weird question

Re: weird question

Wren — Mon, 05 Aug 2013 09:31:14 GMT

My cat brings a mouse in pretty much every night and consumes it at the foot of my bed. She crunches up every bit except one organ which is without fail dissected out and left. I wasn't sure whether it was the stomach or caecum but it's quite large and I don't suppose mice are hindgut digesters (?) so I'm plumping for the stomach. Nice piece of dissection though!

Re: weird question

Sammy82 — Sun, 04 Aug 2013 17:52:42 GMT

He never actually brought a zebra, as we don't have any wild ones here in Scotland, and it wouldn't fit through the cat flap anyway. He is pretty awesome, but just a moggy after all.

Re: weird question

Christopher Saul — Sun, 04 Aug 2013 14:06:19 GMT

[quote user="Michael Woodhouse"]

[quote user="Sammy82"]

Just because they eat it doesn't nescessarily mean they can digest it. I don't think the grass in a zebra's stomach is much use to them but might just be some non-soluble fibre, same for feathers etc. which I find in neat little balls deposited on the carpet.

[/quote]

Sammy - that is one hell of a cat if it is bringing zebra back.

I know someone who has a cat and it regularly brings whole, live pheasants home - I thought that was impressive............

May I suggest a collar with a cow bell.........

[/quote]

Was thinking the same myself Michael. My cat will bring fairly large stuff; you know, rabbits, small goats, even the odd postman, but nothing like a Zebra!

Re: weird question

ceri stewart — Sun, 04 Aug 2013 13:25:50 GMT

[quote user="patrick murphy"]

so why are we constantly told that cats are obligate carnivores, and that their perfect diet would be mice, and mice alone? maybe the mice stomachs?

[/quote]

My cats eat the whole rodent except the stomach. They leave them on the carpet. My ferrets eat whole mice including the stomach.

Re: weird question

Richard Carter — Sun, 04 Aug 2013 11:58:37 GMT

Vaguely remembered something about predators going for the fat, not the intestines - found a link to some of the predators in South Africa.

If one thinks about fat being an excellent source of vitamins, energy etc, makes sense?http://www.landmarkfoundation.org.za/uploads/5/9/0/1/5901915/predators_on_livestock_farms_a_practical_manual_for_non_lethal_holistic_ecologically_acceptable_and_ethical_management_landmark_foundation.pdf

Re: weird question

Evelyn Barbour-Hill — Sat, 03 Aug 2013 17:41:09 GMT

Cats are obligate carnivores.

Just because they eat the guts doesn't mean they get any great nutritional benefit from the gut contents. Maybe they do, maybe they don't.

Re: weird question

patrick murphy — Sat, 03 Aug 2013 17:34:26 GMT

so why are we constantly told that cats are obligate carnivores, and that their perfect diet would be mice, and mice alone? maybe the mice stomachs?

Re: weird question

Martin Atkinson — Fri, 02 Aug 2013 20:15:59 GMT

Whenever I've watched wild carnivores consuming their kill they rip the stomach open first and eat the guts, I had always assumed that this was some instinct to get their full balance of fibre, vitamins and minerals from the vegetable matter which being part digested thus has great nutritional value which they wouldn't get from flesh and bone alone. That's why RMB is load of tosh because the advocates don't feed the whole carcass.

Re: weird question

Evelyn Barbour-Hill — Thu, 01 Aug 2013 22:59:46 GMT

[quote user="patrick murphy"]in the book, referring to say arctic wolves, she intimates that the vegetarians with multi stomachs, i.e. rumens, have broken down the fibrous, starchy stuff to a point of it being useful to the carnivores.[/quote]

Cellulose. Astonishing stuff. Bacteria can break the links but nothing in the animal kingdom can. Hence no end of symbiosis goes on with elaborate arrangements for providing for same, not to mention the many anatomical developments to provide fine division of the vegetable matter. Rumen contents of course would be not only the cellulose material but the bacterial products thereof, so digestible by a carnivore. How much that would contribute to the carnivore's nutrition is debatable.

Cellulose also allows us to make shirts out of trees (hurrah!) and to blow things up (whoopee!)

Re: weird question

patrick murphy — Thu, 01 Aug 2013 19:23:28 GMT

in the book, referring to say arctic wolves, she intimates that the vegetarians with multi stomachs, i.e. rumens, have broken down the fibrous, starchy stuff to a point of it being useful to the carnivores. goes on to say that early explorers by ignoring viscera etc. because of preconceptions etc. brought themselves to harm. interesting book.

Re: weird question

Michael Woodhouse — Thu, 01 Aug 2013 18:23:17 GMT

[quote user="Sammy82"]

[/quote]

Sammy - that is one hell of a cat if it is bringing zebra back.

I know someone who has a cat and it regularly brings whole, live pheasants home - I thought that was impressive............

May I suggest a collar with a cow bell............

Re: weird question

Sammy82 — Thu, 01 Aug 2013 18:16:42 GMT

Re: weird question

Evelyn Barbour-Hill — Thu, 01 Aug 2013 18:10:26 GMT

Felids are obligate carnivores. You only have to look at their dentition, let alone their biochemistry, to see that.

It doesn't mean they can't consume and digest whatever contents happen to be in the viscera they are eating.

Re: weird question

Sammy82 — Thu, 01 Aug 2013 18:02:15 GMT

my cats (not thaaat wild I must admit) usually eat the whole mouse, bird or rabbit, including fur, feathers and intestines. They only leave the muscle stomach of birds on a regular basis, doesn't seem to be as tasty. I would imagine the scottish wild cat doesn't behave any differently.

Re: weird question

patrick murphy — Thu, 01 Aug 2013 17:55:57 GMT

I do apologise for that and was worried re. RMB hence hiding in exotics. just that I am reading Gulp, by Mary Roach, she discusses how for evolutionary/nutritional reasons that say wolves would start on the stomach contents of their prey, as the organic/vegetation content was necessary for their survival, say the same as the order in which aboriginal peoples eat their prey. I just then wondered that we have always been taught that felids were obligate meat eaters, and on the few times I have witnessed big cats eating, it has always been flesh.

Re: weird question

Alan Tevendale — Thu, 01 Aug 2013 17:17:24 GMT

Oops!

Re: weird question

Niall Taylor — Thu, 01 Aug 2013 15:39:03 GMT

[quote user="Alan Tevendale"]

Why do you ask?

[/quote]

I think you'll find you've just blasphemed against the teachings of...

RMB!!!

Niall

Re: weird question

Alan Tevendale — Thu, 01 Aug 2013 15:08:18 GMT

Why do you ask?

Re: weird question

Alan Tevendale — Thu, 01 Aug 2013 15:06:50 GMT

I can assure you that it is quite normal for big cats to eat almost every part of their prey. Many of these parts form an important part of the normal diet.

Re: weird question

Evelyn Barbour-Hill — Thu, 01 Aug 2013 13:57:26 GMT

I'm reliably informed that tigers consume the viscera of their prey. They have been observed to consume the carcass in a set order, generally.

I've no idea about lions.