acute and fatal HGE

Re: acute and fatal HGE

mariette asselbergs — Thu, 25 Sep 2014 22:25:25 GMT

I saw a 14 week old pup, one out of three, night before fine, found dead in the crate on the morning. PM showed haemorrhagic gastro-enteritis which stopped abruptly about 30 cm distal from the pyloris. Content was slimy and smelt a bit fishy. Liver and kidneys macroscopically normal, spleen mottly, lungs with some haemorrhages and a pale floppy heart without bleedings. Owner then remembered that they walked the dogs the night before in a field full of mushrooms. They took photographs and they looked like amonites which are eaten by dogs because of their fishy smell, and they are severely toxic.

I believe that the slimy content in the pup's guts was digested mushroom.

Might be worth looking into that possibility as a cause, and do a post mortem.

PS This was in the Bornmouth area, Dorset about 10 days ago.

Mariette

Re: acute and fatal HGE

Sara Ramsey — Thu, 25 Sep 2014 22:07:47 GMT

Thank you all for the replies. We have contacted other local vets and there are a couple of other parvo cases. The haematology results in both dogs didn't have significant changes that I recall. We are making some other lines of enquiries too but haven't found common threads yet. Fingers crossed for no more. lab report was negative for viruses in first case ( faecal sample I think)

Re: acute and fatal HGE

Martin Atkinson — Thu, 25 Sep 2014 11:12:10 GMT

[quote user="Cat Henstridge"]

It might be worth investing in some of these;

http://www.milainternational.com/index.php/products/fecal-management/fecal-management-system.html?___SID=U

I've been hearing good things about them recently!

[/quote]Looks like it would save a lot of cleaning up let alone reduce spread of nasty bugs bu I would just wonder how well tolerated it would be and how well they would be retained by a dog that's really straining.

How about someone inventing a doggie sick bag as well!

Re: acute and fatal HGE

Clare Tapsfield-Wright — Wed, 24 Sep 2014 18:54:57 GMT

Recent similar case in young dog suspected of being ingestion of Chinese wisteria fruit in garden , was very touch and go but recovered with supportive therapy

Re: acute and fatal HGE

Cat Henstridge — Wed, 24 Sep 2014 14:59:18 GMT

It might be worth investing in some of these;

http://www.milainternational.com/index.php/products/fecal-management/fecal-management-system.html?___SID=U

I've been hearing good things about them recently!

Re: acute and fatal HGE

Kate Richardson — Wed, 24 Sep 2014 12:30:20 GMT

Also consider bacterial causes such as salmonella/clostridia/e.coli releasing enterotoxins and causing toxic shock. Might be worth seeing if any common diets being fed? Or walking dogs in the same location? Have you done haematology on any? Any signs of neutropaenia/hypoglycaemia? If not doing already, then would also use broad spec iv antibiotics (augmentin + enroflox/marboflox + metronidazole) as well as all your supportive treatments such as aggressive fluid therapy, monitor electrolytes if you can. I recall flunixin (Finadyne) used to be used for toxic cases- or was that just in horses?

Re: acute and fatal HGE

Hannah Wynne Richards — Wed, 24 Sep 2014 10:21:51 GMT

Another who'd advise Virbagen - also if another sero neg dog dies, ask owners if you can send a bit of the gut to the lab - may be parvo but it hasn't had time to sero convert.

Wynne

Re: acute and fatal HGE

Martin Atkinson — Wed, 24 Sep 2014 09:09:35 GMT

Sounds like the picture of SCI but this is such a tentative diagnosis as to be useless. I can't see that so many dogs would suddenly start eating fungus simultaneously

Having one a parvo positive I would say it is most likely you have a CPV epidemic and the others are parvo despite the negative tests - how are you testing faeces or antibodies? If the former the virus may have been shed already and if latter they may not have sero-converted yet. Maybe its a virulent strain the old vaccine serovars cannot protect against and the old ELISA test is not picking up

I would also look a when these dogs were vaccinated: if before 10 weeks for the second shot and no 16 week back-up you may have a whole pool of immuno-compromised dogs. If so this is something I predicted years ago!!

If it is CPV you may like to try Virbagen Omega as part of your treatment protocol

Re: acute and fatal HGE

Glenn Hodgson — Wed, 24 Sep 2014 09:01:06 GMT

I have had 3 canine cases of dx severe and acute of unknown cause over 1 week. Happened 4 weeks ago, Falkirk, Scotland. All alive and well, just. One was my own dog that managed to rupture through his duodenum in 2 places, bad dog. BBloods, faecal normal. Biopsies showed ulceration and inflammation.... I suspect toxin or acute viral in these 3 cases. Most likely acute viral. no gross blood in my cases though, probably different thing.

Re: acute and fatal HGE

Kate Richardson — Wed, 24 Sep 2014 07:44:24 GMT

May be get some post mortem samples analysed from a case?

Re: acute and fatal HGE

Sara Ramsey — Wed, 24 Sep 2014 07:07:36 GMT

Update: lost another one last night: couldn't get a blood pressure despite repeated boluses, temp swinging from hypo to hyperthermic and more hemorrhagic v+ and d+ than I have ever seen. Very sad and horrible.

I have serum and faecal samples and will speak to the lab later today.

Re: acute and fatal HGE

Sara Ramsey — Tue, 23 Sep 2014 23:17:53 GMT

We are in west Yorkshire, city centre and first opinion hospital. The parvo dog was a newly registered animal that night. The dogs have had fluids, IV antibiotics, analgesia, gastro-protectants. As much as we could offer. Oddly we have some passing awful awful bloody faeces, been bright, admitted and sent home, fine the next day. I suspect these are not the same aetiology though.

Re: acute and fatal HGE

Michael Woodhouse — Tue, 23 Sep 2014 23:07:43 GMT

Not seen anything similar. Whereabouts are you in the country?

Re: acute and fatal HGE

Francisco Gomez — Tue, 23 Sep 2014 23:06:40 GMT

I'm sorry I can't help. But it would b a good idea if you tell us where are you and what sort of work you do. Ie charity? Private practice? Rural?