Backwards limb on peachick

RE: Backwards limb on peachick

Mark Rowland — Sat, 09 Dec 2017 17:10:31 GMT

From the rads, I would reiterate that I think the prognosis isn't good.

Waiting for ossification allows further development of the abnormalities and secondary issues making fixation even more difficult.

At the same time this bird may become obese due to lack of activity causing overload of the other limb, potential bumble foot or angular limb deformities.

Would love to see some post ops of some you have done Marie as Ive had little success with surgeries on these when they've been presented to me.

What has the client decided here?

Mark

RE: Backwards limb on peachick

Marie Kubiak — Mon, 04 Dec 2017 14:07:53 GMT

There looks to be a significant change in angulation of the distal tibiotarsus. Is the foot genuinely backwards or just laterally deviated?

If this is the only abnormality and the leg is not markedly rotated then I would be tempted to hold off until you have better ossification of the epiphyses. My approach would be transecting the tibiotarsus at the point of maximal angulation, derotating it and fixing it in a straight line at the same length of the other leg. As said earlier pins on either side of the tendon are useful to prevent this slipping while everything is realigned and adapts to the new position. However, this will definitely require financial input from the owner not only for surgery but for follow up (and greater if it doesn't work!). It isn't necessarily more expensive to refer so might be worth a call to your nearest bird vet to get an idea of comparative costs and if bone grafts or other more radical approaches are needed then you may be glad not to be stuck with it!

Does Malcolm Ness have a more educated opinion or approach as I am somewhat primitive!?

Marie

RE: Backwards limb on peachick

Sheryl Calway — Mon, 04 Dec 2017 11:23:03 GMT

Lateral and VD rads

Thanks in advance everyone!

RE: Backwards limb on peachick

Sheryl Calway — Mon, 04 Dec 2017 11:22:20 GMT

So..I examined the chick..almost now 5 weeks old...hips and femur in position/ok. Rotation 'felt' to be starting mid-shaft tibia? Evident radiographically too?

I'm thinking tibial diaphysial rotation 2ary to nutritional deficits of chick being reared on game chick crumb from earlier in breeding season?

O keen to fix but not "made of money" - so referral is not an option. Worth it?

RE: Backwards limb on peachick

grumpyoldman — Sun, 03 Dec 2017 11:57:55 GMT

I have seen Perosis with deviation and rotation in water fowl ,particularly hand reared spoonbills , most of it is down to over feeding and competition feeding leading to trauma and avulsion , I used ESF with k-band wires and technovit in disposlble 4mm ET tubes to reposition the tendon. They do ok but best not going back with the others afterwards as the growth check puts them at a disadvantage, they can get knocked about in the food scramble and end up with crop hernias and air sac injuries.

RE: Backwards limb on peachick

Marie Kubiak — Fri, 01 Dec 2017 12:43:39 GMT

[quote user="Mark Rowland"]

When you see this bird, please remember that it is much larger than a parrot when grown and so overload on the other limb is very significant. Also this bird is young so has lots of rapid growing to do. Therefore external fixators or fixing limbs won't help too much and regardless of the underlying cause you have to warn the client that any attempt at correction may not work at all.

[/quote]

I have done similar corrections (panarticular fixation) on juvenile cranes/storks so it definitely can be used on larger species but there has to be very regular ongoing monitoring and I tend to remove the ex-fix much earlier in fast-growing species but leave the Im pins in place for up to 6wks. It isn't aiming for arthrodesis so doesn't need implants in place to fully immobilise the joint for the same length as in cats and dogs, just until there has been enough fibrosis to provide rotational stability of the joint.

Marie

RE: Backwards limb on peachick

Mark Rowland — Thu, 30 Nov 2017 21:34:09 GMT

RE: Backwards limb on peachick

Sheryl Calway — Thu, 30 Nov 2017 21:10:33 GMT

Thank you for your thoughts Edward and Mark. Marie...thank you sincerely for taking the time to write so many really useful suggestions. The surgery you describe sounds very interesting indeed...a not so little part of me would like this to be the cause purely to try out that surgical technique!! Hopefully I’ll be better informed in the consult tomorrow having your suggestions to work with, thanks again!

RE: Backwards limb on peachick

Marie Kubiak — Thu, 30 Nov 2017 15:56:57 GMT

[quote user="Sheryl Calway"]

Thanks in advance for reading this!

Despite the time of year, I have a 4 week old peachick being brought to me tomorrow. Reported to have had a foot that faced laterally last week but now is intermittently backwards facing completely.

Im aware of Achilles’ tendons slipping, but didn’t think foot would rotate that much...? Any other ideas? Wondering on nutritional issues but not sure what I should be testing for specifically...?

Thanks in advance for any ideas!

[/quote]

I've had some juvenile parrots present with a 'backwards foot'. All have had a 180 degree rotation at the stifle, presumed a dislocation in nest, usually with inexperienced parents. A couple the owners have been willing to attempt surgical repair, with careful dissection and derotation followed by fixation (IM pins through femur and tibiotarsus linked, plus ex fix from femur to base of tibiotarsus holding limb in perching position). Sounds horrendous but actually not that bad a surgery and follow up over a 2yr period was good - surprisingly the animals achieved apparently normal function but I would expect arthritic change as they age. If this is the cause I am pretty sure I have some photos of surgery of one in a Galah somewhere.

Otherwise nutritional or rearing substrate issues can cause deformities (diaphyseal rotation of the tibiotarsus usually), similar causes and rotation associated with secondary tendon slippage at the level of the distal tibiotarsus/intertarsal joint, malunion of fracture, coxofemoral luxation and a fractured leg swinging in the breeze are all possible.

Marie

RE: Backwards limb on peachick

Mark Rowland — Thu, 30 Nov 2017 10:45:18 GMT

Post some pics when you see it. Prognosis is normally poor in my experience.

Goodluck

RE: Backwards limb on peachick

Edward Jones — Thu, 30 Nov 2017 10:41:14 GMT

Malunion, perhaps?