Zoopharmacognosy

Re: Zoopharmacognosy

Rob Loxley — Sun, 17 Mar 2013 11:09:45 GMT

Pica in iron deficiency?

Re: Zoopharmacognosy

Christina Smith — Sat, 16 Mar 2013 16:20:17 GMT

Animals self medicate all the time whether they get it right is open to debate.Grass seems to be the favourite one. Herbivores with mineral deficiences scavenge carcases and salt licks work a treat. We should take note of their preferences and listen to them.It won't be long before our consulting rooms are full of knowledgeable dogs confirming our diagnoses.

Re: Zoopharmacognosy

Evelyn Barbour-Hill — Thu, 07 Mar 2013 19:26:44 GMT

[quote user="Anthony Dennison"]

On a quiet afternoon I read a 'Your Cat' magazine at one of the branch practices (desperate times call for desperate measures - it was REALLY quiet). There was a story in one of them about a woman who was a healer; her cat had a femoral head fracture, had surgery and 4 weeks later went for a post op check, after 4 weeks of intense healing by holding her hands over the sore bit.... ahem

According to the healer, the vet had never seen such fast healing, it had healed '100%'.

[/quote]

Yeah it's always worth reading "Your Cat" to pick up some handy hints. Also that Leslie Moran in "Parrots" , although she's toned it down a bit lately.

Re: Zoopharmacognosy

Martin Atkinson — Thu, 07 Mar 2013 18:18:46 GMT

I also had a client with a GSD with EPI: after finally convincing them to get it of the sh1t diet they were feeding and give a suitable diet plus add pancreatic extract they went to a faith healer. She apparently held her hands over the dog and from that moment on it was cured. Probably helped that the they continued with the correct diet and Pancrex as well though!

Re: Zoopharmacognosy

Anthony Dennison — Thu, 07 Mar 2013 17:52:30 GMT

[quote user="Martin Atkinson"]

I had a client who claimed she was a faith healer. She would bring her dogs to me, I'd make a diagnosis, give her some medication then she'd go away and not comply but she 'treated them with faith'. When she was finally consigned to the nut house her relatives clearing her cupboards found hoards of the medication she'd never given. I can almost understand her belief in faith healing as bonkers and useless as it may be but it begs the question: why bother coming to me and paying for the medication when she knew best in the first place?

[/quote]

According to the healer, the vet had never seen such fast healing, it had healed '100%'.

Also, on my equine rotation at uni we had a local nutjob who's horse was admitted for a surgical colic. She was a healer, and had all her healer friends sending positive thoughts from around the world. This of course meant the wound would heal much quicker and she would be fine. The soft tissue surgeon politely told her this was bollocks. She was so impressed by our healing prowess she brought her other horse in to investigate back pain - she showed us where she could feel the heat caused by pain repeatedly, each time holding her hand over a completely different spot. Unfortunately I was never quick enough to disappear when she arrived to visit so always got lumbered with her. Proper mental.

Re: Zoopharmacognosy

Evelyn Barbour-Hill — Thu, 07 Mar 2013 13:47:37 GMT

I have several patients who trot in, jump onto the table and sit there expectantly. Clearly they have made a very discerning choice.

Re: Zoopharmacognosy

David Mills — Thu, 07 Mar 2013 12:35:10 GMT

There is some (I think) fascinating examples of self-administration of consciousness-altering drugs by animals:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/3628455

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/7261897

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/412203

etc.

I suppose the theory would be that just as animals learn how to seek food, with a little training they could be trained how to self-administer e.g. opioids when in pain according to severity etc. Fascinating idea.

Re: Zoopharmacognosy

Niall Taylor — Thu, 07 Mar 2013 12:29:34 GMT

[quote user="Tim Browning"]It's the animal that makes the diagnosis so they need to be prosecuted under VSA, if they've got animal rights they have animal responsibilities..[/quote]

Only if they're making a profit from it - if they sniff the relevant treatment and point at it they'd be ok, but if they eat it that would be construed as earnings under the VSA and they could be subject to the full penalty of the law.

Cheers,

Niall

Re: Zoopharmacognosy

Tim Browning — Thu, 07 Mar 2013 11:21:55 GMT

It's the animal that makes the diagnosis so they need to be prosecuted under VSA, if they've got animal rights they have animal responsibilities..

Re: Zoopharmacognosy

Alex Gough — Thu, 07 Mar 2013 08:40:07 GMT

Any ideas about the legality with respect to the Vet Surgeons Act? Fraud not withstanding!

Re: Zoopharmacognosy

James Laidlaw — Wed, 06 Mar 2013 20:41:40 GMT

Martin - I think people do this to assuage their guilt and can tell themselves they've at least seen someone for advice. No idea how or why their neurons fire that way though!!!

Re: Zoopharmacognosy

Martin Atkinson — Wed, 06 Mar 2013 19:22:30 GMT

Re: Zoopharmacognosy

Cat Henstridge — Wed, 06 Mar 2013 17:44:37 GMT

I once had a client, totally bonkers and completely Munchhausens obviously, who was convinced her CKCS was eating blueberries because she 'knew' they would make her better. I took bloods after she reported the dog 'wasn't right' and it had borderline (unlikely significant) liver changes. Unfortunately she grasped this as an issue and felt the dog ate the fruit because of their anti-oxidant properties were helping the liver. She was at pains to point out the dog didn't actually like the blueberries but ate a punnet a day (!) as a self medicating measure.

In the end I referred her to a medical specialist who made short shift of this idea with some comments along the line of the fact that CKCS aren't usually found running wild in the african velt and 'nutritional wisdom (which I thought was a great phrase!) wasn't found in pets!

Re: Zoopharmacognosy

Bob Russell — Wed, 06 Mar 2013 17:07:49 GMT

Charging money to not provide a diagnosis nor provide a medicine but to follow a code of practice that sounds professional but belies the lack of any medical or scientific basis behind the theory.

Sounds pretty effective though with a long name like that. What is that other 'craft'? Oh yes! Homoeopathy!!

I like the idea of a self-select 'medicinal' garden whilst sitting in a chair with a cup of coffee! My wife loves her garden so perhaps a good little sideline. Perhaps charge per hour for access to the 'magic' garden.

The gullibility of people never fails to amaze me!

Re: Zoopharmacognosy

Rob Davis — Tue, 05 Mar 2013 18:38:34 GMT

From the link: "It is essential to obtain insurance before allowing animals under the care of others to self-medicate."

Do you think the VDS will cover this? If so it seems dead easy - I just grow a load of plants and let my patients into the garden to select their own treatments while I drink coffee with my feet up...