Leishmaniasis

RE: Leishmaniasis

vetbl.locum — Fri, 02 Sep 2016 22:02:49 GMT

lol

That is so cynical ...........but so spot on !

RE: Leishmaniasis

Kathryn Burton — Fri, 02 Sep 2016 22:00:35 GMT

Leishmaniasis --> periorbital alopecia --> look extra sad --> bonus good Samaritain points for choosing over UK rescue dog...

RE: Leishmaniasis

Rob Loxley — Fri, 02 Sep 2016 20:59:17 GMT

I strongly doubt whether these dogs are declared as 'commercial' imports, nor whether any mechanisms are in place to detect this

RE: Leishmaniasis

Emily Nightingale — Fri, 02 Sep 2016 20:54:21 GMT

Thank you Sally- yet again very useful info..

It's a start but not a bullet proof means of stopping the trade of imported dogs as charities will argue they only ask for a "donation" and not a sale, and the dog is being permanently fostered and not owned but the rehomer, but it's definitely a step forward. I will put together a letter to the BVA. Anyone wishes to sign it will be welcome to scrutinise a first draft. Thank you again for your input. Emily

RE: Leishmaniasis

Lindsey Edwards — Fri, 02 Sep 2016 18:18:34 GMT

[quote user="Sally Everitt"]

However, any dog being imported for rehoming should not be travelling under the Pet Travel Scheme as this would be counted as a commercial movement, you can refer your client to the Defra website for further information https://www.gov.uk/take-pet-abroad, where it says you must follow extra rules if the animals will be sold or re-homed.

Commercial movements, while having to meet all the requirements of the Pet Passport Scheme, are also subject to health certification before movement and the potential for post import checks (though this should be to the importer rather than the new owner).

[/quote]

These imported rehoming dogs are supposed to be certified healthy prior to travel - who should they be reported to when certification is in doubt/proven wrong? This is surely a bigger concern than questionable passports or microchips given risk of introducing disease let alone zoonoses

RE: Leishmaniasis

Charlotte Marshall — Fri, 02 Sep 2016 17:51:59 GMT

Just looked at this. What is the Animal Health Certificate Number? Is that it's passport number?

RE: Leishmaniasis

Sally Everitt — Fri, 02 Sep 2016 08:52:19 GMT

You may be interested in the following which was posted on the DEFRA website yesterday

1 September 2016 4:50pm All pets must now travel with this declaration. Not just when they travel from listed and unlisted countries.

You must fill in this form to confirm that you won't sell or transfer the pet dog, cat, ferret or assistance dog to a new owner in the UK.

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/pet-travel-declaration-for-the-non-commercial-movement-of-animals#history

It is not clear who will inspect this form or what will happen if it is not completed or complied with , but I will try to find out.

Sally Everitt

RE: Leishmaniasis

Utlendigur — Thu, 01 Sep 2016 22:57:41 GMT

[quote user="vetbl.locum"]Young dog brought from Romania in white van with several others. these dogs were dropped off at various points of motorway system. [/quote]

It's also noticeable just how many of these dogs escape, either in transit - especially at motorway services, or within a couple of days in their new homes, and go on to live feral for weeks. People have some woolly-headed idea that the dog will be grateful to be "rescued" and will suddenly just become a normal obedient pet, when many of them were life-long strays whose survival depended on keeping away from humans

RE: Leishmaniasis

vetbl.locum — Thu, 01 Sep 2016 22:43:58 GMT

I was (reluctantly) involved in a similar case

Young dog brought from Romania in white van with several others. these dogs were dropped off at various points of motorway system. This was organised by someone ( over internet ) who charged people to re home these dogs.

This dog was presented, examined and seemed to have had Distemper ( This later confirmed by Romanian vet who sent it to UK) The new owner drove 300 miles to collect dog , passing at least 3 large UK re homing centres, only to decide the dog was too ill ( I had told them that ) for them to have.

The resultant abuse from coordinator and which subsequently played out on FB was disgraceful. DEFRA was not interested and offered no help.

Believe dog went back to whence it came , so much for animal welfare .

We seem powerless as a profession to stop this trade in misery as the re home organisers are self appointed saints but nevertheless charge to drag dogs across Europe for better life whilst the UK kennels are packed with dogs ! And they don't have leishmaniasis, distemper or weird worm diseases

SO good luck Emily and hope the BVA have will power to help

Rgds

PS perhaps BREXIT may offer some hope

RE: Leishmaniasis

Emily Nightingale — Thu, 01 Sep 2016 21:50:12 GMT

Thank you for your replies. My next step is to write to the BVA to ask what their position is on this. I cannot fathom why we are allowing unhealthy dogs carrying diseases of an unknown level of risk re contagious canine disease as well as zoonotic transfer into this country.

I intend to wade a bit deeper into this and wonder what the best course of action is to stop this.

RE: Leishmaniasis

Virginia Campbell — Thu, 01 Sep 2016 18:42:30 GMT

Two hundred and fifty quid for a Leishmania infected mongrel? Somebody's having a laugh. I paid that for a pedigree pup from good working parents.

But I suppose you only get bog standard Good Samaritan points for a UK rescue, bonus points if it's from Ireland, double bonus points if it's from anywhere else (you must call it a street dog for full effect even if you don't know its history). Gold stars available for your hero complex if there's something wrong with it.

