Pygmy goat with a resp infection

Re: Pygmy goat with a resp infection

Mark Holmes — Sat, 17 Sep 2011 08:28:49 GMT

I think it is thought that ideas of static and cidal antibiotics being non compatible is outdated. It's pretty hard sometimes ignoring what was once considered a faux pas.

Re: Pygmy goat with a resp infection

Mark Hedberg — Sat, 17 Sep 2011 04:16:34 GMT

[quote user="midlandsvet973"]

[quote user="Mark Hedberg"]

Isn't oxytet bacteriostatic, and marbocyl bacteriocidal? Why combine them?

[/quote]

I meant either marbocyl or oxytet with some NSAID not both antibiotics together.

[/quote]

Right, sorry, my bad. :)

Re: Pygmy goat with a resp infection

Mark Rowland — Fri, 16 Sep 2011 23:11:18 GMT

Please read the earlier posts, Micotil is associated with fatalities in goats.

Re: Pygmy goat with a resp infection

mariette asselbergs — Fri, 16 Sep 2011 23:07:19 GMT

I would use micotil (careful, self injection is dangerous and they tend to jump when you inject), I think it stings a bit.

I would also worm her with an ivomec type product which will also treat nose bot. Nose bots are disgusting larvae living in the nose and sinuses and making them very itchy and producing mucopurulent discharge.

Re: Pygmy goat with a resp infection

Kate Richardson — Fri, 16 Sep 2011 22:19:20 GMT

Thanks everyone for your help, much appreciated. Little Tinkerbell has no longer got a snotty nose, but at least I know what to treat her with now! My partner wants to give up his day job (teacher) and be a goat farmer, so I think I had better go on some goat CPD if he is serious!

Re: Pygmy goat with a resp infection

Alan Tevendale — Fri, 16 Sep 2011 07:42:08 GMT

I would definately agree to avoid Micotil at all costs. I find most small ruminants respond well to oxytet and often use this as my first line. If that hasn't worked then I'll move on to using something like Tylan or in severe cases baytril or marbocyl. I'll always use a nsaid in combination although their duration of action in small ruminants is certainly less well understood than it is in cattle - and even then I don't believe it's as well understood as it should be. I usually go for metacam.

Re: Pygmy goat with a resp infection

Rob Loxley — Fri, 16 Sep 2011 00:27:21 GMT

From the Micotil datasheet:

"Do not administer to horses, goats or pigs. Injection of the product in goats and pigs has been fatal."

Re: Pygmy goat with a resp infection

midlandsvet973 — Thu, 15 Sep 2011 23:41:55 GMT

[quote user="Mark Hedberg"]

Isn't oxytet bacteriostatic, and marbocyl bacteriocidal? Why combine them?

[/quote]

I meant either marbocyl or oxytet with some NSAID not both antibiotics together.

Re: Pygmy goat with a resp infection

Mark Hedberg — Thu, 15 Sep 2011 23:39:04 GMT

Isn't oxytet bacteriostatic, and marbocyl bacteriocidal? Why combine them?

Re: Pygmy goat with a resp infection

midlandsvet973 — Thu, 15 Sep 2011 23:35:07 GMT

Agree with Mark, avoid micotil in goats. I've used nuflor before which worked well when given with some metacam. I also almost always give goats injections s/c especially in little pygmies as i/m injections can cause lameness, sometimes permanent (has anyone ever actually had this happen?) When I posted a similar question marbocyl and oxytet were also suggested. Metacam can be given orally if injecting them frequently becomes necessary, can't remember the dose off the top of my head tho but it's a lot higher than the oral dog dose. I would avoid oral antibiotics in a ruminant.

Re: Pygmy goat with a resp infection

Mark Rowland — Thu, 15 Sep 2011 23:34:07 GMT

[quote user="Michael Woodhouse"]

Make sure goat is getting plenty of fluids even if owners need to drench with Lectade few times a day (empty beer bottle good for sheep & goats).

[/quote]

I find to ensure sterility and reduce risk of transmission that a fresh empty beer bottle should be used. Also that it helps to dose several times daily with a fresh empty bottle.

Re: Pygmy goat with a resp infection

Michael Woodhouse — Thu, 15 Sep 2011 23:27:31 GMT

I too would use IV flouroquinolones, goats seem more 'delicate' than sheep and in limited experience of goats mildly sick ones can go down hill fast. Don't use oral antibiotics in ruminants once they have started ruminating.

If the breathing is bad a single shot of dex at a decent dose IV seems to save more than NSAIDS (it's what they use in people, so long as with suitable antibiotic).

Make sure goat is getting plenty of fluids even if owners need to drench with Lectade few times a day (empty beer bottle good for sheep & goats).

Re: Pygmy goat with a resp infection

Mark Rowland — Thu, 15 Sep 2011 22:43:51 GMT

Extra-Label Use Of Tilmicosin in Goats

University of Kentucky
<<Coop Ext Herd Hlth Memo, Apr 1996

- This practitioner examined 10 adult goats following their purchase two days previously from a local stockyard. The animals appeared somewhat unthrifty and had nasal discharges. The animals were treated for parasites with ivermectin and for the apparent upper respiratory infection with tilmicosin. This antibiotic was selected because of its long duration of action following a single dose in cattle. Within 30 minutes of injection, three of the animals died. Practitioners should be cautious about extra-label use of tilmicosin in goats. They might contemplate its use for treatment of Pasteurella haemolytica that had proven nonresponsive to other treatments such as penicillin, oxytetracycline, or ceftiofur, but owners should be warned in advance about the lack of other options and the risks involved. It has been reported that the use of tilmicosin in goats in foreign countries has been associated with a high rate of drug related deaths.

Re: Pygmy goat with a resp infection

Mark Rowland — Thu, 15 Sep 2011 22:42:27 GMT

It has been suggested that off label tilmicosin in goats is contraindicated with high fatality rates.

Re: Pygmy goat with a resp infection

David Mills — Thu, 15 Sep 2011 22:13:02 GMT

I'd have reservations about fluoroquinolones:

1. as first line in any resp infection

2. in growing animals due to their published effects on cartilage.

Not sure myco is that big a problem in small ruminants. I'd go for either a cheap and cheerful oxytet, or tylan 5-day course SID in this case. Plus NSAID. If you want inject-and forget, micotil (beg/steal/borrow/buy from local mixed practice as bottle is v expensive) is great.

Re: Pygmy goat with a resp infection

Mark Rowland — Thu, 15 Sep 2011 19:31:21 GMT

Sorry yep both once daily, I would inject for about 7 days

Re: Pygmy goat with a resp infection

Kate Richardson — Thu, 15 Sep 2011 12:08:14 GMT

Thanks Mark

[quote user="Mark Rowland"] baytril at 5mg/kg and meloxicam 0.5mg/kg daily.[/quote]

Both once daily? Can they be given orally? And for how long?

Re: Pygmy goat with a resp infection

Mark Rowland — Thu, 15 Sep 2011 09:33:28 GMT

Hello

I would go in with baytril at 5mg/kg and meloxicam 0.5mg/kg daily.

Pasteurella/Myco are up there on the dd list and will cause a severe pneumonia if left unchecked.

Obviuosly meat withdrawl periods need to be observed (if that is an issue).

Goodluck