Loss of meow

Re: Loss of meow

Bob Russell — Tue, 23 Dec 2014 15:39:13 GMT

A good client will listen to you telling the truth. There is a small risk (just as there is for most procedures). If this was iatrogenic the damage may well sort itself out in time.

Unless you feel there may be a lesion in that area (tumour etc) isn't the risk of a further procedure greater than waiting?

Sounds like a bulls+itting client to me so I would be reluctant to encourage anything FOC! Is a non-meowing cat a problem? Has the owners suffered any real loss?

VDS are usually quite a comfort to talk to!!

Re: Loss of meow

Martin Atkinson — Tue, 23 Dec 2014 08:56:15 GMT

I read the OP again and it doesn't say loss of 'voice' rather change. If a full blown meow relies on fully functional bilateral vocal cords I guess a unilateral paralysis could cause this effect.

I have had a cat with a large unilateral parathyroid carcinoma recently which also had altered vocalisation. After very carefully excising the mass, attempting to preserve thyroid capsule and the recurrent laryngeal nerve, its full voice returned a couple of weeks later. Now if this was because the nerve was stretched or the mass was pressing on the larynx, which I didn't think it was, I'm not sure but I go for the nerve option.

Re: Loss of meow

Thomas Johnson — Tue, 23 Dec 2014 08:31:16 GMT

[quote user="ChrisBVSc"]

I've never heard of this but it's probably a good reason to avoid 'stab in the dark' sampling (rarely needed in cats anyway). I suppose a jumpy or fractious cat could bring it on itself though.

[/quote]

I remember just after I graduated being terrified by a story in the VDS newsletter about a fractious cat that died after jugular venipuncture, when the cat jumped the needle had lacerated the carotid artery...

Re: Loss of meow

ChrisBVSc — Mon, 22 Dec 2014 23:33:26 GMT

[quote user="Gillian Mostyn"]

But surely to lose the voice completely you'd need to damage both sides? No?

[/quote]

That's what I was thinking, also would you get other 'funny noises' when breathing/vocalising if you'd basically given it laryngeal paralysis?

I've never heard of this but it's probably a good reason to avoid 'stab in the dark' sampling (rarely needed in cats anyway). I suppose a jumpy or fractious cat could bring it on itself though.

Re: Loss of meow

Gillian Mostyn — Mon, 22 Dec 2014 19:22:24 GMT

But surely to lose the voice completely you'd need to damage both sides? No?

Re: Loss of meow

Martin Atkinson — Mon, 22 Dec 2014 17:26:45 GMT

I think you'd have to be very unlucky but I also suspect that someone has damaged the recurrent laryngeal nerve with repeated mis-directed needles.

Re: Loss of meow

Robin Grimmer — Sun, 21 Dec 2014 17:54:43 GMT

Speak to VDS before doing anything else, particularly before doing expensive diagnostic tests that the owner may feel they shouldn't have to pay for!

Re: Loss of meow

Glenn Hodgson — Sun, 21 Dec 2014 16:00:47 GMT

Never heard of it and taken many samples.

I have had 3 incidents I can remember of cats loosing their meeeeow and were otherwise we'll. 2 were in multicat household's and they all lost their meeeeow. must have been a bug. All got bethere but took 6-8 weeks. Some prolapsed their third eyelids a little.

I'd be keen to look down the cats throat to rule out masses and allow me to photograph the tonsillitis. Advise a second opinion and record this if rapport has broken down entirely. I would tell it as it is rather than administer FOC..

Re: Loss of meow

Andrew Kent — Sun, 21 Dec 2014 15:53:24 GMT

It's never happened to me but I have seen this described on other forums from time to time and, as others have suggested, is suspected to be due to recurrent laryngeal nerve damage after sampling. It tends to resolve but takes a few months sometimes.

if that is the case you should see abnormal laryngeal function so if you want to do any tests then examining the larynx under light anaesthesia or laryngeal ultrasound would probably be the best plan.

as others have said I would try to give as much time as possible before doing additional (especially expensive) tests.

Re: Loss of meow

Anne Seawright — Sun, 21 Dec 2014 11:38:43 GMT

There is mention in neuroanatomy texts of jugular venipuncture resulting in unilateral damage to the recurrent laryngeal nerve as it travels through the carotid sheath eg in Veterinary neuroanatomy and clinical neurology by Alexander DeLahunta. I personally would give it time and be reluctant to deny all possibility of inadvertent injury.

Re: Loss of meow

Anthony Todd — Sun, 21 Dec 2014 11:23:51 GMT

[quote user="villagevet"]Any chance of damage of recurrent laryngeal nerve close to jugular?

[/quote]

+1?

Re: Loss of meow

Joyce Whitehead — Sun, 21 Dec 2014 10:56:08 GMT

I agree I've never heard of a case like this, and would certainly want to give it at least a month to see if the voice came back without intervention before spending lots of money on investigation. As I suspect she will fight tooth and nail to avoid payment.

Re: Loss of meow

David Mills — Sun, 21 Dec 2014 01:44:50 GMT

I'd tell her to get lost (substitute something f in there) and go somewhere else - simply not worth it, in every way.

Re: Loss of meow

Lindsey Edwards — Sun, 21 Dec 2014 00:23:12 GMT

Any chance of damage of recurrent laryngeal nerve close to jugular?

Re: Loss of meow

Stephen Courtney — Sat, 20 Dec 2014 22:25:24 GMT

Be very careful spending any money on expensive procedures as it seems the client is expecting you to pay for it....

I would not do a CT ( assume you have to refer for that?) unless the client pays for it herself.

If you are doing the scoping yourself it might be worth while as a freebie to satisfy her, but it sounds like she is Mrs Awkward...not sure I'd want to go too far to appease such person.

Re: Loss of meow

Gillian Mostyn — Sat, 20 Dec 2014 19:40:51 GMT

Nope... Never heard of voice changes due to venepuncture.

Re: Loss of meow

Nicola Cole — Sat, 20 Dec 2014 19:38:35 GMT

Nope never heard of loss of miaow due to sampling. Surely more likely it's linked to whatever caused the lethargy?