Methadone

Re: Methadone

Noweia — Wed, 04 Feb 2015 18:56:22 GMT

We used to use Dom and Torb, but are trialling Domitor and Comfortan.

Re: Methadone

Matt Gurney — Wed, 04 Feb 2015 12:10:00 GMT

Is the addition of Domitor a new thing too or is the only recent change the methadone?

Re: Methadone

Linda Filshie — Wed, 04 Feb 2015 07:43:40 GMT

Not used it with domitor - when I use methadone for a premed its with acp, so acp at standard dose (10-50micrograms/kg) and comfortan generally at 0.3mg/kg, which works well.

Re: Methadone

Noweia — Tue, 03 Feb 2015 23:13:36 GMT

Bumping this again rather than starting a new thread!

We have recently trialled Comfortan instead of Torb, along with Domitor for our anaesthetic premeds. We are having trouble with the anaesthetics, and animals are getting VERY light with little warning. Currently using 0.02ml/kg Comfortan and 0.02ml/kg Domitor. Anyone any thoughts? What doses are everyone else using?

Re: Methadone

Matt Gurney — Mon, 03 Jun 2013 13:48:09 GMT

What dose did you use?

Re: Methadone

Hanna Bennett — Thu, 30 May 2013 20:49:04 GMT

0.5 mg/kg is the licensed dose but generally agreed to be quite high - we use 0.2-0.3mg/kg q 2-4 hrs prn and find we get good analgesia. personally i really like it s/c with premed doses of domitor for those nervous dogs who an i/m injection is just too much - leave them with the owners for 10-15 mins and they tend to be amenable.

Re: Methadone

Clair Firth — Thu, 30 May 2013 16:34:16 GMT

[quote user="Michael Woodhouse"]

Never thought of methadone to a calf, but we do have an extra dimension of the cascade in food producing animals.

It is one beauty of Europe meddling that as horses are now food producing animals we have a greater number of products available, eg butorphanol. Saw a rep the other day who tells me there is a ketamine going through for a cattle licence.

[/quote]

Ketamine is licensed for use in cattle in Austria (and presumably Germany too, Austria is usually too small to get a license on its own!!). We use it regularly at uni combined with xylazine. Withdrawal period 0 days (meat and milk)

Re: Methadone

james hunt — Thu, 30 May 2013 15:05:40 GMT

We've just had a paper accepted for publication in JSAP comparing 0.5mg/kg methadone to 0.02 mg/kg buprenorphine, in conjunction with ACP and meloxicam, for premedication prior to anaesthesia for orthopaedic surgery in 38 dogs. Fewer dogs in the methadone group (approx 40% compared to 80%) required additional analgesia within 5 hours of premedication (when a second dose of opioid was scheduled to be given).

No significant differences in sedation were detected between groups, contrary to my expectation

Re: Methadone

Michael Woodhouse — Thu, 30 May 2013 08:27:09 GMT

[quote user="karen jones"]I was slightly thrown the other day when asked by 4 th year London student if I was going to give the calf I'd just cast a fractured leg, a dose of methadone. As we don't have any for small animals I replied no , just metacam but we did have a discussion about different painkillers and finances of farm animals over dogs and cats

[/quote]

Never thought of methadone to a calf, but we do have an extra dimension of the cascade in food producing animals.

Re: Methadone

karen jones — Thu, 30 May 2013 08:09:04 GMT

I was slightly thrown the other day when asked by 4 th year London student if I was going to give the calf I'd just cast a fractured leg, a dose of methadone. As we don't have any for small animals I replied no , just metacam but we did have a discussion about different painkillers and finances of farm animals over dogs and cats

Re: Methadone

Bob Russell — Wed, 29 May 2013 16:01:08 GMT

Many thanks!

We were using the lowest data sheet dose because that is what was recommended at the recent Dechra CPD. They were suggesting even lower dose rates!

We will try again!

