 29 Sep 2012 12:19:38 GMT

[quote user="J G Wray"]If you had never dished them out yourselves, or used icon/smiley things then this probably wouldn't bother you. Just a thought.[/quote]

Never done neither! [sorry about the grammar but it makes the point] I either argue, huff and puff, give up in sulky silence or retire red-faced full of chargrin.

No, tell a lie, I use the analogue equivalent of a [nauseating] smiley if I don't want to be misinterpreted.

My motives are to learn, [possibly] teach receptive minds, and defend things that I found worked or were sensible.

Re: Alternatives to Practice Standards Scheme

Evelyn Barbour-Hill — Sat, 29 Sep 2012 12:19:04 GMT

P'raps he's a socialist and the red star is a mark of approval?

Re: Alternatives to Practice Standards Scheme

J G Wray — Sat, 29 Sep 2012 12:03:51 GMT

[quote user="Anthony Todd"]

[quote user="Martin Atkinson"]

I see red star man is active this morning Anthony! Perhaps he/she would like to tell me the inclusion of which group I alluded to in my post he/she objected to - or is it just me. Sad really. Criticise me as much as you want but own up you coward.

[/quote]

Yeah, roger that and more, if I was rude. What's the point of a red star if it's unqualified?

Arnie, red stars should only be given by yourself for inappropriate remarks; red star or straight deletion.

Red-starrers, have the courage of your opposing arguments and respond!

Play the ball and not the man, John should have taken that advice....

[/quote]

If you had never dished them out yourselves, or used icon/smiley things then this probably wouldn't bother you. Just a thought.

JGW

Re: Alternatives to Practice Standards Scheme

Anthony Todd — Sat, 29 Sep 2012 10:49:44 GMT

[quote user="Martin Atkinson"]

[/quote]

Yeah, roger that and more, if I was rude. What's the point of a red star if it's unqualified?

Arlo, [sh1t, sorry for the "Arrnie"] red stars should only be given by yourself for inappropriate remarks; red star or straight deletion.

Red-starrers, have the courage of your opposing arguments and respond!

Play the ball and not the man, John should have taken that advice....

Re: Alternatives to Practice Standards Scheme

Martin Atkinson — Sat, 29 Sep 2012 10:23:38 GMT

Re: Alternatives to Practice Standards Scheme

Anthony Todd — Sat, 29 Sep 2012 10:11:35 GMT

[quote user="robloxley"]Hmmm, we've seen a lot more sense[/quote]

Well we would if all the vet stuff ie that relating to animal care, which is pretty wide, but not wide enough for most H & S for instance, was based on clinical and not bureaucratic grounds, which a lot of it is.

I feel that a lot of it has been invented so that there will be a box that must be ticked.

Developed to the ultimate in the NHS which now appears to be totally based on boxes and budgets, I mean if someone needs an operation soonest why delay it until the next financial year?

And the fracture clinic that had no paper for the surgeons to write hard copies [get a laptop FFS] until the next financial year and the paper needed the department printed on the top of each sheet but the photocopier had broken and no other department would let my wife use their's!!!

Re: Alternatives to Practice Standards Scheme

Martin Atkinson — Sat, 29 Sep 2012 09:43:02 GMT

Re: Alternatives to Practice Standards Scheme

Rob Loxley — Fri, 28 Sep 2012 23:52:25 GMT

[quote user="Ian Mostyn"]We get inspected regularly as both surgeries are nurse training practices but I have no intention of joining the PSS[/quote]

Hmmm, we've seen a lot more sense from our PSS inspectors than from the VN training numpties...

Re: Alternatives to Practice Standards Scheme

Mark Hedberg — Fri, 28 Sep 2012 22:54:20 GMT

Yes, but to be fair, OFSTED make no secret of the fact that they can ask for ANYTHING paperwork wise. What was the point of refusing?