What are these urine crystals?

RE: What are these urine crystals?

Silvia Maldonado — Sun, 04 Nov 2018 22:39:49 GMT

[quote user="Liz Barton"]

This is a great resource for all things cytological - I use it a lot for reference.

http://www.eclinpath.com/urinalysis/crystals/

[/quote]

That's a very good website, also for haematology/biochemistry

RE: What are these urine crystals?

Laurence Webb — Sat, 03 Nov 2018 21:41:28 GMT

Follow up is that TDDS confirmed that the dumbell shaped crystal was Ca Oxalate monohydrate but the stuff in the first photo was starch (presumably contamination from powdered gloves). So everyone was right! Thanks for your input.

The cat came in as inappetent and presumed to be from dental disease but bloods showed a creatinine of about 750 which dropped to the 400s after 24h IV fluids and 250ish after another 24h so presumably had an acute renal insult.

I am still unsure how relevent the crystals were as they were low in number. The cat certainly didn't look like an ethylene glycol case (plus it got better!)

RE: What are these urine crystals?

Liz Barton — Tue, 30 Oct 2018 10:27:17 GMT

This is a great resource for all things cytological - I use it a lot for reference.

http://www.eclinpath.com/urinalysis/crystals/

From this website they look like Ca oxalate monohydrate: "They can also be seen in the urine of animals with hypercalciuria from other causes, e.g. paraneoplastic hypercalcemia with lymphoma. Another rare form of calcium oxalate monohydrate are the “hempseed” variant or “orzo” (as in the pasta shape). The left image above is from the urine of a dog with many of these crystals. The dog did not have ethylene glycol poisoning and the crystals are assumed to be secondary to supersaturation of the urine with calcium and oxalates, which precipitated in the acidic urine."

RE: What are these urine crystals?

Silvia Maldonado — Sun, 28 Oct 2018 15:35:36 GMT

[quote user="Clive Ansell"]

[quote user="Martin Atkinson"]I'd save the vodka for your own use.[/quote]

As long as it was opened within the last 28 days

[/quote]

Would it last that long once open?

RE: What are these urine crystals?

Richard Carter — Thu, 25 Oct 2018 18:33:44 GMT

Vodka lasting more than 28 days??

when we have had EG poisoning, the numbers of crystals, damage etc is through the roof not to mention the serious abdominal pain of the cat. There isn't a 'maybe' feel about it - along with casts, free rbc and other signs of renal damage (protein, renal cells, bladder epithelium) so if the photos are indicative of the level seen, I would class this as incidental finding

one of those cats licking the owner's hand cream off?

RE: What are these urine crystals?

Clive Ansell — Thu, 25 Oct 2018 17:32:53 GMT

[quote user="Martin Atkinson"]I'd save the vodka for your own use.[/quote]

As long as it was opened within the last 28 days

RE: What are these urine crystals?

Martin Atkinson — Thu, 25 Oct 2018 17:08:53 GMT

[quote user="Toadster"]I'm an RVN with a healthy interest in lab work and in my humble view I would agree the dumb-bell shape is indicative of calcium oxalate monohydrate crystals. I am hugely interested in this subject so my apologies if my information to you is over-stepping boundaries.

[/quote]Why the humility your opinion is as valid as anyone's? I value my nurses' opinions more than many vets'. Any vet who doesn't think the same isn't worth your time TBH.

[quote user="Laurence Webb"] I've had a bottle of Vodka at hand for a couple of years now[/quote] You've got to give them the alcohol as soon as you know the cat has taken ethylene glyco. If these are calcium oxalate monohydrate crystals then the damage is done. I'd save the vodka for your own use.

RE: What are these urine crystals?

Laurence Webb — Thu, 25 Oct 2018 16:47:59 GMT

Thanks Toadster.

The cat doesn't have high total calcium although I've not measured ionised calcium. The owner reports it never leaves his garden (but cats do what they want so who knows). As it has been inappetent for a couple of days I suspect any renal damage has been done and not worth treating specifically for ethylene glycol toxicity (although I've had a bottle of Vodka at hand for a couple of years now!).

IVF, supportive treatment for now and I may ultrasound his kidneys tomorrow.

RE: What are these urine crystals?

Alison Clare Hickman — Thu, 25 Oct 2018 16:36:58 GMT

I'm an RVN with a healthy interest in lab work and in my humble view I would agree the dumb-bell shape is indicative of calcium oxalate monohydrate crystals. I have found an article which discusses these for my own interest and though I'd share it with you... it details ethylene glycol as a differential but also .."can also be seen in the urine of animals with hypercalciuria from other causes, e.g. paraneoplastic hypercalcemia with lymphoma..."

http://www.eclinpath.com/urinalysis/crystals/#calcium-oxalate-monohydrate

I am hugely interested in this subject so my apologies if my information to you is over-stepping boundaries. I will return to observing VS information on this forum in future, if I have.

Peace.

RE: What are these urine crystals?

Laurence Webb — Thu, 25 Oct 2018 15:45:03 GMT

I got a couple more and found this dumbell shaped crystal so I am now thinking that it could be Ca Oxalate monohydrate so need to think about ethylene glycol rather than progression of CRF. Any other problems that I should think of?

RE: What are these urine crystals?

Laurence Webb — Thu, 25 Oct 2018 15:42:25 GMT

RE: What are these urine crystals?

Laurence Webb — Thu, 25 Oct 2018 14:08:33 GMT

That's the only photo I have at the moment bit I will try to grab some more this afternoon. I fairly sure they are crystals as I have encountered then before.

RE: What are these urine crystals?

Richard Carter — Thu, 25 Oct 2018 13:19:35 GMT

more photos, poss stained? The parts I can see look organic?