Re: Methadone

Mark Holmes — Wed, 29 May 2013 15:50:09 GMT

I am using more 0.5 mg/kg methadone and 0.1ml/10kg medetomidine. IM or IV. Most spays can be maintained at 1-1.5 % Iso after induction but they also get 1mg/kg ketamine im whilst being clipped

Re: Methadone

Malcolm Ness — Wed, 29 May 2013 15:02:27 GMT

We use (I think) 0.2mg/kg meth and ACP at std rate. Two syringes; IM and good to anaesthetise in 15 minutes.

Re: Methadone

James Laidlaw — Wed, 29 May 2013 15:01:05 GMT

0.1-0.3 mg/kg - I think IM - haven't used for a while as it hasn't been in stock. Most of the time we were using the higher end of this dosing.

And I THINK (again, not used in a while) we were giving in the same syringe, but assume this is unlikely to be any more licensed with other drugs as vetergesic (or your choice of buprenorphine) and acp are.

Re: Methadone

Bob Russell — Wed, 29 May 2013 14:46:43 GMT

Would one (or more!) of those using it happily state the exact dose rate, route of administration and timing they are using so we can check our procedure? Has anyone mixed it with ACP in the same syringe?

We went back to our buprenorphine/ACP this morning!

Re: Methadone

James Laidlaw — Wed, 29 May 2013 14:40:23 GMT

[quote user="Bob Russell"]

Pre-med dose but had to add post op. We do this quite regularly where we feel it is appropriate whatever combination we use.

[/quote]

We are (when available) using this for all our bigger ops (bitch spays and up) and I must admit I was skeptical at first. I do think that the pre op dosing and a second injection 4 hours after premed post op seems to make patients more comfortable when they go home. I'm keen to stick with it.

Re: Methadone

bob lehner — Wed, 29 May 2013 14:29:26 GMT

[quote user="Utlendigur"]'ve not tried methadone in cats as it's not licensed a[/quote]

Comfortan is now licensed for cats.

Re: Methadone

Bob Russell — Wed, 29 May 2013 13:02:56 GMT

Pre-med dose but had to add post op. We do this quite regularly where we feel it is appropriate whatever combination we use.

Re: Methadone

James Laidlaw — Wed, 29 May 2013 12:20:23 GMT

Did you just give a premed dose, or follow up after 4-6 hours with repeat dose post op?

Re: Methadone

Bob Russell — Wed, 29 May 2013 12:04:14 GMT

[quote user="Mark Hedberg"]

I'd blame the ACP, to be honest.

[/quote]

ACP doses unchanged. We rarely have pre-med issues so are a bit disappointed that the results were not at least as good as with buprenorphine! Injections were i/m.

Re: Methadone

Mark Holmes — Wed, 29 May 2013 12:02:47 GMT

If you read the literature on it uptake from sub cut injection is variable and can take an hour (when it has been used sc I have had a similar experience) I generally go iv (5mins) or im (15mins) pre op. Much prefer medetomidine to ACP as well.

Re: Methadone

Mark Hedberg — Wed, 29 May 2013 11:52:20 GMT

I'd blame the ACP, to be honest.

Re: Methadone

Bob Russell — Wed, 29 May 2013 11:40:07 GMT

Waking up an old thread rather than start a new one!

Following some Dechra CPD I decided to give Comfortan/ACP a go but have been singularly unimpressed with it compared to Buprenorphine/ACP. What doses/route of administration and timing pre-surgery are those using in practices where it is routine? Can they be mixed in the same syringe?

I was expecting things to be 'better' with it but found the patients less 'comfortable' , more ups and downs during anaesthesia and less comfortable on recovery. I did have some wimps to operate on but that is not unusual!

Re: Methadone

Bob Russell — Tue, 30 Oct 2012 17:07:28 GMT

I wonder if this was an idiosyncratic reaction to the ACP. The same dose can cause quite a variety of levels of 'dopiness'.

Re: Methadone

Robin Grimmer — Tue, 30 Oct 2012 10:15:44 GMT

Thanks for your help guys. She was quite dopey last night but is fine this morning! I had a bit of a sleepless night last night worrying about her.