Vaccinating shelter animals

RE: Vaccinating shelter animals

ruths — Sat, 12 Nov 2016 11:53:51 GMT

I am pretty sure felv vaccines are subunit so there's no shedding

RE: Vaccinating shelter animals

Hannah Wynne Richards — Sat, 12 Nov 2016 07:57:39 GMT

I would hope no reputable rehoming centre would consider potential adopters who didn't keep existing animals vaccinations up to date

Wynne

RE: Vaccinating shelter animals

grumpyoldman — Sat, 12 Nov 2016 00:23:24 GMT

The biggest problem in these situations is rehoming to an already established populated multicat household. A recently vaccinated cat shedding live attenuated virus ,inoculating the pre existing population both with new wild virus and its vaccine strains. The established cats are not vaccinated or lapsed ,bingo house full of poorly cats on the charities bill. Sometimes doing nothing until the dust settles first or persuading the new owners to update the existing pets immunity with a vaccine at the same time then delay introduction for 21 days is the best idea.

RE: Vaccinating shelter animals

Beats — Fri, 11 Nov 2016 21:03:20 GMT

[quote user="Neil Wheadon"]It would be very useful if we had a central area for collecting data like this, far too much is spread by informal channels.[/quote]

http://www.wormsandgermsmap.com/index.aspx might be of some interest to you (go East and start recording)

http://www.promedmail.org/ if you like more general outbreak reporting not limited to pets.

RE: Vaccinating shelter animals

Neil Wheadon — Fri, 11 Nov 2016 16:52:25 GMT

[quote user="David Mills"]

Panleucopaenia is rife in cities, and we've had 4 outbreaks in London (in our hospitals) in the last 2 years. It's epidemiology is very different to FeLV and is very easily spread.

[/quote]

Which is really interesting as I have heard of one case 2 years ago in a Bristol practice from a rescue centre in South Wales.

It would be very useful if we had a central area for collecting data like this, far too much is spread by informal channels. (Like here!!) A good example is a friend in Hampshire who is pretty sure she has seen 2 cases of Key Gaskell in the part month, interesting stuff

Neil

RE: Vaccinating shelter animals

David Mills — Fri, 11 Nov 2016 16:17:11 GMT

[quote user="Neil Wheadon"]

[quote user="David Mills"]I think we're talking at cross purposes here. Ive no doubt that vaccination has massively reduced felv in the past. The question relevant here is whether it should be considered a core vaccine. I don't think it should because of the very low prevalence. it's not as simple as saying to keep the prevalence low we keep vaccinating everything as that ignores clustering.[/quote]

Yes it should be a core vaccine

It killed/severely debilitated 1 in 25 cats before the vaccine came out and the vaccine has helped reduce it to almost nothing.

FeLV is in the same category as Panleucopaenia, yet that's considered a core vaccine, yet when did people last see this?

Surely a core vaccine keeps diseases at bay and FeLV is doing that with as many cats as ever.

Neil

[/quote]

This is at danger of oversimplification. It is believed there are clusters of feral cat populations where FeLV circulates - I've no idea where, and certainly not in London as far as we're aware.

For this the jump again into the owned populations, it requires, generally, prolonged contact such as mutual grooming, sharing feed bowls etc. This doesn't apply to most cats, but rather senitnel cats that may mix with a feral colony and also have domestic con-specifics. It would be very difficult, given the success of vaccination in the past, for FeLV to jump back into the domestic population, because the prevalence is tiny (2 in 8 years) and the routes of transmission are minimal. Whereas previously there was horizontal trasnmission between domestics where vaccine was unavailable, this is very unlikely.

Panleucopaenia is rife in cities, and we've had 4 outbreaks in London (in our hospitals) in the last 2 years. It's epidemiology is very different to FeLV and is very easily spread.

Every vaccine should keep diseases at bay. But we have to consider the evolving epidemiology. To my mind, the success of previous vaccination means FeLV is now largely unnecessary in owned cats.

RE: Vaccinating shelter animals

Neil Wheadon — Fri, 11 Nov 2016 14:52:30 GMT

Yes it should be a core vaccine

It killed/severely debilitated 1 in 25 cats before the vaccine came out and the vaccine has helped reduce it to almost nothing.

