Atopic puppy

RE: Atopic puppy

ChrisBVSc — Sat, 10 Sep 2016 13:33:46 GMT

Allergic reaction to other external allergens like pollen or house dust mites (i.e. atopic dermatitis) doesn't usually present below about a year of age, whereas pruritus due to adverse food reaction could well do. Certainly seen this a lot in practice. As to exactly why, don't ask me I'm not an immunologist! But it's what the books say! Contact reaction possible too as you suggest.

RE: Atopic puppy

Anthony Todd — Sat, 10 Sep 2016 12:45:43 GMT

[quote user="ChrisBVSc"]reaction to food would be a strong possibility.[/quote]

I meant why food as opposed to all the other more common allergens in adults.

I don't think contact "reaction" has been mentioned either. The pup wouldn't be being washed in some irritant detergent or shampoo, you'd be surprised at the things some owners do.....???

RE: Atopic puppy

ChrisBVSc — Sat, 10 Sep 2016 09:00:23 GMT

[quote user="Anthony Todd"]

[quote user="ChrisBVSc"]Surely food allergy has to be top of the list for this one[/quote]

Why? Food allergy is not that common in adults, compared with parasites, pollen etc.

Not being critical or trying to upset, just asking......

[/quote]

True regarding adult dogs, but this is a 3 month old puppy - in which case atopy would be considered rare, but adverse reaction to food would be a strong possibility. Pruritus due to parasites obviously comes top of the list but it sounds like they had been ruled out.

RE: Atopic puppy

Martin Atkinson — Mon, 05 Sep 2016 10:01:59 GMT

[quote user="robloxley"]What age of dog is Apoquel licensed from?[/quote]12 months! But trials have been done in 16 week old puppies to study the effect on immune response to vaccination and it has shown that it does not interfere but should be views with caution. Regardless I would be happier using it than corticosteroids in a puppy of this age.

RE: Atopic puppy

Stephen Courtney — Sun, 04 Sep 2016 18:14:51 GMT

[quote user="Joyce Whitehead"]

Yes we have had a staffie with demodex who had been treated with aludex and advocate at another practice. I'd read about bravecto (on here I think) and we tried it. After one tablet he was loads better and after two completely sorted. We tried it on another pup and equally good results.

[/quote]

Woohoo! Thank you - i loathe teaching clients how to use aludex!I'm sure half the posh ones don't even try - in case it buggers up years of organic food and clean living!

RE: Atopic puppy

Joyce Whitehead — Sat, 03 Sep 2016 22:38:32 GMT

RE: Atopic puppy

Stephen Courtney — Sat, 03 Sep 2016 21:59:32 GMT

[quote user="robloxley"]

[quote user="Martin Atkinson"]I could do with it being atopic, I have a load of short-dated (Jan 17) 3.6 mg Apoquel accumulated from when we had to batch buy it to get supplies that I could do with getting rid of![/quote]

What age of dog is Apoquel licensed from?

[/quote]

I would just use the apoquel regardless. Way better than steroids and if you dont get the pruritus under control the client will lose faith in you eventually...

If it doesn't work then that adds weight to a food allergy but I feel that about 80% of apoquel users do great, 10% need to stay on the bid dose rate, and 10% it doesn't work at all. Needless to say the last 10% are the dogs that need it the most.

As a by the way, I have heard through the grape vine that Bravecto is a miracle Demodex killer - anyone had any joy with it? i get very few cases these days

RE: Atopic puppy

Rob Loxley — Fri, 02 Sep 2016 20:55:28 GMT

What age of dog is Apoquel licensed from?

RE: Atopic puppy

Martin Atkinson — Fri, 02 Sep 2016 18:57:55 GMT

I could do with it being atopic, I have a load of short-dated (Jan 17) 3.6 mg Apoquel accumulated from when we had to batch buy it to get supplies that I could do with getting rid of!

RE: Atopic puppy

Charlotte Marshall — Fri, 02 Sep 2016 17:29:12 GMT

I have seen it once in a westie that young and it was really severe the poor thing was on treatment it's entire life I seem to recall.

RE: Atopic puppy

Martin Atkinson — Fri, 02 Sep 2016 14:26:24 GMT

[quote user="Richard Carter"]

food allergy + 1 because everyone has to feed a puppy and as mentioned above these bright yellow things with squidgy centres that cost a pound for a bag are not healthy.

