Prescriptions

Re: Prescriptions

Sally Everitt — Mon, 18 Jun 2012 15:44:19 GMT

The criteria for the VMD Accredited Internet Retailer Scheme states that

"internet retailers should satisfy themselves that the prescriber and prescription are genuine and legally valid. This is particularly important

where prescriptions are faxed or emailed. Contacting the prescriber by phone and checking the prescriber’s registration with the RCVS is

considered a minimum step. It is also considered good practice for the retailer to request the hard copy of the prescription from the customer

before any medicines are despatched. Controlled Drugs (CDs) may only be supplied against a hard copy written prescription but appropriate

checks on the authenticity of the prescription must still be carried out;".

This would seem to imply that it is good practice rather than a legal requirement except for Controlled Drugs

Sally

Re: Prescriptions

Bob Russell — Mon, 18 Jun 2012 15:28:31 GMT

I have just written my first prescription in ages for 200ml Rheumocam. The owner is convinced he can get it for £20 on-line. I have done a search and at best he is going to save a fiver but pay P&P unless his order goes over £65!

My suspicion is that he will try to send the same prescription by fax to several drug 'shops'. We use security paper (see previous posts) but on a legitimate human registered pharmacy website I found:

Can I send a faxed prescription or a photocopy?
No a prescription is a legal document which must be written according to UK regulations and signed and dated by a vet with UK registration. Photocopies or electronic copies are not valid.

Why does a proper pharmacy require a hard copy but a veterinary internet supplier considers a fax sufficient? I think it is crazy and open to abuse for any electronic/faxed prescription to be allowed but does anyone know if it is actually legal for a POM-V to be dispensed with only a copy prescription rather than the original?

Re: Prescriptions

Clive Ansell — Fri, 15 Jun 2012 18:18:11 GMT

[quote user="Bob Russell"]

Or bu**ering off elsewhere!!

[/quote]

That would be my approach too, but sadly I'm just the locum and boss man may not approve if I dismiss her!

She is a grade 5/5 uncomfortable sensation in the anus region; always moans about costs, about 6 monthly checks and refuses any monitoring blood tests or basic biochem.

Re: Prescriptions

Bob Russell — Fri, 15 Jun 2012 18:08:17 GMT

[quote user="Clive Ansell"]

[quote user="Michael Woodhouse"]

[quote user="Clive Ansell"]I have a client that wants a single written prescription for 6 months worth of Epiphen, as an internet pharmacy will not allow one with repeats for schedule 3 controlled drug. I remember reading somewhere that it was good practice with controlled drugs to only supply, or provide a script for, a months worth at a time, but cannot remember where? what do others do? [/quote]

All here

A prescription only valid for 28 days for Sch III. It is 'good practice' to only give 28 days worth but it does say that dogs on ongoing treatment may be given more depending on the owner. Usually we give a months, but odd people who live far away might get up to 2 months worth. Our official line is only 1 month supply.

[/quote]

Michael - many thanks indeed, just what I need. Stroppy client who wants a 6 month written script and who objects to paying prescription charges too. She now has the choice of buying from the practice or buying a script monthly - cheers, job done.

[/quote]

Or bu**ering off elsewhere!!

Re: Prescriptions

Martin Atkinson — Fri, 15 Jun 2012 17:29:52 GMT

[quote user="patrick murphy"]

am I the only one (probably not) to see the irony in his name? Owing Money!

[/quote] No Patrick you're not and its already been said - somewhere at the beginning of the original thread on the subject by Gilian. Keep your eyes peeled lad.

Re: Prescriptions

Clive Ansell — Fri, 15 Jun 2012 17:17:32 GMT

[quote user="Michael Woodhouse"]

All here

[/quote]

Re: Prescriptions

Gillian Mostyn — Fri, 15 Jun 2012 16:44:36 GMT

You can do a consultation in a room, over the telephone or shouting from the rooftops if you want. You simply cannot diagnose anything or prescribe a POM - a fact they are all told before they pay anything at all.

Most of the time it is someone who wants to determine whether their pet is being kept properly. Something I spend probably 75% of my face-to-face consultations discussing too.

As I said, we are always happy to talk to anyone who is already a client.

Re: Prescriptions

Sarah Keir — Fri, 15 Jun 2012 16:28:02 GMT

[quote user="Gillian Mostyn"]

Yes. We get a lot of enquiries from exotics folk who expect us to diagnose their pet's problems over the phone. The receptionist tells them that we can give no more than general advice (usually husbandry related) and that diagnosis and treatment requires a consultation, but they do seem to insist on 'just talking to the vet'. They then get charged a consultation fee and if they pay it we will phone them back for a telephone consultation. Doesn't happen a lot, but it does happen. The telephone consultation is the same price as a normal consultation so it encourages most people to bring their pet in.

[/quote]

Are they 'animals under your care' if you don't see them, for example in a consultation or visit? How can you do a consultation, which implies specific advice relevant to the circumstances, if they are not 'animals under your care'?

Sarah

Re: Prescriptions

Michael Woodhouse — Fri, 15 Jun 2012 16:17:44 GMT

All here

Re: Prescriptions

Clive Ansell — Fri, 15 Jun 2012 15:56:18 GMT

I have a client that wants a single written prescription for 6 months worth of Epiphen, as an internet pharmacy will not allow one with repeats for schedule 3 controlled drug. I remember reading somewhere that it was good practice with controlled drugs to only supply, or provide a script for, a months worth at a time, but cannot remember where? what do others do?

Re: Prescriptions

patrick murphy — Fri, 15 Jun 2012 14:13:07 GMT

am I the only one (probably not) to see the irony in his name? Owing Money!

