Lepto 4

Re: Lepto 4

Stephen Thompson — Wed, 31 Jul 2013 14:20:02 GMT

As far as I am aware there is still not a licence for combining with Pi but it can be combined with DHP. The majority of our clients have KC intranasally so we have stopped providing Pi as an injectable (either as DHPPi or Pi) and now only stock DHP.

Re: Lepto 4

CatherineThomas — Wed, 31 Jul 2013 10:56:09 GMT

We got sent all of the information about we should start using the L4 vaccine a few weeks ago and so we ordered some in to start. Then we were told we couldn't start yet as they were still waiting for a licence to allow it to be combined with the DHPPi and Pi vaccinations. I haven't heard anything since. Is it now safe to start using it?

When we looked at the recommended protocol including the 3 injections I think we thought that it might be due to there then being a narrow window for doing the second vaccination, ie the 2nd DHPPi being upto 4 weeks and the 2nd L4 being minimum 4 weeks.

Re: Lepto 4

Andrew Kent — Tue, 30 Jul 2013 22:19:14 GMT

[quote user="Stephen Thompson"]

Hi Emily,

We are transitioning to L4 at the moment. According to the datasheet the first dose of L4 can be given at 6-9 weeks and then repeated 4 weeks later so I am not sure why you are postponing the first vacc until 12 weeks. Our protocol is DHP/L4 +/- KC at 8 weeks, DHP at 10 weeks and L4 at 12 weeks. All adult boosters are to be offered a free 'upgrade' to L4 with a second L4 vacc given after 4 weeks. Those that do not wish to upgrade are apparantly afforded the same level of protection as the L2 vaccine from a single shot of L4 (according to the rep).

I was quite shocked to read that existing bivalent vaccines protected against only 33% of serovars identified by positive MAT results from clinical submissions to the AHVLA from 2007-2011 and feel that upgrading to more widspread protection is a good thing. We have diagnosed a few cases of lepto at our practice over the years- usually rural dogs after flooding.

[/quote] Why can you not give the DHP plus L4 together at 12 weeks as second vacc? Do people not mind visiting 3 times?

Re: Lepto 4

Stephen Thompson — Tue, 30 Jul 2013 21:41:32 GMT

Hi Emily,

Re: Lepto 4

Christina Smith — Tue, 30 Jul 2013 21:02:18 GMT

The last case of Weils disease I remember was in a farmers wife. The non-vaccinated apparently healthy collie had serology to suggest that it was the intermediate.

Re: Lepto 4

Busybee — Tue, 30 Jul 2013 20:19:40 GMT

We are about to start using it, with the aim of trying to do a 'vaccination amnesty' type scheme to encourage owners of older dogs to have the 2nd dose done.

We have had 2 confirmed lepto cases in the past 2 years - both were diagnosed with serovars that should have been covered by the L4 vaccine but not the L2 vaccine (neither dog vaccinated at all!)

There is an online CPD talk on Monday 1-2pm I believe, on the subject of Leptospirosis courtesy of MSD.

Re: Lepto 4

Bob Russell — Tue, 30 Jul 2013 09:13:37 GMT

Strange variation in attitudes between vaccine manufacturers. Zoetis apparently have an L4 vaccine in Europe but use L2 here. Apparently their blood samples do not indicate the Eastern European strains are that important here. (Rep info not vet!).

MSD obviously say it is a big problem in the UK! they cannot both be right.

I tend to agree that pyrexia + antibiotics are common and at least some are going to be lepto but the alternative is to wait for diagnosis (not easy) by which time the organism has done a lot more damage.

How many veterinary staff have picked up lepto from dogs I wonder? Cattle vets must be exposed more often and generally seem to survive into old age!!

I wonder if human infections are more of a problem because of the decrease in the cavalier attitude of most doctors to antibiotic use?

Re: Lepto 4

Tim Browning — Tue, 30 Jul 2013 08:37:25 GMT

I think the lepto vaccination is very important and not focused on enough.

Leptospirosis is probably very underdiagnosed as can present as transient pyrexia and resolves with abiocs., but can still shed. It is a public health issue for clients. It is a health and safety issue in hospitals where a suspect dog is kennelled and staff have to nurse and treat. It is a risk to me as a vet, unlike all the other diseases vaccine components prevent.

It is also a rational reason for the annual vaccination/health check with all the advantages regular attendance can bring, also unlike the other vaccine components.

If L4 gives better protection to staff, owners and dogs then it should be a major factor in vaccine choice.

Re: Lepto 4

Virginia Campbell — Mon, 29 Jul 2013 22:59:19 GMT

[quote user="Emily Herskind Nightingale"] Obviously a vaccine at 16 weeks means no socialising till at least a week after[/quote] I think they are probably more likely to get lepto from crappy old sheds and ditches than socialising with other dogs, so I'd just let them at it after DHPPi

Re: Lepto 4

Rob Loxley — Fri, 26 Jul 2013 16:21:21 GMT

And any dogs for boosters have to have a full course of 2xL4 if you read the datasheet.
If it was a direct swap with L2 we'd have fewer reservations, it just seems more faff and expense.
The only cases of lepto we've seen have been in unvaccinated farm dogs, so like Martin I think there are other bigger dog vaccination issues...

On a tangent, I am also yet to be convinced that CaniLeish is any more efficacious than Advantix at preventing Leishmania

Re: Lepto 4

Martin Atkinson — Fri, 26 Jul 2013 14:38:00 GMT

I'm not convinced this is of any benefit but admit to not having read the protocal/data. IMO they would be better updating CPV vaccines, which still use eons old serovars, to the current field viruses.