FeLV is in the same category as Panleucopaenia, yet that's considered a core vaccine, yet when did people last see this?

Surely a core vaccine keeps diseases at bay and FeLV is doing that with as many cats as ever.

Neil

RE: Vaccinating shelter animals

Hannah Wynne Richards — Fri, 11 Nov 2016 11:34:59 GMT

I agree with Neil and Gillian

Wynne

RE: Vaccinating shelter animals

Gillian Mostyn — Fri, 11 Nov 2016 11:02:31 GMT

[quote user="David Mills"]The question relevant here is whether it should be considered a core vaccine. [/quote]

I don't know enough about the current epidemiology to know the answer - but does anyone?

However, apart from the cost (which is presumably, and quite rightly, a major consideration for the RSPCA) is there any other reason not to include it? Don't we also vaccinate against many other bugs where the actual current distribution is likely to be very patchy?

I can see that the RSPCA may choose not to include FeLV on a cost basis, considering the current risk levels that they perceive, but surely that doesn't change the fact that, as a usually fatal disease which can produce a carrier status, it is justifiable to consider it a 'core' vaccine. Afterall, it is inevitable, is it not, that if herd immunity drops, it will become more prevalent again?

RE: Vaccinating shelter animals

David Mills — Fri, 11 Nov 2016 09:46:16 GMT

[quote user="Gillian Mostyn"]

David - I don't think there are many vets who aren't seeing much less FeLV than they used to. I've only seen a couple of cases in the last 5 years. I used to see a couple of cases a month when we tested stray animals before vaccination. If you don't think this is due to widespread vaccination, what do you think it is due to?

[/quote]

I think we're talking at cross purposes here. Ive no doubt that vaccination has massively reduced felv in the past. The question relevant here is whether it should be considered a core vaccine. I don't think it should because of the very low prevalence. it's not as simple as saying to keep the prevalence low we keep vaccinating everything as that ignores clustering.

RE: Vaccinating shelter animals

Gillian Mostyn — Fri, 11 Nov 2016 09:33:07 GMT

RE: Vaccinating shelter animals

Neil Wheadon — Fri, 11 Nov 2016 08:57:58 GMT

[quote user="David Mills"]I don't think we can say this categorically. It depends on what % of cats are vaccinated against FeLV, how protective the vaccine is, and the natural prevalence. I believe there are pockets of FeLV in certain parts of the country, but does widespread vaccination in pet cats contribute, these days, to reduced incidence?[/quote]

Really?

You can never prove anything it seems, look at the link between badgers and TB

25 years ago I saw maybe 1 in 25 cats with FeLV, I can't recall the last one I have seen now and I work in many practices. That's vaccination at work.

Neil

RE: Vaccinating shelter animals

Neil Wheadon — Fri, 11 Nov 2016 08:22:32 GMT

A plug for London Vet Show

Presentation from Evidence based medicine at Nottingham

Rachel Dean and Jenny Stavisky will present ‘Management and prevention of infectious disease in animals in shelters/multi animal environments’ in the RCVS Clinical Theatre 2 on the Friday at 1.30pm.

Neil

RE: Vaccinating shelter animals

David Mills — Thu, 10 Nov 2016 18:25:46 GMT

[quote user="robloxley"]

[quote user="David Mills"]When was the last time anyone saw a confirmed case of FeLV?[/quote]

Forgive me if the reason for this is not widespread vaccination?

[/quote]

I don't think we can say this categorically. It depends on what % of cats are vaccinated against FeLV, how protective the vaccine is, and the natural prevalence. I believe there are pockets of FeLV in certain parts of the country, but does widespread vaccination in pet cats contribute, these days, to reduced incidence?

RE: Vaccinating shelter animals

Rob Loxley — Thu, 10 Nov 2016 18:20:41 GMT

[quote user="David Mills"]When was the last time anyone saw a confirmed case of FeLV?[/quote]

Forgive me if the reason for this is not widespread vaccination?

