Identifying a pit bull

Re: Identifying a pit bull

Rajat — Fri, 07 Sep 2012 18:27:58 GMT

[quote user="David Mills"]

Photo doesn't do him justice - he's 33kg. More a staffie x choc lab than anyting else. Massive head.

[/quote]

What a shame. I know how you feel. I had to put down a 6 month old pitbull type dog once. She had been identified and ordered to be destroyed. It broke my heart - she was the most gorgeous dog. I don't think I could do it again and I still question why I actually went ahead and did it, law or no law. She did look like that breed but could easily pass for a staffie - hell I see much bigger proper pitbulls walking the streets of London EVERY day. I am much more apprehensive of chihuahuas and Great Danes( got bit badly by one once...GD not the former!) Enclosing a picture of her, the beautiful Annie..

Re: Identifying a pit bull

Bob Russell — Fri, 07 Sep 2012 15:54:30 GMT

[quote user="David Mills"]

Photo doesn't do him justice - he's 33kg. More a staffie x choc lab than anyting else. Massive head.

[/quote]

That makes it difficult!

Slight saving grace is these bigger dogs can be difficult to rehome so the only positive spin I can think of is that it will save him months waiting around for a new home (assuming he does not have one already).

'Deed not breed!'

Re: Identifying a pit bull

Hannah Wynne Richards — Fri, 07 Sep 2012 15:33:05 GMT

If he's 1/2 lab then the only danger he's likely to pose is licking someone to death Really really tragic

Wynne

Re: Identifying a pit bull

David Mills — Fri, 07 Sep 2012 15:02:51 GMT

Photo doesn't do him justice - he's 33kg. More a staffie x choc lab than anyting else. Massive head.

Re: Identifying a pit bull

Bob Russell — Fri, 07 Sep 2012 14:52:51 GMT

That is not a Pit Bull type any more than my Staffie is. How heavy is he? identifying a pit Bull type seems to be as random as that. If he is under 18Kg I would say he cannot be a Pit Bull type.

Re: Identifying a pit bull

Sylvia Wilson — Fri, 07 Sep 2012 14:19:51 GMT

A while ago, I went to a presentation by Trevor Cooper (solicitor specialising in dog law) who demonstrated that using the legislation he could identify ANY dog as a pit bull!

Re: Identifying a pit bull

Alex Gough — Fri, 07 Sep 2012 14:02:04 GMT

That's really sad. Looks like a Staffie to me anyway! It was always bad legislation.

Re: Identifying a pit bull

Hannah Wynne Richards — Fri, 07 Sep 2012 13:50:11 GMT

David That's awful-as you say really heartbreaking

Wynne

Re: Identifying a pit bull

David Mills — Fri, 07 Sep 2012 13:46:18 GMT

Here's our latest victim just been determined as a 'pit bull type' by our local Status Dog Unit. Loveliest dog you're ever likely to meet - due to be destroyed in 5 days (stray). Heartbreaking.

Re: Identifying a pit bull

Simon Neuhoff — Thu, 06 Sep 2012 09:45:11 GMT

Like all of us I see a huge number of the "Staffie type" dogs that David describes - varying in size and shape and also temperament but the majority are nice dogs. Some of these may well be pitbulls but I for one would not be confident of identifying them even though I have seen proper pitbulls in the flesh in South Africa.

I think pibulls ARE likely to be a problem but primarily due to the fact that the people who seek out an illegal dog breed on status grounds are not likely to be responsible owners!

Re: Identifying a pit bull

Mark Holmes — Wed, 05 Sep 2012 23:39:01 GMT

Red star man at it again. If you red star somebody have the courtesy to comment

Re: Identifying a pit bull

Evelyn Barbour-Hill — Wed, 05 Sep 2012 22:55:09 GMT

[quote user="Virginia Campbell"] How can we confidently identify pit bulls (let alone pit bull types/crosses or whatever the legislation says)[/quote]

It says "the type known as the Pit Bull". Not "pit bull type".

[quote user="Virginia Campbell"] unless you count watching Bombon El Perro a couple of times.[/quote]

I do. A great film.

Re: Identifying a pit bull

Virginia Campbell — Wed, 05 Sep 2012 18:17:41 GMT

[quote user="alex gough"]I don't feel qualified to differentiate a pit bull from a Staffy! [/quote]

I wouldn't be qualified to do this either. I qualified as a vet in 2003 and have never seen in the flesh any dog described as a pit bull. By now any remaining UK pit bulls officially ought to be breaking breed longevity records. How can we confidently identify pit bulls (let alone pit bull types/crosses or whatever the legislation says) if we've only ever seen a few pictures on t'internet? I've never seen a Fila Brasileiro, Cane Corso, or Dogo Argentino either, unless you count watching Bombon El Perro a couple of times.

Re: Identifying a pit bull

James Laidlaw — Wed, 05 Sep 2012 11:14:43 GMT

I should say I agree with David in that I don't blame bad dogs, but bad owners. None the less it's good to have the DEFRA advice for informing people of their responsibilities and possible problems they may face if they decide to own a dog of this type.

Re: Identifying a pit bull

Alex Gough — Wed, 05 Sep 2012 11:00:06 GMT

Thanks David. Would be nice to have a genetic test. Of course the breed legislation is probably fundamentally flawed anyway! In this case, although I dont have details, i think the dog has been seized because of aggression.

Alex

Re: Identifying a pit bull

David Mills — Wed, 05 Sep 2012 10:41:43 GMT

We see a number of pitbulls in our line of work, and even more 'Blue Staffies', 'King Staffies', 'American Staffies', 'Mastiff Staffies' and any other flavour you care to mention. Vast, vast majority are lovely, but there's no doubt that these dogs are mainly pit bull or pit bull/staff crosses. Traditional Staffies, in the 10-15kg category, are now the exception rather than the rule with our clients. An analysis of our incident records show most bites to staff come from cats, Rotties and Westies - considering around 80% of our clients are 'Staffie' owners I think it's telling.

Any suspect dog is identified, as set out above, by a member of the police, suitably qualified; they generally go on appearance alone; if your local force does not have a suitable person there are plenty in London and other forces with large cities. There are obviously drawbacks to this appearance based system - mainly it's unvalidated, and, we think, leads to many lovely dogs being destroyed every year.

Re: Identifying a pit bull

Alex Gough — Wed, 05 Sep 2012 10:31:56 GMT

Thanks, that's really helpful. VDS have told us to steer well clear - sound advice I think!

Alex

Re: Identifying a pit bull

James Laidlaw — Tue, 04 Sep 2012 18:30:55 GMT

From the defra stuff on dogs (I've looked into this before) - http://www.defra.gov.uk/publications/files/dogs-guide-enforcers.pdf

DLO: (Dog Legislation Officers) I think are meant to do the identifying

The DLO’s main responsibilities

• To be able to identify dogs that are alleged to be of a prohibited breed/type.

Identification of prohibited types has always been a difficult area under the 1991 Act. This legislation gives power to any constable or authorised local authority officer to seize any dog they believe to be prohibited. DLOs need to have expertise to make judgements as to whether or not a dog that is considered to be a banned type should be retained by its owner until court proceedings, therefore saving police costs and concerns over the dog’s welfare whilst in custody. This should be done via a risk assessment of all the relevant factors.

Many DLOs have become expert witnesses recognised by the Courts. Nevertheless, where a prosecution is instigated and an expert witness is required, the DLO may find it necessary to contact an experienced expert from within another force or from outside the police service.

Also annex 2 (Page 14) goes into detail about how to identify too.