Advocate plus Tick treatments

RE: Advocate plus Tick treatments

Utlendigur — Thu, 24 Mar 2016 15:53:57 GMT

[quote user="Gillian Mostyn"]Pets wearing the collar should not be allowed to sleep in the same bed as their owners, especially children[/quote]

Assuming the advice is due to concern that the active ingredient will be shed into the close environment, that could actually be a positive in some circumstance - like being 2 days walk from anywhere in N Highlands squashed into a small backpacking tent with my 2 dogs to escape the hoards of ravenous midges outside, only to discover dozens of very active ticks crawling all over the dogs, sleeping bag, me...Talk about a rock and a hard place. Went off frontline at that point as it did bugger all was not 100% effective for ticks (just remembered the bit about the drug company watching the forum). Never had a problem since using seresto.

RE: Advocate plus Tick treatments

Sarah Keir — Tue, 22 Mar 2016 19:57:46 GMT

[quote user="Kate Richardson"]

has anyone heard of any cases of lungworm in dogs that have been on monthly Advocate?

[/quote]

The two referral centres we refer to most often have both reported seeing lungworm in dogs treated with Advocate. But we do not know if applied correctly and exactly every 4 weeks etc.

RE: Advocate plus Tick treatments

Derek Lyon — Sat, 19 Mar 2016 20:28:17 GMT

What is your definition of a baby- boomer.I was born in 1942!!

RE: Advocate plus Tick treatments

Kate Richardson — Sat, 19 Mar 2016 13:24:52 GMT

has anyone heard of any cases of lungworm in dogs that have been on monthly Advocate?

RE: Advocate plus Tick treatments

Sarah Keir — Sat, 19 Mar 2016 10:43:48 GMT

Milbemax (Novartis) already have claim for treatment (weekly for 4 weeks) and prevention (monthly forever).

We have seen one case of lungworm in a puppy 4-5m old that treated monthly with milbemax from 10w old when came to see us - the thinking was it was infected before monthly Milbemax was started. Perhaps we sould be doing pre-prevention screens for lungworm lunk for heartworm?

Sarah

RE: Advocate plus Tick treatments

Bob Russell — Fri, 18 Mar 2016 14:13:34 GMT

Tangent perhaps but it appears that MSD are claiming their version of Milbemax can be used for treatment and prevention of lungworm. Look forward to seeing the data sheet.

One collar a year will not prevent the Christmas ticks we see here in the New Forest!

RE: Advocate plus Tick treatments

Mark Frost — Fri, 18 Mar 2016 14:06:58 GMT

Seresto is pretty reasonable cost wise - £30 - 40 and lasts 8 months so generally one collar March - October per year in addition to whatever other preventatives you are using.

RE: Advocate plus Tick treatments

Bob Russell — Fri, 18 Mar 2016 14:01:36 GMT

We have a zero tolerance policy for ticks!

Although Nexguard Spectra does not have a lungworm licence yet (apparently due sometime), I am perfectly happy to use this in preference to any other combination of products.

Milbemycin dose is comparable to Milbemax/Milpro so it is pretty unlikely to be inferior to them. We do make it clear that the licence is not through yet.

They are working on licence for sarcoptes and demodex but clearly do not feel this can be discussed at this stage!

Interesting product!

RE: Advocate plus Tick treatments

Martin Atkinson — Fri, 18 Mar 2016 13:53:14 GMT

[quote user="Derek Lyon"]Perhaps I should just use Advocate and examine our dog each day for ticks and remove as and when. [/quote]That is what I generally advise my clients as there is little tick problem around here and I've never seen a tick borne disease but if they were going to Epping Forest or Dartmoor or similar then I may advise additional tick prevention as in a long coated dog you won't always see ticks until they are quite large.

RE: Advocate plus Tick treatments

Rob Loxley — Fri, 18 Mar 2016 13:42:35 GMT

[quote user="Derek Lyon"]ps: costS involved are now important as I am an OAP!![/quote]

Plenty of baby-boomer OAPs are earning more from their final salary pensions and multiple buy-to-lets than I am working as a vet I'm sure!