RE: Vaccinating shelter animals

David Mills — Thu, 10 Nov 2016 17:06:42 GMT

[quote user="Anthony Dennison"]

Thanks David, have to admit I was waiting for your input! What do the RSPCA do in London with a higher population density of cats?

[/quote]

We only give core vaccines, flu/ent and combined vacc for dogs (no KC). All cats and dogs get a full starter course unless they're feral cats, in which case they'll get a booster then re-released. Some that are rehomed before 3w (cats) owners are expected to come back, most do. Anyone who rehomes is offered FeLV if they want it, about 10% do I believe (they have to pay).

RE: Vaccinating shelter animals

Anthony Dennison — Thu, 10 Nov 2016 16:48:27 GMT

Thanks David, have to admit I was waiting for your input! What do the RSPCA do in London with a higher population density of cats?

RE: Vaccinating shelter animals

David Mills — Thu, 10 Nov 2016 16:06:17 GMT

When was the last time anyone saw a confirmed case of FeLV?

We've seen about 2 in the last 8 years, and that's testing around 1000 cats/yr in London.

The argument that it's negligent to not give FeLV is frankly ridiculous. To apply such distorted logic about preventing pain, injury and disease then we'd never walk dogs outside. In fact, the only way of preventing any pain, injury and disease would be to euthanase everything as soon as they were born.

RE: Vaccinating shelter animals

Anthony Todd — Wed, 09 Nov 2016 17:17:02 GMT

[quote user="Hannah Wynne Richards"]

because nobody bought it

Wynne

[/quote]

Probably right, but you could stop day old kittens getting flu with a drop up each nostril so ideal in a charity home.

RE: Vaccinating shelter animals

Hannah Wynne Richards — Wed, 09 Nov 2016 16:46:28 GMT

I think the intranasal vaccine was phased out 15/20 years ago.................because nobody bought it

Wynne

RE: Vaccinating shelter animals

Thomas Johnson — Wed, 09 Nov 2016 16:10:38 GMT

[quote user="Anthony Todd"]

[quote user="Beats"]I go with ABCD on this issue[/quote]

Better to get one dose into them ASAP and hopefully rehome them before they pick something up at the Centre?

Insist the owner has the second shot., or the full course again when rehomed ASAP?

Do they still use intranasal flu vaccine in young kittens?

[/quote]

With our local Cats Protection branch they get the 1st vacc as soon as possible and are available for re-homing straight away, 2nd vacc with the new owner, or with CP if they haven't found them a home yet. I assume this is how most rescues work.

I don't think there are any intranasal cat 'flu vaccines.

RE: Vaccinating shelter animals

Anthony Todd — Wed, 09 Nov 2016 15:44:52 GMT

[quote user="Beats"]I go with ABCD on this issue[/quote]

Better to get one dose into them ASAP and hopefully rehome them before they pick something up at the Centre?

Insist the owner has the second shot., or the full course again when rehomed ASAP?

Do they still use intranasal flu vaccine in young kittens?

RE: Vaccinating shelter animals

Beats — Tue, 08 Nov 2016 23:40:42 GMT

[quote user="Anthony Dennison"]Adult animal at a rescue centre, has an unknown vaccination history. Do you follow manufacturers guidelines and restart the primary course, or WSAVA guidelines of giving a single, full booster?[/quote]

I go with ABCD on this issue:

"In contrast to vaccines against other infectious agents, where a single vaccination is acceptable for adult cats of unknown or uncertain vaccination status, in the case of FHV two vaccinations at an interval of two to four weeks are recommended, irrespective of the vaccine type."

http://www.abcdcatsvets.org/feline-herpesvirus/#general-recommendations-on-vaccine-type-and-vaccination-protocol

RE: Vaccinating shelter animals

Anthony Todd — Tue, 08 Nov 2016 23:23:44 GMT

I'm sure the vaccine manufacturers would supply short dated vaccine for use without certification if asked nicely.....

RE: Vaccinating shelter animals

Rob Loxley — Tue, 08 Nov 2016 19:23:01 GMT

Shelters that gripe about rehoming cats to be indoor-only but equally don't include FeLV in their vaccinations are an ongoing annoyance...