Also just check the poor thing hasn't been perfumed, deodorised, had mum's hair spray, washed in ??? just to get it nice and fluffy and they don't disinfect/ treat its bedding every 24 hours or have a nice spraying house air freshener next to the dog's bed

[/quote]I'm hanging on with the food trial because I've only just got it off crap and onto RCW junior. That said IME food allergies usually also involves GI symptoms and scratching around the head/neck not the current distribution. All the other things mentioned are possible and have been banned!

RE: Atopic puppy

Bob Russell — Fri, 02 Sep 2016 11:22:18 GMT

[quote user="Martin Atkinson"]

[quote user="Bob Russell"]I assume skin scrapings are negative for demodex. [/quote]There are no lesions to scrape, demodex is not usually pruritic and the distribution is wrong - never seen it inside the pinna, inguinally or in the axilla without it being in the classical places first.

[/quote]

Common things happen commonly, rare things rarely happen!

RE: Atopic puppy

Anthony Todd — Thu, 01 Sep 2016 23:29:03 GMT

[quote user="Richard Carter"]

or had a pyrethroid flea powder applied to it - the pyrethroid dust can drive some dogs mad with pruritis even though 'natural' product.

And finally what fabric soap do they use for the bedding/ towels?

[/quote]

Distribution wrong for a contact "reaction"??

RE: Atopic puppy

Jenny Harris — Thu, 01 Sep 2016 21:26:01 GMT

I have seen atopic dermatitis in a viszla this young. He is now 3yo and doing ok on apoquel but does get flare ups. Immunotherapy didn't work for him. I did refer to a derm as I thought he was too young for atopy but that was what they diagnosed.

RE: Atopic puppy

Emily Rainbow — Thu, 01 Sep 2016 20:37:27 GMT

Another vote for food trial here.

RE: Atopic puppy

Richard Carter — Thu, 01 Sep 2016 18:06:25 GMT

or had a pyrethroid flea powder applied to it - the pyrethroid dust can drive some dogs mad with pruritis even though 'natural' product.

And finally what fabric soap do they use for the bedding/ towels?

RE: Atopic puppy

Richard Carter — Thu, 01 Sep 2016 18:03:11 GMT

food allergy + 1 because everyone has to feed a puppy and as mentioned above these bright yellow things with squidgy centres that cost a pound for a bag are not healthy.

RE: Atopic puppy

Anthony Todd — Thu, 01 Sep 2016 17:37:59 GMT

[quote user="ChrisBVSc"]Surely food allergy has to be top of the list for this one[/quote]

Why? Food allergy is not that common in adults, compared with parasites, pollen etc.

Not being critical or trying to upset, just asking......

RE: Atopic puppy

ChrisBVSc — Thu, 01 Sep 2016 17:21:22 GMT

Surely food allergy has to be top of the list for this one, I haven't seen any atopics that young and my understanding is it would be pretty unlikely.

RE: Atopic puppy

Anthony Todd — Thu, 01 Sep 2016 17:11:22 GMT

[quote user="Martin Atkinson"]Has anyone seen atopic dermatitis in a 3 month old puppy? [/quote]

I haven't but

Management of Severe Atopic Dermatitis in Neonates

from http://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/445146

suggests it occurs in human neonates but doesn't say how old "neonates" are!!

inside the ears sounds like a hard place to get to as well if self-inflicted or behavioural is to be considered.

RE: Atopic puppy

Martin Atkinson — Thu, 01 Sep 2016 16:38:14 GMT

RE: Atopic puppy

Bob Russell — Thu, 01 Sep 2016 16:17:22 GMT

I assume skin scrapings are negative for demodex. I have found Advocate singularly useless for demodecosis.

I have always considered atopy to be extremely unusual under 6 months of age.

RE: Atopic puppy

Joyce Whitehead — Thu, 01 Sep 2016 15:41:49 GMT

Years ago i remember seeing a similar case, I think in a westie. That one resolved when they stopped feeding it lots of brightly coloured treats, so a food trial may be worth a try? I think it did go on to get more classic atopy when it was older, but then it was a westie...