RE: Advocate plus Tick treatments

Gillian Mostyn — Fri, 18 Mar 2016 12:57:26 GMT

Assuming your dog is between 5-10kg, the bravecto/monthly milbemax combo would cost approx £150 for the year at our practice. And no picking off ticks required. Bargain!

RE: Advocate plus Tick treatments

Derek Lyon — Fri, 18 Mar 2016 12:47:27 GMT

I really appreciate ALL your comments. So glad I am no longer in practice! I now have to decide my treatment regime. Perhaps I should just use Advocate and examine our dog each day for ticks and remove as and when. I have one of those plastic tick removers which I have found excellent in the past. Kind regards, Derek

ps: costS involved are now important as I am an OAP!!

RE: Advocate plus Tick treatments

Gillian Mostyn — Thu, 17 Mar 2016 22:22:14 GMT

[quote user="Mark Frost"]Seresto will kill any that aren't repelled, and those that are repelled usually die too (i.e those that come into contact with the animal but do not bite)[/quote]

Depends on species of tick as to whether it is repellent vs acaricidal, apparently!

The product has persistent acaricidal (killing) efficacy against tick infestations (Ixodes ricinus, Rhipicephalus sanguineus, Dermacentor reticulatus) and repellent (anti-feeding) efficacy against tick infestations (Ixodes ricinus, Rhipicephalus sanguineus) for 8 months. It is effective against larvae, nymphs and adult ticks.

RE: Advocate plus Tick treatments

Stephen Courtney — Thu, 17 Mar 2016 22:00:32 GMT

Yes - i was hoping to get away with that! All these new fangled drug names sound the same, don't even get me started on the '..ibs' which seem to be either nsaids or anti neoplastics.

RE: Advocate plus Tick treatments

Mark Frost — Thu, 17 Mar 2016 21:53:07 GMT

A quick edit there Stephen but some of us saw the deliberate mistake

RE: Advocate plus Tick treatments

Stephen Courtney — Thu, 17 Mar 2016 21:52:45 GMT

Seresto is a brilliant killer of ticks as well as fleas. the two chemicals boost each other so each works better on the target species than either alone.

RE: Advocate plus Tick treatments

Mark Frost — Thu, 17 Mar 2016 21:51:09 GMT

[quote user="emerald"]

I thought the ticks in which Babesia were found in Essex were Dermacentor Reticulatus?

Do most of you prefer repellent products eg Seresto, or products were ticks are killed eg Bravecto?

[/quote]

Seresto will kill any that aren't repelled, and those that are repelled usually die too (i.e those that come into contact with the animal but do not bite)

RE: Advocate plus Tick treatments

Stephen Courtney — Thu, 17 Mar 2016 21:50:07 GMT

Babesia is a fascinating parasite, and is pretty easy to diagnose and treat providing you are prepared.

Any dog with a fever and a suspicion of tick exposure should have a peripheral blood smear taken - the same drop of blood you would use for a spot blood glucose. the parasitised red cells are less flexible than normal ones and tend to sludge in capillaries so you pick them up more easily. An acute Babesiosis case should be hooching with the usually paired organisms and they show up very well with usual diff quick or Giemsa type stains. they also show on unstained slides, if you are used to spotting them.

The classical presentation for acute Babesiosis is an acutely unwell dog, off food 1-2 days, lethargic, mucosal pallor, tachycardia with bounding femoral 'water hammer' type pulses, and significant fever. Interestingly this looks very like acute IMHA, as the pathophysiology is largely similar.

Confirm with the capillary blood smear, if that is negative and you are still suspicious then submit blood to Acurus for PCR, but start treatment straight away as these dogs can deteriorate rapidly.

Imidocarb (Imizol) is the treatment of choice, not licensed for use in dogs in this country but is licensed for the condition in other countries where the disease is endemic, so nothing experimental about it. If you don't have any, you can start interim treatment with docycycline ( my personal choice) and I have heard that antirobe could be used too ( I personally wouldn't ...)