Re: Prescriptions

Andre Escudeiro-Vieites — Thu, 14 Jun 2012 17:09:47 GMT

I totally agree, Bob.

I cannot get my head around how this has been allowed!!

Re: Prescriptions

Bob Russell — Thu, 14 Jun 2012 17:00:18 GMT

[quote user="Andre Escudeiro-Vieites"]

I write the number of repeats and the expiry date of the prescription. In my case usually 3 months, so after that the prescription shouln'd be accepted by a pharmacy

[/quote]

I would agree that a pharmacy is unlikely to accept a dodgy script but we are talking about internet medicine 'shops' that generally (with exceptions) are willing to take anything they can get away with.

How faxed copies were ever allowed by law I cannot understand. If you want a human private prescription filled on-line (such as malaria drugs) they need the prescription physically in their hands.

Re: Prescriptions

Andre Escudeiro-Vieites — Thu, 14 Jun 2012 16:55:09 GMT

I write the number of repeats and the expiry date of the prescription. In my case usually 3 months, so after that the prescription shouln'd be accepted by a pharmacy

Re: Prescriptions

Bob Russell — Thu, 14 Jun 2012 16:36:40 GMT

Very balanced/restrained article under the circumstances. they must have something right (or very wrong!) as they are advertising for two new vets in Vet Times. They want a senior vet and an assistant so not sure where they are off to next!!

Re: Prescriptions

Martin Atkinson — Thu, 14 Jun 2012 16:30:31 GMT

[quote user="Gillian Mostyn"]Anybody want my autograph, now that I'm famous? (See today's Vet Times!)[/quote] Ah, but you didn't get your photo in did you? Come to think of it I wish they hadn't published mine, looks like I've got no chin and a fat neck..ugh, plus the cat's been dead for 2 years (since the photo, not before obviously)! Seriously I felt you were quite restrained and came across well, all they seemed to do was churn out more corporate prose.

Re: Prescriptions

Gillian Mostyn — Thu, 14 Jun 2012 15:10:54 GMT

[quote user="Niall Taylor"]Hopefully the cheapo "we don't charge any consultation fees" practice down the road [/quote]

Hahaha! Probably. I actually don't completely disagree with Wynne - I do think we should be charging appropriately for our skills and not pandering to difficult clients. However, I think that you can go too far with it, and aim to just skim off the wealthier clients and leave 'normal folk' neglected. It is easy to forget that the £25 consultation fee IS a lot of money for a lot of people. There has to be a balance there somewhere.

Anybody want my autograph, now that I'm famous? (See today's Vet Times!)

Re: Prescriptions

Niall Taylor — Thu, 14 Jun 2012 14:20:06 GMT

[quote user="Bob Russell"]

eBay was the source of ours (Secudoc). It looks slightly grey paper but if you try to copy it or fax it comes out with Copy printed all over. It is not particularly expensive.

By carefully setting a scanner it is possible to 'lose' the copy image but photocopies have it clearly in the background![/quote]

I LIKE this muchly! - http://www.rwpierce.com/anti_copy_paper/stock-paper-1/

Niall

Re: Prescriptions

Niall Taylor — Thu, 14 Jun 2012 14:16:30 GMT

[quote user="Gillian Mostyn"]Who got the bad ones? [/quote]

Hopefully the cheapo "we don't charge any consultation fees" practice down the road

Niall

Re: Prescriptions

Bob Russell — Thu, 14 Jun 2012 13:40:43 GMT

[quote user="Martin Atkinson"]

[quote user="Bob Russell"]We use 'security' paper that when faxed or copied clearly states copy all over it [/quote] I'm sure I asked this question before Bob, my age must be getting to me, I assume you can get 'security' paper from a stationer but how does it work?

[/quote]

eBay was the source of ours (Secudoc). It looks slightly grey paper but if you try to copy it or fax it comes out with Copy printed all over. It is not particularly expensive.

By carefully setting a scanner it is possible to 'lose' the copy image but photocopies have it clearly in the background!

www.vetsurgeon.org/.../7853.img445.pdf

Re: Prescriptions

Gillian Mostyn — Thu, 14 Jun 2012 13:25:25 GMT

[quote user="Hannah Wynne Richards"]Result I selected the good clients[/quote]

Bad clients or poor ones? Who got the bad ones?

Re: Prescriptions

Hannah Wynne Richards — Thu, 14 Jun 2012 13:02:58 GMT

I found that when I tried to be financially competitive I needed the staff to cover the workload-but gross mrgins were slim, as were my profits. I increased fees so gross margins were greater, lost clients as a result-but they were the money concious ones who expected something for nothing and kept grumbling about cost anyway.With less clients I was overstaffed, so was able to make staffing economies as well Result I selected the good clients, and am both better off financially and less stressed as a result

Wynne

Re: Prescriptions

Gillian Mostyn — Thu, 14 Jun 2012 12:18:40 GMT

[quote user="Hannah Wynne Richards"] you were a practice owner you would find that you could reduce staff so reducing overheads and bottom line profits would soar[/quote]

That is assuming you are over-staffed in the first place - no? Otherwise it may be customer service that does the nose dive.

Re: Prescriptions

Hannah Wynne Richards — Thu, 14 Jun 2012 12:02:20 GMT

Rajat If you were a practice owner you would find that you could reduce staff so reducing overheads and bottom line profits would soar whilst stress would nose dive If you are an employee might not be such a good idea-as the staff reduction could be you

Wynne

Re: Prescriptions

Gillian Mostyn — Wed, 13 Jun 2012 21:30:51 GMT

[quote user="Rajat"]PS does anyone charge for telephone consults?[/quote]

We don't charge our clients though. - that is just part of our excellent service!