odontoclastic lesions in cats

Re: odontoclastic lesions in cats

Bob Russell — Mon, 22 Oct 2012 14:33:45 GMT

[quote user="Evelyn Barbour-Hill"]

[quote user="Bob Russell"]

Yes it is an automatic processor but only costs about £300!

[/quote]

What's the make? I'm sure it will serve very well.

Don't forget the running costs............

[/quote]

Many identical units on E bay direct from China. We are talking to Photon Imaging to get a digital system demonstrated. I am not sure it will be that easy to justify financially with our throughput at the moment.

Item number 200594982953 is one example. There may be import taxes to add.

Re: odontoclastic lesions in cats

Evelyn Barbour-Hill — Mon, 22 Oct 2012 13:13:22 GMT

[quote user="Bob Russell"]

Yes it is an automatic processor but only costs about £300!

[/quote]

What's the make? I'm sure it will serve very well.

Don't forget the running costs............

Re: odontoclastic lesions in cats

Bob Russell — Mon, 22 Oct 2012 09:49:54 GMT

Yes it is an automatic processor but only costs about £300!

Re: odontoclastic lesions in cats

Evelyn Barbour-Hill — Sat, 20 Oct 2012 14:35:24 GMT

[quote user="Neil Wheadon"]

I've been told that if you have a cat with a odontoclastic / neck lesions, then present day thinking is that you snap the crown of and try to pull the gum across. The root will then resorb.

Is this true?

[/quote]

Jeez, no.

Who said that? Tell me where he lives and I'll send the boys round.

[quote user="Bob Russell"]Slightly sideways post but does anyone have one of these and are they any good?[/quote]

Dunno, mate, what is it?

Seriously: I don't recognise the make but it looks like an automatic processor. I'm sure it will do the job very well.

But.... you're still messing about with chemicals and cleaning and maintenance, and waiting for films to chunter through and then squinting at them on a viewer..........

Maybe now is the time to take the plunge and go digital?

Re: odontoclastic lesions in cats

Bob Russell — Sat, 20 Oct 2012 11:00:17 GMT

Slightly sideways post but does anyone have one of these and are they any good? Our processor is getting very 'clunky'!

Re: odontoclastic lesions in cats

Neil Wheadon — Sat, 20 Oct 2012 10:47:36 GMT

[quote user="Rachel Perry"]What is hugely relevant clinically is whether it is a type 1 or type 2 lesion, which you can only determing by radiography.[/quote]

Thankyou

Explained beautifully

Neil

Re: odontoclastic lesions in cats

Dagmar Steele — Sat, 20 Oct 2012 10:05:59 GMT

[quote user="Neil Wheadon"]

One of the joys of locum work is that you get all sorts of different opinions

I've been told that if you have a cat with a odontoclastic / neck lesions, then present day thinking is that you snap the crown of and try to pull the gum across. The root will then resorb.

Is this true? as there are more dental specialists on this site than you can shake an elevator at, at the moment.

Neil

[/quote]

This depends on the kind of lesions they are, there are type one and type two lesions, you'll need x-rays to distinguish between them. Then you can decide wether you have to take the whole tooth out with the root and make sure there's no remainders left or if it is ok to snap the crown. At least this is what I've been told by the German teeth gurus :-) Evelyn surely will be more eloquent in explaining I'm sure :-)

Re: odontoclastic lesions in cats

Rachel Perry — Sat, 20 Oct 2012 09:24:47 GMT

[quote user="Neil Wheadon"]

there are more dental specialists on this site than you can shake an elevator at, at the moment.

[/quote]

That's because everyone is asking dental qeustions. Although I'm not quite sure how a rabbit ingesting a bin bag digressed into dentistry by celebrity vets..

[quote user="Neil Wheadon"]

I've been told that if you have a cat with a odontoclastic / neck lesions, then present day thinking is that you snap the crown of and try to pull the gum across. The root will then resorb.

[/quote]

Current terminology is under debate with Europeans favouring Feline Odoontoclastic Resorptive Lesions (FORL) and Americans favouring Tooth Resorption (TR). Either way we know what you mean, well sort of, as there are two types of resorption. A good pictorial guide can be found at:

http://www.avdc.org/nomenclature.html#resorption

There are five stages, but this just tells you how far the resorption has advanced into the tooth, and not that useful clinically. What is hugely relevant clinically is whether it is a type 1 or type 2 lesion, which you can only determing by radiography.

Type 1

Often associated with an inflammatory process such as periodontal disease. You can identify all the periodontal ligament all the way round the tooth roots, the radiographic density of the root stays similar to surrounding bone. These teeth must be extracted in their entirety. You can chose a closed or surgical extraction technique, but bear in mind the root is weakend by the resorptive process so a surgical techanique is likley to be easier as you are more likely to break the root with a closed technique then have to transfer to a surgical technique to retrieve it.

Type 2

These are undergoing replacement resorption and ankylosis. This means the periodontal ligament is lost, the tooth substance is 'replaced' by bone and thus the tooth becomes ankylosed to surrounding bone. A crown amputation may be performed on these given certain criteria are met. This must not be performed in gingivostomatitis cases, or in cats with Felv/FIV, there must be no evidence of periapical lucency (ie root abscess) and ideally there should be no evidence of a pulp space.

You would do this via an envelope flap, raising the gingiva/mucosa slighky so you can close it across the amputation site without tension. The crown is amputated just below the level of the alveolar margin, and smoothed with a diamond bur. They must be covered in gingiva and if you've ever tried to pull the gingiva across an extraction site you will know it's impossible if you haven't released it from underlying bone first.

These lesions are so common in cats, so this is why many/most/all veterinary dentists would say you cannot practice feline dentistry without radiography.

Re: odontoclastic lesions in cats

Stephen Courtney — Sat, 20 Oct 2012 08:43:32 GMT

Crown amputation is indicated if the roots have resorbed, if not then you should perform a proper extraction.

Of course this implies access to dental radiography which is currently limited. However the equipment is relatively cheap and more practices are equipping themselves with it. Given that in human dentistry failure to take pre operative radiographs would be considered negligent in this day and age there is a certain quandary here. I don't have dental radiography at my branch but three larger branches do have it. I let the client know this, and after discussing the implications ( cats particularly) send the case to a colleague with the right equipment or go ahead and do the best job I can.

I would not dream of doing a full mouth extractions ina gingivostomatitis case without radiographs though. If those are not done properly in the first place, the results are poor, which has massive welfare implications for the cat's future.

Re: odontoclastic lesions in cats

James Laidlaw — Sat, 20 Oct 2012 01:19:18 GMT

Sounds brutal... I think if you can radiograph and show the roots have resorbed (no longer able to see a nice periodontal ligament area around the root) then you can amputate the crown. Don't think you're meant to just snap them off.