Imizol can cause drooling and nausea, atropine can help.

Remember also that the ticks that transmit Babesia can also transmit other diseases especially Rickettsial, so concomitant Ehrlichiosis is common and should be considered.

RE: Advocate plus Tick treatments

Gillian Mostyn — Thu, 17 Mar 2016 21:05:47 GMT

[quote user="Busybee"]Bravecto only has a license to kill the ticks that transmit Babesia (Rhipicephalus sanguineus) for 8 weeks, so by doing it as usual every 12 weeks, in theory, you are leaving the dog without specific 'Babesia prevention' for 4 weeks for every treatment. [/quote]

[quote user="emerald"]I thought the ticks in which Babesia were found in Essex were Dermacentor Reticulatus?[/quote]

I've just had to do a bit of research but this second comment is correct - for which bravecto is licensed for 12 weeks. Rhipicephalus only lives in warmer/sheltered environments, apparently, so is only really an issue in kenneling facilities in the UK.

[quote user="emerald"]Do most of you prefer repellent products eg Seresto, or products were ticks are killed eg Bravecto?[/quote]

For ticks - KILL!!!

[quote user="Busybee"]Seresto will kill and prevent the ticks attaching (including Rhipicephalus sanguineus) from 48hours after fitting, for up to 8 months. [/quote]

Yeah - but it looks ugly!

The data sheets do say:

Ticks will be killed and fall off the host within 24 to 48 hours after infestation without having had a blood meal, as a rule. An attachment of single ticks after treatment cannot be excluded. For this reason, a transmission of infectious diseases by ticks cannot be completely excluded if conditions are unfavourable.

However, in the interest of fairness, the Bravecto datasheet says:

Parasites need to start feeding on the host to become exposed to fluralaner; therefore the risk of the transmission of parasite borne diseases cannot be excluded.

Plus, although it is probably a ridiculous reason, I don't like the idea of it on my dog when she spends such a lot of time in close contact with my children (such as cuddled up with them on the sofa).

As with any veterinary medicinal product, do not allow small children to play with the collar, or to put it into their mouths. Pets wearing the collar should not be allowed to sleep in the same bed as their owners, especially children.

RE: Advocate plus Tick treatments

emerald — Thu, 17 Mar 2016 20:49:52 GMT

I thought the ticks in which Babesia were found in Essex were Dermacentor Reticulatus?

Do most of you prefer repellent products eg Seresto, or products were ticks are killed eg Bravecto?

RE: Advocate plus Tick treatments

Busybee — Thu, 17 Mar 2016 20:43:42 GMT

Specifics...

Bravecto only has a license to kill the ticks that transmit Babesia (Rhipicephalus sanguineus) for 8 weeks, so by doing it as usual every 12 weeks, in theory, you are leaving the dog without specific 'Babesia prevention' for 4 weeks for every treatment.

Seresto will kill and prevent the ticks attaching (including Rhipicephalus sanguineus) from 48hours after fitting, for up to 8 months.

RE: Advocate plus Tick treatments

Gillian Mostyn — Thu, 17 Mar 2016 20:43:12 GMT

[quote user="Liz white"]- leaves no stone unturned.[/quote]

And cannot be washed or licked off or applied incorrectly/badly.

RE: Advocate plus Tick treatments

Liz w — Thu, 17 Mar 2016 20:40:26 GMT

We were discussing this today as work. My preference is the same as Gillian's - leaves no stone unturned.

RE: Advocate plus Tick treatments

Martin Atkinson — Thu, 17 Mar 2016 19:14:57 GMT

Advocate plus Nexguard

RE: Advocate plus Tick treatments

Mark Frost — Thu, 17 Mar 2016 18:51:41 GMT

Seresto collar is fine to use alongside Advocate as imidocloprid is only absorbed into the fat layer if its level drops so it doesn't overdose, having said that Advocate/Advantix each 4 weekly with but staggered with a 2 week gap is also an option having discussed this previously with Bayer. Both options offer repellant activity which is best for avoiding disease transmission.