human recombinant erythropoietin and laurabolin for CRF cats

Re: human recombinant erythropoietin and laurabolin for CRF cats

scatty — Wed, 25 Jul 2012 17:07:22 GMT

Hi,

Very interesting post - thank you for your input everyone. Also thanks David and Rajat for the links. I don't think I will be putting much faith in laurabolin anymore unless I just want a quick anabolic effect! Useful information about erythropoeitin preparations - I will bear that in mind. Many thanks

Re: human recombinant erythropoietin and laurabolin for CRF cats

Martin Atkinson — Mon, 23 Jul 2012 15:18:45 GMT

IME anabolic steroids have a beneficial effect on sarcopenic old cats they seem to stimulate the appetite and slow weight loss/give some weight gain which is not surprising as they are....erm anabolic. I've also had good success with EPO alpha (Epoetin) with little evidence loss of efficacy which would indicate antibody formation.

Re: human recombinant erythropoietin and laurabolin for CRF cats

Rajat — Mon, 23 Jul 2012 11:24:33 GMT

Hi Scatty

Laurabolin is generally not recommended due to lack of evidence in feline CRF and the very long time needed to show supposed benefit. I have never used it but have seen it used by other vets and can't say I have seen any benefits seeing these cases. I think cats with CRF put on weight when they feel less nauseous, and have their 2' problems (such as hydration pyelonephritis uraemic gastritis) under control (if possible) so I prefer to try therapies aimed at this rather than anabolic steroids.

Re rH-EPO - try darbopoeitin, it engenders far less antibody reactions. The info I have suggests 20%-70% will develop clinically significant anaemia in response to rH-EPO and transfusions may be needed for 2-12 months but upto 100% will have antibodies against it. So I havent used this product and use only darbopoeitin.

Link to a proceedings with good info on anaemia of CKD -

https://docs.google.com/open?id=1dd2ApUndzV38bAstz0N3K0QzcBQP5kT9aA8Qbcfd4U1FJtpGqoEsPTrzqqfg

Best

Raj

Re: human recombinant erythropoietin and laurabolin for CRF cats

David Mills — Sun, 22 Jul 2012 13:29:43 GMT

Nandrolone: no evidence whatsoever in veterinary patients. There is some in human literature but it has been largely superseded by EPO. Conflicting reports whether combination of both reduced anaemia. Anecdontal/non-standardised postulated increase in physical activity, no convincing evidence of stimulating appetite.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16281962

I always think a great test in these patients would be to run a very simple single-blinded prospective trial with placebo and laurabolin and ask owners any effect after 6 weeks, and to run PCV before and after. I think the results would be that both placebo and laurabolin were equally as effective in the owners' eyes, and I suspect there would be no influence on PCV.

Re: human recombinant erythropoietin and laurabolin for CRF cats

Rob Loxley — Sun, 22 Jul 2012 13:07:39 GMT

[quote user="scatty"]Due to the risks of adverse reactions in a proportion of cats who develop antibodies to the compound necessitating a lifetime of blood transfusions[/quote]

I'm not sure I get this. Surely if they develop antibodies to the human EPO then it doesn't work and you're just back where you started, no worse. Equally that's why I'd tend to reserve it for cases showing clinical symptoms - though that's always a little hard to determine...

Ref Laurabolin; how many people have seen hepatotoxicity in cats?