RE: Leishmaniasis

Stephanie Wellings — Wed, 31 Aug 2016 22:10:44 GMT

I have encountered a couple of dogs with leishmania, on allopurinol long term but started showing symptoms despite this, we wanted to start additional treatment but the other drugs are quite difficult to get hold of unless the owner can make trips over to Greece to get them, and definitely not cheap! I think it's a bit misleading of the rescue centre to describe it the way they do.

RE: Leishmaniasis

Joyce Whitehead — Wed, 31 Aug 2016 21:54:29 GMT

I agree wholeheartedly - we have a client who has adopted 4 Romanian "street dogs" who were driven to the uk, one of which was travel sick all the way (around 36 hours of driving). How can that be sensible or kind to the dog? They all arrived rather subdued, very nervous and under socialised.

They have improved in their stable new home, but I also feel she could have adopted uk dogs who were also desperate for homes. The information about commercial imports is very interesring though...

RE: Leishmaniasis

Emily Nightingale — Wed, 31 Aug 2016 21:20:32 GMT

Thank you all- particularly Sally. A really great response.

I feel really strongly about this. Surely as a profession we should be able to have an impact somewhere to stop this happening. On further discussion with my client she informed me that loads of dogs are bussed over, and dropped off on one side of the UK first then carry on down the other side afterwards.. Dropping off dogs at multiple rescue centers along the way. My client had paid a £50 deposit with £200 being due on collection.. I suspect someone somewhere is making a shedload of money from importing these dogs.. What can we do?!? £250 would go miles at grass root level in neutering street dogs in Spain.

RE: Leishmaniasis

Martin Atkinson — Wed, 31 Aug 2016 16:14:17 GMT

[quote user="Emily Herskind Nightingale"] I contacted the charity on her behalf to find out more. I spoke to the lady in charge who seemed very sceptical of any veterinary input, and said she gets the drugs sent over with the dogs for the lifelong control of "leish" [/quote]This statement alone would set off the alarm bells before we even get to any pontificating over the health risks and morality of importing dogs when there's so many already here needing homes. I would have nothing to to do with someone who will be getting medication from a 3rd party it is illegal and you are not in control of the dog's welfare.

I have found in practice that the sort of people who import these pets are only one step behind dog breeders in thinking they know everything when they know nothing and the new owners are usually more aggravation than they're worth. I would tell the client to screw her head on the right way and walk away from it and I wouldn't be happy having her as a client.

That must be worth a red star!

RE: Leishmaniasis

Sally Everitt — Wed, 31 Aug 2016 14:15:48 GMT

Hi Emily,

As others have said Leishmaniasis is not a notifiable disease so there is no restriction on the dog coming in to the UK.

We have more information on the staging and management of Leishmaniasis on the BSAVA website http://www.bsava.com/Resources/ScientificInformation/Leishmaniosis.aspx (member only content) and there is also information available from Leishvet http://www.leishvet.org/ . However, your client should be warned that these dogs frequently suffer ongoing chronic health problems. Reports from France and Portugal indicate that 10-25% of affected dogs are euthanased as a result of the disease but 30-45% survive more than 5 years (Mattin et al., 2013).

It is important to point out that Leishmaniasis is a zoonosis and although we do not (currently) have the vector in the UK there are a small number of reports of apparent transmission to other dogs through direct contact (bites and wounds) venereal, vertical transmission and via blood transfusion.

In terms of treatment there are 3 drugs in common use for the treatment of canine Leishmaniosis, details and dose rates are all in the BSAVA Formulary

Meglumine antimonite (Glucantime) s/c injection Miltefosine (Milleforan) oral Allopurinol oral (Zyloric) oral

You may also want to check out the paper in the June issue of JSAP which reports on the adverse effects of allopurinol (xanthinuria, renal mineralisation and urolithiais) http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/jsap.12484/full

We understand that people believe that they are helping by rescuing these dogs but from a veterinary perspective it is reasonable to recommend that they don’t deliberately take on an animal with a known problem.

Sally Everitt

RE: Leishmaniasis

Rob Loxley — Wed, 31 Aug 2016 13:41:45 GMT

[quote user="Emily Herskind Nightingale"]I am sad that we are allowing these dogs into the country when there are so many healthy UK animals waiting for homes across the country.[/quote]

Indeed, and the money spent importing these dogs would often go much further if they were treated where they began life.

[quote user="Emily Herskind Nightingale"]Should DEFRA be made aware?[/quote]

I'm not sure there's any input they might make?

RE: Leishmaniasis

Richard Carter — Wed, 31 Aug 2016 13:41:00 GMT

but also agree - why would you want to bring in a rescue with problems when the local rescues overflowing???

RE: Leishmaniasis

Richard Carter — Wed, 31 Aug 2016 13:39:50 GMT

not a notifiable disease as far as I am aware so DEFRA not going to be able to do much. We had one ex-Spain on continuous allopurinol - did very well, had others ex Greece owners aware of being positive but not on any treatment and were equally healthy but have since been lost to follow up so don't know if a bit like malaria where it relapses if you ill with something immuno-compromising?